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The Great Lighthouse

Discussion in 'BTS Multi-Team Demogame II' started by DaveMcW, Apr 8, 2010.

  1. AlphaShard

    AlphaShard Chieftain

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    I think the bolded portion is the problem, no one knew that this is the extent of what "giving mapmaker free reign" had meant. I'm alright with this since I am trained myself not to depend on Wonders and clearly this means we got an Islands map and it's possible to have every city be a costal city.
     
  2. akots

    akots Poet

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    Considering that technology trading is enabled, anything which at least a little bit slows down the tech pace is very much welcome. I'd say :goodjob: for the mapmaker.
     
  3. Winston Hughes

    Winston Hughes Wrathful Warlock Retired Moderator

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    Can we get some trust in the mapmaker, please?

    I know from experience that when this kind of criticism gets rolling, it can pretty much wreck a game before anyone's had a chance to find out if it's fun or not.

    I would also suggest keeping speculation about the nature of the map within team forums, lest people give away more information than they realise...
     
  4. BCLG100

    BCLG100 Music Master

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    I agree, the disqualification of the GL is great in another way as well, it adds a bit of flavour to the game. I don't see any problem with telling us now either.
     
  5. AlphaShard

    AlphaShard Chieftain

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    So is it safe to assume the rest of the Wonders are in the game?
     
  6. Darkness

    Darkness Shadow creature

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    I completely agree. Techspeed will be very high in this game with techtrading enabled. anything that counters that seems like a fairly good idea to me. :)
     
  7. Sommerswerd

    Sommerswerd I never yielded

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    Frankly, when I ask for Mapmaker's Choice, I want to be surprised. I want diabolical twists and turns so devilish:devil: and fiendish:satan: and delisciously game-changing that only a human could have come up with them... I don't want the human to just let the AI do it. To me that is AI choice, not Mapmaker's choice.

    I honestly wouldn't care if a bunch of wonders were disabled, and DaveMCW revealed that fact at random times throughout the game. It is disabled for everyone, so it is fair. the fact that you wanted it is just your misfortune. Sort of like a random event that you can't "X" yourself out of.

    :goodjob:DaveMCW... keep us on our toes, please keep doing stuff like this. This is exactly what I want. A game where it is impossible to fall back on old conventions. A game where it is difficult to "plan" out anything. Just like we are truly exploring a truly "new" world.
     
  8. Lord Parkin

    Lord Parkin aka emperor

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    Sure, because researching an expensive tech only to find you can't build the wonder is fair and FUN! :rolleyes: While we're at it, why don't we secretly tweak the Stable to give +20 XP without telling anyone, so the first team to Horseback Riding gets a massive bonus. Or secretly tweak Longbowmen to 60 strength, so the first team to Feudalism suddenly discovers they can win any war.

    Let's play Civ here, not some obscure mod that completely unbalances the game.

    (Note: I'm responding to Sommer's silly extrapolation here, not DaveMcW and the original topic of this thread. I'm okay with the Great Lighthouse being disabled if that's the only mod to the gameplay, and everyone knows about it.)
     
  9. AlphaShard

    AlphaShard Chieftain

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    Never said I wanted it and never said that this was a bad idea, just would have appreciated knowing this sort of thing was what Dave was thinking of. I appreciate that he told us NOW that GLH is gone, but LP does have a point in what else is going to throw us for a loop? Though I do trust that Dave is trying to keep the game balanced.

    But it would be like building the Great Wall only to find out that Barbs had been turned off.
     
  10. Calis

    Calis on time

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    I agree with LP that such changes could be really annoying once we are deeper into the game. To destroy lots of turns of planning (and researching) on a wonder build, by just saying, pooof you can't build it would really let people lose interest quickly.

    But as Dave already stated this will be the only surprise. And I think this one is a good one :thumbsup:
     
  11. BCLG100

    BCLG100 Music Master

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    I wouldn't say that's the only reason, you also get the GSpy points which means an early GSpy which can mean easing off the research during the ancient age to rob from someone else.
     
  12. Robi D

    Robi D Minister of (Dis)Order

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    That's impossible because there is an ice island with a great lighthouse out there as well :D
     
  13. Robi D

    Robi D Minister of (Dis)Order

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    It wouldn't be a mystery map if he told us what he was thinking of;)
     
  14. Earthling

    Earthling Chieftain

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    I'm not sure I quite approve of this, though at least it was before any team had actually committed themselves to the Great Lighthouse.

    However even on a purely-sea map I still don't see the Lighthouse being overpowered; no more so than several other wonders, and this removes an element of racing for wonders from a lot of the teams. Specifically, this just made the Colossus even more important because now instead of that two-way race (hardly feasible for someone to beat everyone else to both, in general) it'll be a race for the Colossus. If the reason this was done was because of a water heavy map I don't see how giving the teams that extra information and setting them on the way towards the Colossus helps that much.

    That said, I'm more than happy to play on - mostly I'd be more concerned if I was on the Dutch or especially Vikings who may have been planning from the selection of their civ for such a wonder. But I think we can all live with it/adapt and if nothing more like this "surprises" us dozens of turns in or something that's ok.
     
  15. azzaman333

    azzaman333 meh

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    In the end, if DaveMcW thinks removing TGL from the map will balance it better, that's good enough for me.
     
  16. remake20

    remake20 :)

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    We said he could do what he wanted, didn't we? AMAZON thinks they may know exactly how this map looks like, but we aint going to tell.
     
  17. AlphaShard

    AlphaShard Chieftain

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    I would have been fine had he said "There may be a WW you won't be allowed to get" and left it at that. Honestly though I am not that upset over it so please don't think I am mad or complaining. Earthling does have a point that Colossus is more valuable though.

    Not to mention the Viking UB gives a free trade route...
     
  18. BCLG100

    BCLG100 Music Master

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    I believe you're getting trading post and cothon confused here.
    http://www.civfanatics.com/civ4/info/improvements/
     
  19. Lord Parkin

    Lord Parkin aka emperor

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    I think you mean the Carthaginian UB, Shard...
     
  20. AlphaShard

    AlphaShard Chieftain

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    You can tell I don't play those two Civs often, corrrection noted but my point still stands. Actually now I think Dave took out GLH to keep Vikings from being overpowering since their UB is the Lighthouse.
     

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