The glorious Evolution of Master of Mana - Big Update over the years - Soon (tm) on Steam

[Sephi]

Hi friends,

this thread became some weird devblog. Thanks for all the feedback, it helped a lot. I will release a standalone game on steam which uses many of the gameplay ideas of this mod. It does not use the ffh lore nor does it use any civ4 code/assets or any work done by a modder. Build on modern technology the game is a fantasy empire building game where you also roleplay as a leader. For example when barbarians invade your lands instead of just fighting the barbarians the skills of your leader provide you with many other options to deal with them. You can intimidate them or recruit them or talk them into robbing your neighbour instead or sell them weapons. The game does not use multiple techtrees, instead it uses a techmap that provides a much bigger degree of freedom and choice. Instead of progressing through a linear techtree you can start anywhere on the techmap and go in any direction (a bit like the skilltree in path of exile, lots of options and choices). Build the empire you want, no game will be the same. The setting is a points of light setting where your cities are the last bastion of hope in a sea of chaos. Diplomacy plays a much bigger role this time. You need to fight for the survival of your people, rebuild old alliances and create your own legacy. The factions are classic fantasy races but with a twist and rich lore based on a novel that I started to write long time ago. For example instead of tolkien elves there will be treeelves and maybe later also shapeshifting elves and star elves.

I'll keep the screenshots in this thread as an archive, but especially the old ones do not resemble the game quality in any way.

The Red Desert of Cruoris was created by the heavy use of magic and is less than 500 years old. It's name comes from the red sandstone hills you can see from far away.
The current state of the Evolution. Here is a two tile "Ocean" inside a large desert.

How the evolution started years ago:

 

[Sephi]

Screenshots (updated november 2025)

Spoiler Leaders :

A few leaders. I cannot upload mp4 files so you have to live with very low quality gifs due to compression.

Spoiler UI :

worldmap UI

city screen

UI to send out exploration parties.

 

[Sephi]

Tweaked the desert a bit more. Before it was morning sun where the sun was at 10 degree, changed that to 20 degree. Made the bigger dunes a bit smaller and added some rocky areas.

 

[Sephi]

Added the first version of mountains. So many constraints to work with . Tiles need to fit together in regards to texture and heightmap. Terraforming must be supported. The terrain shouldn't look too squary and at the same time the player should be able to tell which tile has which terrain. And on top the terrain will look different ingame after postprocessing effects than it does in editor.

I decided to try a few new things in regards to mountains. Moved snow from the top to the slopes and valleys. Also experimented with the shape and size of the mountains. I think overall mountains will look better if it is not one massive mountains per tile. I understand why civ uses that style since mountains are impassable in civ so you want to clearly show that to the player.

Still a long way to go in terms of polish but I feel this artstyle has a lot of potential.

 

[Sephi]

I tried to make a wheat field but the first version looks more like a windows logo easy to fix.
I wanted to add a few more trees but the placeholder trees just don't look good enough. I think I should add some better trees soon.
The grassland hills are designed like mountains in scottland, a combination of grass and rocks.
Flower fields would be nice, also bushes, rivers and lakes.

 

[Soulmate]

I am not a huge fan of uninterrupted sea of deserts. The best visuals I saw usually have some other terrain features incorporated(ruins, oases, rivers, mountains, cliffs, different terrains, etc.)
I can't bring up any good examples on top of my head but I'll look for some.

I also dislike bright red mountains for dessert as a terrain feature since it's very specific and is local to some North American deserts but not as common around the world.

Mountains and grassland look nice for a first iteration
As a suggestion: If it's a fantasy game then good 2d art(for events, cities, units, etc.) is MUST, since it builds the atmosphere way more than the terrain. And the game will look kinda bland and too gamey without it.
For example, AoW 3 has very cool textures and is a VERY good game, but it's held back by it's lack of fantasy 2d art, since they utilize a lot of 3d models instead.

Just my few cents to add to the feedback. Keep up the good work!

 

[Sephi]

I am not a huge fan of uninterrupted sea of deserts. The best visuals I saw usually have some other terrain features incorporated(ruins, oases, rivers, mountains, cliffs, different terrains, etc.)
I can't bring up any good examples on top of my head but I'll look for some.

I also dislike bright red mountains for dessert as a terrain feature since it's very specific and is local to some North American deserts but not as common around the world.

Mountains and grassland look nice for a first iteration
As a suggestion: If it's a fantasy game then good 2d art(for events, cities, units, etc.) is MUST, since it builds the atmosphere way more than the terrain. And the game will look kinda bland and too gamey without it.
For example, AoW 3 has very cool textures and is a VERY good game, but it's held back by it's lack of fantasy 2d art, since they utilize a lot of 3d models instead.

Just my few cents to add to the feedback. Keep up the good work!

I am also not a fan of large seas of deserts. Ruins, more rocky areas and sandstorms will come at the very least.

Not all deserts have to look the same. Some could have red mountains while others have sandstones or grey rocks. But something feels off about the red desert hills currently.

Completly agree on the 2d art part. Currently I have good graphics for equipment, ok for cities and units and a bit hit and a lot miss for leaders which is the most important category.

 

[Sephi]

Spend way too much time in creating a shader for the undiscovered terrain

At first I wanted to make some clouds like most non space 4x games use these days. But it felt too boring and peaceful for a fantasy game. I'll aim for some dark mist like in the hogwarts promo adds. https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/box/2/6/1/889261_front.jpg

Right now the fog is very dark so that it does not distract.

 

[Sephi]

The evolution continues. Added real trees now. Made them smaller, having 3000 trees on the screen gives the map some feeling of scale. Ancient forests will probably get larger and more detailed trees. Added a few trees in different colors, fields of flowers and also a bit of mist. The mist is animated and runs on the GPU, so it's very fast.

 

[Sephi]

It's interesting how much of a difference shadows make. In development I only draw them in close range, here is a screenshot zoomed in.

 

[Aiblis]

Depending on the game's focus on the civilization and how they adapt and use the terrain and the features on it, you could make different levels of certain terrain features.
Like Humidity, from lowest to highest:
- Magical Salt Crystal Desert (Very hostile to life)
- Salt Desert
- Sand Desert
- Rock Desert
- Steppe
- Grassland
- Swamp
- River Delta areas

Better shown with something like forest. Like:
- Young Forest
- Light Forest
- Thick Forest
- Old Forest
- Ancient Forest
- Magical Forest

Depends a bit on the types of civilizations and how much they can interact with the environment. if a Dwarf like Species can build cities under Cliffs, then more variants there are aways fun.

Besides that, for some more unique fantasy terrains, I would have the following ideas in mind:
- Crystal Desert (Big Magical Crystals in a very dry environment)
- Fey Forest (Magic looming in the forest, magical beasts, and unbelievable old and giant trees)
- Single Mountain (Like the lonely mountain from Lord of the Rings, Hobbits. A single big mountain in a generally flat area.)
- Canyon Areas with giant canyons ripping a area apart, like the great canyon in the west of the USA or some in south africa
- Iron Rich areas often have a red or rusty tint, so maybe something in that direction
- Depending on the magic system, Magic could also gather in an area. Like a green glowing swamp area full of death magic, a kind of Death Swamp
- Similar here, an Area overflowing with light or Life Magic, resulting in flowery fields or ponds of life water in a grassy area with rare resources around it

When I would personally design an area, I would think of these and then make some kind of grid
Humidity Level, How Hilly an area is (Flat or high mountain peaks), and in a fantasy area if there is some kind of magic active in an area.
IN fantasy, the ancient or history could also be inserted, like an old magic explosion creating a dangerous area of magical Crystals etc.

Dont know if there are some thoughts in it that may help you or if I totally missed the topic of this Thread

 

[Sephi]

Thanks for the suggestions, they are very helpful!

In general when designing terrain I try to prevent a museumesque approach to terrain like Heroes of Might and Magic did. Where you have all that fancy terrain but you are only allowed to look at it, not interact with it. Most terrains should offer unique resources, plenty of terraforming magic options and inhabit different civs/monsters.

In the red desert of cruoris for example you can find black metal that is used for necromancy. Necromancers usually refer to it as necrotic dust. And if you do not shy away from cruel actions you can sell some of your people to the slavers living there for gold (and to gain their trust).

 

[Aiblis]

That sounds really awesome and I personally like this approach.
I really enjoy Civilizations that use and interact with their environment, terraforming it, getting certain advantages on specific terrain or features, etc. Like Wood Elves in Forests, Lizards in Swamp areas, etc.
And receiving certain resources in certain terrains sounds really good.

 

[Sephi]

Speaking of terraforming, I have made a couple evolutions to it. There are new terraforming spells "Enlarge X" that only work next to X. So for example "Enlarge Mountain" works only next to existing mountains, "Enlarge Forest" only works next to existing forests. These are meant as less powerful early game spells since they are more restricted. Terraforming spells also have a power modifier and a higher power modifier means that more tiles are terraformed. Power modifier comes either from skills (like a passive bonus) or from terrain synergy. Neighbouring terrain of a particular type gives a bonus to certain terraforming spells, for example ocean/coast/lakes increases the spring spell.

The idea is that if you play a terraforming heavy civ and you need to terraform 50 plots later in the game because you gained a new city you do not have to spam a 1 tile terraform spell or use some autocast thingy. Instead you cast a few more powerful spells that affect more tiles and if you aim your terraforming smart to make use of neighbouring terrain the terraforming will be even faster.

The terraforming UI is build to support all these changes. It's an overlay on the main map now. You click on the overlay mode button and every tile shows you which terraform options it has. In the screenshot here I started with the Firemage talent so I had access to the the scorch spell and could change forests to grassland, plains to desert and grassland to plains. I also found a create hills spellscrolls in a monster lair so I can terraform these plots into hills (spellscrolls are one time use consumables). Once you click on a tile a menu shows you your options, power modifiers, etc.

 

[Sephi]

I have created a system for displaying cities now.

1.) Cities are 2x2 tiles so details are visible without zooming. Cities that grow over time like in civ6/humankind/old world are pretty nice and visualize progress quite nice but I don't feel that they fit into a fantasy world. So I rather make the cities 2x2 and display the progress inside the city.
2.) In the center of the city is always a building/structure that symbolizes the civs culture. A marketplace, a tavern, a temple, a sacrificial altar, a large tree and so on...
3.) Different civs use different houses (or tents, trees, graveyards, whatever...) and the number of houses depends on the population of the city. Small cities look a bit empty now, maybe later I add some ruins to them that will turn into houses as the city grows.
4.) I plan to display only a couple buildings per city. Probably the first four epic buildings you build in the city. Epic buildings are a bit like national wonders in civ4, but instead of having a hard limit of how many you can build instead they just cost a lot of resources. You have access to different epic buildings depending on your specialization and civ so this should add a lot of variety to how cities look.
5.) All cities have a natural or primitive defense. What is used will depend on both civ and terrain. Technological civs for example may use trenches filled with water while nature civs use Large trees and thickets with poisonous plants and undead civs use a magic fog. This creates a very visible border between the tamed cities and the chaotic wilderness outside. The distance between cities is also larger than before so there is a lot of wilderness around.
6.) Advanced defense like Citywalls are displayed in addition to the primitive defense once they have been constructed in the city. Npc cities like tradeposts will display advanced defenses when they have a strong defense to make it more intuitive to new players what can easily be attacked and what not.
7.) Cities blend into the terrain they are located in. Cities in forests for example have a lot of trees and a pond, while cities in grasslands have few trees, a pond and a few wheat fields. Civs like undead who corrupt the terrain will get a different blend in, like dead trees etc.

 

[Guru-Meditation]

I really like this more fantasy-like approach to visualising cities on the campaign map.

P.S.
I really like the "actually full of trees" visuals for the foest.

All great ! +1

 

[Sephi]

Thanks for the feedback. It took me a while to get used to the larger scale of the cities but I really like them now.

Added territory borders now. Instead of sharp lines I use a style similar to the settler games. Also added a setting for increased shadow details.

 

[Sephi]

I optimized the textures so that they do not waste video memory and checked to make sure they still look good in 8k resolution. In theory you can even see little flowers in the forest, no idea how it actually looks on a large 8k tv. The trees probably need some more polygons for 8k. Well, no idea if 8k resolutions even become a thing .

 

[Sephi]

I have added a first version of swimming pools for fire elementals aka volcanos to the game. The lava pool from volcanos is animated with a particle effect and little lava balls fly out of the volcano.

If the volcano is in your territory you will gain +1 to the fire mastery skill in case you have the skill. Basically you can cast stronger fire spells earlier and your units deal more fire damage.

Played my first testgame after transfering the game to a 3d worldmap and won after 315 turns. Took about 10 hours or so. But I took a lot of notes while playing and also some interfaces will be more optimized in the future so they require less mouseclicks.

Overall I am quite happy with the current state even though it's still quite a distance to an early access ready version.

 

[MLG Samantha]

Opinion: You should use hexagonal tiles rather than squares for your game. Square tiles in a 4x game just look so dated nowadays, and hexes feel a lot more natural to play on.