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The Eternal War Competition Signup

Discussion in 'Civ2 - General Discussions' started by Prof. Garfield, Jun 12, 2012.

?

Are you joining this competition?

  1. Yes, I plan to join this competition.

    15.2%
  2. I'm not joining, but I did find this poll.

    52.4%
  3. I just wanted to vote in a poll.

    32.3%
  1. Prof. Garfield

    Prof. Garfield Chieftain

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    EDIT: Get the game here.

    A game of Civilization 2 played by a Reddit user named Lycerius has caused a lot of interest. This Thread is a more direct discussion. Many people have expressed interest in playing out the game and trying to break the stalemate described. Lycerius has indicated that he will upload a saved game.

    Pending approval by the forum moderator Magic Gorter, we plan to organize the playing of this game as Game of the Month 136 (GOTM 136). Our hope is to create an "official" ranking of the attempts at winning this game, as well as a method of certifying that games were played without cheating.

    If you are interested in playing in this competition, please vote in the poll. This will allow us to gauge how much interest there is in this competition beyond the semi-regular GOTM participants. This may impact decisions made by the Administration Committee (or if we even need one).

    If you are interested in being a part of the Administration Committee, please make a post indicating so. Membership on this committee is limited to active participants in the Civ 2 community, including those who were active in the past. If you are a "returning" member interested in helping out for this project, please include a few links to threads that demonstrate your participation.

    Actual Committee discussion will take place in the GOTM forum.
     
  2. Ali Ardavan

    Ali Ardavan Mathematician Moderator Civ2 GOTM Staff

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    As said before, count me in.

    Thanks for taking the lead on this one.
     
  3. Prof. Garfield

    Prof. Garfield Chieftain

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    Excellent.

    I should mention that I'll be out of town from Thursday through Saturday (I'm graduating University), and may not have access to the internet during that time.

    By the way, this Reddit post mentions that we're running the competition. Any Reddit users might want to up vote it.
     
  4. the oob

    the oob Retired PTBS host

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    I have never played a GOTM before, this will be my first.
     
  5. Matrix

    Matrix Chieftain Retired Moderator

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    Aye!

    Once more unto the breach, dear friends...
     
  6. vktj

    vktj Chieftain

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    Here's a thought: Should going fundamentalist be forbidden in this contest? I know the person who has been playing this game for 10 years refuses to go fundie as a matter of some kind of principle.
     
  7. the oob

    the oob Retired PTBS host

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    Ok I loaded it up, only to realize I really CBF doing this haha, instead I think I'll just spectate, I'm sure some clever solution will end up on Youtube at some point.

    Buuuut here's what I was thinking of doing if anyone wants ideas:
    1) Make lots of paratroops
    2) Take city with paratroops. They can't be nuked on the way there because they paradrop.
    3) Once you have the enemy city, use starvation to get it down to 1 pop, and then gold rush a settler to remove that 1 pop. Thus, no more city, so it can't be retaken.

    Of course, this doesn't stop the AI building more cities :(, and I don't remember the Civ 2 rules well enough to know if you can do what I've just described.
     
  8. Magic_gorter

    Magic_gorter Moderator Moderator Civ2 GOTM Staff

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    It's a good idea to play this game (as GOTM). It would be great if you (and perhaps some others) could help me with checking the results and the organisation. It gives me more free time to play this game. It's ok to start earlier but it should be clear to all which rules are allowed/disallowed for this game and when the game should be submitted. As you mentioned saving as a scenario might be wise.... Further comments I will place in the GOTM section...
     
  9. Mark the Bold

    Mark the Bold Chieftain

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    Pure awesomeness.

    I just read about this on uber-blogger Andrew Sullivan's blog, so its definitely getting worldwide attention.
     
  10. ILLokano

    ILLokano Chieftain

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    I haven't played Civ II in years and haven't played any form of Civ since last year when my uncle increased the RAM of my computer to 2 GB but didn't know he took out the old video card with one that won't let me play Civ IV BtS and that was 6 months ago or so. Reading the article and I was like "I have to get in on this asap!" and now here I am, somewhat of a veteran of the series but complete nub because this will be the first GOTM I will be participating in mostly because of how bleak the scenario is(I am quite the idealist if I do say so myself) and that my computer right now can only play Civ II till I get the money to buy a new and up-to-date video card. I surely will enjoy this. One more question: Where is the save.file btw?Nm, I found it on the reddit subthread:hammer2:
     
  11. ILLokano

    ILLokano Chieftain

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    I haven't been excited for Civilization in at least the last couple of years!! Ironic, that I am elated over a scenario of a dystopia on such a prodigious scale.
     
  12. Major Advantage

    Major Advantage Chieftain

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    I'm sure in! But I don't think (and really hope!) that I will have time to start playing a focused game until the EURO is over.
    (Not the currency, the football tournament! ;))
     
  13. Specialist290

    Specialist290 Terracotta Statue Man

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    Put me down as a tentative participant, conditional on whether or not I can actually get around to making Civ2 run on my laptop.

    Fortunately, I've already checked out the Tech Support subforum, so I mostly know what I have to do.
     
  14. Ali Ardavan

    Ali Ardavan Mathematician Moderator Civ2 GOTM Staff

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    Wow, it is unbelievable how much interest this game has generated.

    Lycerius has put up his save file on Reddit. We are currently working on turning it into a competition. (The main problem is that the date prevents the game from keeping score.) Within a few days we will have the competition ready. It will be GOTM 136 and will be announced here and in the GOTM forum.
     
  15. Ali Ardavan

    Ali Ardavan Mathematician Moderator Civ2 GOTM Staff

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    I opened the Lycerius save and made some observations. Here is a summary:

    Warlord difficulty

    Besides the 3 superpowers, the Sioux are also in the game. Despite what Lycerius said, Americans are an enthusiastic ally of Celts (human player). Vikings are at war with both.

    Celt power is supreme.

    Cities: Celts 61, Vikings 39, Americans 31, Sioux ?
    Units: Celts 137, Vikings 260, Americans 377, Sioux ?
    Gold: Celts 6k, Vikings 4k, Americans 23k, Sioux ?

    Land of the world: a couple of grasslands, plenty of swamps, some jungles, hills, mountains, tundra, and glacier. There are still several uninhabited islands and a few uninhabited regions of larger islands (mostly in the north).

    Wonders of the world: all built; Shakespeare and Liberty lost.

    Celtic military infrastructure: 7 SDI, 11 SAM, 3 Coastal fortress, 5 Airport, 5 port facilities, 5 barracks.
     
  16. Ralgar

    Ralgar Chieftain

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    The Sioux have in 3991 AD four cities with really small sizes (around 2-3). They are also at war with the Vikings and all production is killed by maintenance of the circa 10 military units. But the Sioux have ca 2000 Gold which can help a lot in rush buying.
     
  17. Skafsgaard

    Skafsgaard Chieftain

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    The GOTM should have you playing the Sioux instead of the Celts.
     
  18. WillowBrook

    WillowBrook Lurker

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    Wow - this makes me really tempted to try it, although I haven't played Civ II for over 10 years. Chances are pretty low that I actually will, so I voted 'no' in the poll.
     
  19. Ali Ardavan

    Ali Ardavan Mathematician Moderator Civ2 GOTM Staff

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    Interesting idea. Keep them coming. I also thought about changing the difficulty from warlord to Emperor.
     
  20. Jack_www

    Jack_www Chieftain

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    It has been awhile since I have been on this forum or played civ. But after seeing the story I wanted to get the save game and see if I could do any better. I am not sure if I will enter the GOM but I have started playing it on my own.
     
  21. Ali Ardavan

    Ali Ardavan Mathematician Moderator Civ2 GOTM Staff

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    If you have been around here before and partook in GOTMs in the past, you will definitely be able to do better than Lycerius. While his perseverance is admirable, his Civ2 playing skills are very elementary to say the least.

    The real question is how much better? And that is what the GOTM competition is all about.
     
  22. flp_ndrox

    flp_ndrox Chieftain

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    I haven't submitted a Civ2 GOTM since GOTM 20, I think, but I'll be back for this one. I'm not great at Civ2, and didn't consider myself up to par against the regulars, but how can I NOT come back for this.

    -edit-

    OR NOT. Dang it! Can't get my the CD drive on my old compy working to reinstall Civ II. No work arounds I know of on 32bit Vista like the computer I have now (don't laugh, it's paid for). Good luck to the rest of you lucky so & so's =D
     
  23. Jack_www

    Jack_www Chieftain

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    I agree, I have not played CivII for over 10 years, I think the last time was when I was in high school. I have made pretty good progress in the game I started and I am 50 turns in. Anyone who has played Civ II for any length of time and knows how the AI works can turn things around easily.
     
  24. Ali Ardavan

    Ali Ardavan Mathematician Moderator Civ2 GOTM Staff

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  25. Spoonwood

    Spoonwood Grand Philosopher

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    This link doesn't work at present. The link is here. I haven't played civ II in a while, and I never developed my skills to the point of the better players on this forum for sure... and still haven't figured out the logistics of getting it to run on my Windows 7 machine. I haven't looked at the save, but from what I recall of some screenshots, Lycerius didn't use the ICS, correct?

    1. Would Lycerius's game have gone more smoothly and not even got close to this point, even with his playing style, had he used ICS spacing from the beginning?

    2. Does this whole thing with the seemingly widespread media attention here seem blown out of proportion? I mean, some of the comments by skilled, experienced civ II players seem to indicate that they wouldn't get all too excited about his game for various reasons... I mean yes they would have interest in seeing his game and helping him, of course... but they probably have some other legendary games they think more interesting for various reasons... especially if they hadn't have known about how long he struggled with it and how a stalemate occurred with Lycerius's tactics. Would the internet journalists have done better to consult some of these experienced civ II players first? Or does the extra publicity matter more than anything else?
     
  26. Ali Ardavan

    Ali Ardavan Mathematician Moderator Civ2 GOTM Staff

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    Thanks for the correction. I am not sure what happened. I copy pasted from the other response I made and that one works.
    There is no way to tell. Many cities have been destroyed over time, including two holding wonders.
    As I mentioned earlier on the fourm, in one of his comments on Redditt, Lycerius says that he believes playing at levels above King is all but unplayable (his posted game is at Warlord level). That is a clear indication that his knowledge of Civ2 was elementary and immature. ICS is irrelevant; had he read the manual completely and applied the knowledge gained, his game would not have gotten to this point. If you play poorly, ICS is not much help.
    You are right on evey count. We have played some legendary games in the GOTM forum and the current one (GOTM 135) I believe is going to be among them. But as you correctly mentioned at the end, publicity matters. A lot of people including experienced players are excited about this. There is something about the fact that he played this for ten years that has struck a chord with everyone familiar with the game.
     
  27. mackerel

    mackerel Chieftain

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    Publicity is more important in this case. Ten years of anything is remarkable, ten years in a game three generations out of date says a lot about both the guy and the game. It hardly matters that Lycerius has been making elementary mistakes all along; he's been living a future all sane people fear, a world of uncontrollable horrors we can only struggle against, never prevail upon.

    Somebody ran the game with the computer in control of the Celts, and the Americans wiped them out in 50 years. Lycerius could have done much worse. That said, I'd be shocked if at least one of the experts here couldn't clean up the whole mess in 20 turns. See you in the GOTM!
     
  28. Prof. Garfield

    Prof. Garfield Chieftain

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    The newsworthy aspect of this whole thing is the Reddit response (and, now, that it is actually newsworthy). Civ 2 simulates some things well, some things not so well, and some things badly. Civ 2 isn't a climate simulator, nor can it simulate the future very well because technology stops progressing -- so the results of this game give little or no insight to a potential reality. That said, describing a world like that makes for an interesting story compared to simply stating that an old game has generated a large response.

    If you are looking for simulation and dedication in the civ 2 community, I would say that the Play by Email community (now located mostly on the German civ forum) is the place to look. Several people commit years to playing these games, and there has been lots of work put into making fantastic scenarios.

    In the end, without the quantity of publicity, we'd be playing Lycerius' save on Emperor level in a few months time, if we even made it a GOTM at all.
     
  29. bhavv

    bhavv Glorious World Dictator

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    From reading the game description, I dont get how the state of the game can be as 'unwinnable' as it is described, especially when its only on Warlord difficulty.

    SDIs in Civ II completely nullify nuke attacks, on the higher difficulties the AI would get these built very quickly, making a nuclear wipeout very unfeasible.

    I would like to download the save game though, but where is it?
     
  30. Magic_gorter

    Magic_gorter Moderator Moderator Civ2 GOTM Staff

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