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The Gang of Four - FRFR Redux

Discussion in 'Civ3 - Succession Games' started by Sir Bugsy, Jan 23, 2004.

  1. Sir Bugsy

    Sir Bugsy Civ.D.

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    A little over a year ago now, Sirian and Charis started a game entitled “Finally Ready for Regent,” which can be found HERE

    While they have never completed the game, the four of us thought we would take up the challenge that they set for themselves and play it on C3C.

    The basic rules are:

    * Workers may not build tile improvements: no mines, no irrigation, no roads. (No railroads).
    * Clearing jungle, forest, pollution is OK. Planting forests is OK.
    * Building forts, outposts, radar towers, airfields is OK.
    * Our cities may never make use of improved tiles. If we come into control of improved lands, we must pillage the tiles before we may use them.
    * We are not allowed to sign Right of Passage agreements.
    * No colonies.
    * No exploits – LK rules

    LK Rules (plagiarized directly from LKendter):
    The following tactics are PROHIBITED:

    RoP Rape - if you have to ask...

    RoP Abuse that includes things such as irrigating all tiles with a city building wonders, denying resources with a RoP, putting a unit to block a land bridge, etc.

    Scout resource denial - parking a scout on a resource, as the AI won't ask scouts to leave. The same scenario also applies to workers.

    False Peace Treaties (must wait for the 20 years to end).

    The negative science exploit - you can run a huge deficit (-250 / turn) of negative cash with a token penalty of one lost worker / cheap building. If cash will go below zero, the research level must be dropped.

    Ship chaining exploit - you can move a ship, unload troops to another ship, move that ship, etc. This allows you to ship an indefinite distance, and that is why I consider it an exploit.

    Resources disconnect / connect exploit - I consider most resource tactics fine. Delaying to hook a resource, trading it away etc is fine. The exploit is to do this every turn. Build a stack of horses, connect saltpeter, upgrade to cavalry, and disconnect.

    Palace Jump - You abandon the capital city to move the palace to a new location. If you want to move the palace, build a new palace.

    Game basics:

    Civ: Vikings (new characteristics: Seafaring & Militaristic)
    Level: Regent
    Opponents: random
    Map type: Archipelago (70% water)
    Map size: standard
    All other settings: Random
    All standard victory conditions enabled.
    Random seed used: gangof4
    Normal AI agression
    Respawn off.
    Patch 1.15

    Here's the start:



    The SAVE @ 4000 BC

    The Gang of Four:
    Gengis
    Stapel
    Bugs
    Gorm
    mad-bax

    [Edit: I know, that's five players now, but we're taking a punk approach to this game]

    Plus The Gang of Four were a pretty cool band from my youth.

    Gengis will play the first 20-30 turns depending on how he feels it is going. Stapel can play 10-20 turns with his discretion as well. From there on out it will be 10 turns per player.

    [Edit - Added LK Rules for the uninitiated]
     
  2. Gengis Khan

    Gengis Khan Deity

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    Sweet start! Too bad there's no bonus food, but I guess thats asking for a little much. The river was almost mandatory, I dont think we'd be able to make due without it(the idea of haveing a 5 pop city producing 3 gpt doesn't sit well with me;) )

    I'll most likely start this one off in the morning at some point, to give everyone a chance to chime in with their suggestions.

    Refresh my memory, what tech do seafairing Civ's start with?? Pottery i beleive but I'm not sure.

    Personally, I think we should research BW first, pump out a quick settler or two while its being researched, then start on the Collossus. That double income with all those river tiles will really help out.

    After that make a be-line for either Lit(for the GL) or Phil(for the free tech), we'll be able to get one or the other hopefully.

    Also, is that a BG our settler is standing on?
     
  3. barbslinger

    barbslinger Gun blast'n shot drinker

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    Looking at my online index Scandinavia is the X option.

     
  4. Gengis Khan

    Gengis Khan Deity

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    Wow! Nice chart!
     
  5. gormdragan

    gormdragan King

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    I am ready!!! :D
     
  6. Stapel

    Stapel FIAT 850 coupé

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    Get it going GK! Sounds ok!
     
  7. Sir Bugsy

    Sir Bugsy Civ.D.

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    I'm going to keep my mouth shut until Gengis has played since I walked around a little to make sure it was a reasonable start.

    When I saw the gems I thought... very cool .... oh, yeah, we can't connect them :(
     
  8. Affirmative

    Affirmative Man with a Mission

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    :eek:

    Have, uh, fun guys. Show your skills. :)
     
  9. Gengis Khan

    Gengis Khan Deity

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    Skills?? :rotfl: I think we're biting off a bit more then we can chew with this one, to say the least. It'll definatly be intresting though, thats for sure.

    Anyone else have anything to say about my proposed research path?? I also plan to move that settler if it turns out that he's standing on a BG. I'll wait a couple hours, then give it a go if noone adds anything.
     
  10. gormdragan

    gormdragan King

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    I think the key research for us is mapmaking. With harbor and settled coast resource, that would be the only way to link to all our troops.
     
  11. Stapel

    Stapel FIAT 850 coupé

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    Good point! My idea: alpha, writing, philo and MM as free tech. Shouldn't be too much of a problem I think on regent level. Please note that I say this, while having exactly zero experience on regent level...

    We can start a pre build for the Colossus and hope for a tech-trade or two.
     
  12. mad-bax

    mad-bax Deity GOTM Staff

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    /delurk

    I guess it would be a good idea to have a coastal capital, with as many cities on the coast with harbours as possible so that you have some semblance of a trade network. When you get flight things will improve :rolleyes:

    It looks like a really difficult variant. I wish I could have joined it.

    /relurk

    EDIT: I can't see pictures at work, so I couldn't see the start.
     
  13. Sir Bugsy

    Sir Bugsy Civ.D.

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    I think you might be over-estimating the amount of money and shields we're going to be making. Building any wonders is going to be extremely difficult, especially when we make less than 10 spt.

    The money is going to effect our research rate. I'd be shocked if we're first to Philo.

    If we're going to go for a wonder, we may want to build in our second city. Reason: we can switch over to a Palace pre-build if we lose out on a wonder.

    As a seafaring civ, don't we get some kind of very early vessel? If so we probably want city number three building those. With a 10-turn settler factory :D settling our third city will be somewhere around 1500 BC.

    The more I think about this, the more it makes my head hurt. :cringe:
     
  14. Stapel

    Stapel FIAT 850 coupé

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    Maybe we should make a curragh asap in city 1?
     
  15. Sir Bugsy

    Sir Bugsy Civ.D.

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    Here's a nugget from the civilopedia concerning seafaring civs:

    Each city built along the coast receives a commerce bonus in the center city square, and Seafaring city
    improvements (such as the Harbor or Commercial Dock) are easier to build. Ships move faster and are less likely to sink in the sea or ocean.

    I think a curraugh will be like a scout for us. I'd only build military units for city defense and some scouting.

    We could use the worker for some scouting or to join to our city.
     
  16. Gengis Khan

    Gengis Khan Deity

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    Good points! I knew if I sat on my hands, I'd get some intresting feedback(either that or a lynch mob after me;)). I'll loading the save as we speak.

    Madbax- sure wish we would have known, you would've been a great addition to the team. Although gang of 5 doesn't quite have the same ring to it. :lol:
     
  17. mad-bax

    mad-bax Deity GOTM Staff

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    Just checking in guys :)
     
  18. Sir Bugsy

    Sir Bugsy Civ.D.

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    It is now official. The Gang of Four, now has five members. Welcome aboard mad-bax. :D Plus since this isn't a rule concerning game conduct, we can break it.
     
  19. Gengis Khan

    Gengis Khan Deity

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    First I wanna Welcome MB, we need all the help & different minds in the pot as we can get for this one.:lol:

    Now on to the good stuff. :D

    “The Colossus causes it’s city to produce 1 extra commerce in every square that already produces one. Yada, yada yada tourist attraction.” The key here is the second half of the sentence, we build the colossus in a coastal non-river city and we’ll have the most expensive 3 cultural booster ever. As much as I hate the thought of wasting 200 shields on a barracks if we’re gonna go for it, its gotta be in the capitol. I’m inclined to go for it, it’ll be a huge boost to our lowly income & the AI normally goes Pyramids, Oracle, GL so we’ll probably have a shot.

    Turn 1(4000)- Wee, here we go!!
    As much as I hate to do it, I settle on the BG. It seems to be the only tile that gives us river access & a coastal city, and I don’t want to explore with the worker(which would burn 3 turns till he could get into the city). If I’m wrong & there’s a better tile feel free to smack me with a fish.
    Tribe teaches us CB.
    Start on a warrior(I plan on going War>curragh>curragh>war>grannery>settler>Colossus if we’ve met a tribe with BW & Pot, yet. I start praying.
    Start on max research on Writing.
    Worker joins city.

    T5(3850)- Warrior is produced. He heads to the east.

    T9(3600)- Curragh built. He starts on out a brave & possibly suicidal journey.

    T11(3500)- Curragh jumps over to a new island(I think), many scholars are in a panic updating maps.
    Trondheim pushes it’s borders out spotting another BG & a wheat to the north just outside it’s borders. Looks like a prime candidate for city #2. The city also grows, and new citizen complains how cramped it is in our meager town. Lux increased to 10%(I thought you got 3 contents in regent:confused:, guess I need to practice more.)
    Warrior hits the far side of the island, it’s a skinny I from what I’ve seen so far(not much).

    T13(3400)- Our tiny boat island jumps again & spots a green border, who could it be??

    T14(3350)- Curragh built, start on a warrior for MP duty(due in 3, pop grows in 6).
    Meet the Persians: we can get Masonry & all their gold(10) for Alphabet, or we can get Masonry & BW for Alph, CB, WC, and 3g. As much as I hate to do it giving up 2 techs is the only way to get BW, which makes me think they’re researching Alph already. I give in with a grumble.

    T15(3300)- Spot a brown plant to the west, that our scholors insist we can sell to increase our commerce. They dub it tobacco.

    T16(1325)- Another warrior produced, he agrees to stay & watch over the city though. Start on another. I’m really praying I run into someone with pottery soon, I’d like to throw a quick granary down, build 1 settler then go for the Colossus.

    T20(3050)- Warrior steps forward, start on curragh(debatable, I wasn’t really sure where to go with this one. I want to let it get a little bigger before pushing out a settler so we won’t have to wait on it growing back up. And with all the islands I’ve stumbled apon we can defiantly use more ships to check em out.)
    I left the warrior stationed in the city due to it growing next turn.

    I really wanted to play 30 turns, but I’ll stick with the norm & give everyone a chance a the beginning game. I still think we should build curraghs(and maybe a warrior to head south) until we get potter, then throw down a quick granary, settler, then go for the Colossus, but that would be cutting it really close if their happens to be any other Seafaring Civs.

    I leave the choice to you.
    Gang o' 4......... I mean 5!
     
  20. Sir Bugsy

    Sir Bugsy Civ.D.

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    Good move with the curraugh. The more we explore the better off we'll be.

    Just curious, how did you use the worker? Join to city or explore a little, explore a lot?
     

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