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The Great War

Discussion in 'Civ3 - Completed Scenarios' started by Sarevok, Jan 25, 2004.

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What do you think of this scenario?

  1. Its Great! one of the best out there!

    261 vote(s)
    54.6%
  2. Its a good scenario

    119 vote(s)
    24.9%
  3. Its ok

    40 vote(s)
    8.4%
  4. I dont like it

    58 vote(s)
    12.1%
  1. Fortis1

    Fortis1 Prince

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    Thank you, everyone, for the replies!

    I will rename Kaiserjager to Sturmtruppe and correct Civilopedia accordingly.

    A made additional chages so far:
    - according to many players, games are often end in 1915 due to victory point limit. Thus, I trippled victory points required to win;
    - increased Russian infantry attack value to 5. Even if Russian Empire performed poor in WWI, 5/8 vs german 11/13, is a bit too much. Besides, as far as I know, initial Russian advance was not that bad, and Germany even had to pull several divisions from Western front to stop them. Tide was turned only after Tannenberg. I really would like to represent it, but Russians just refuse to attack german infantry. Any advice on this matter?
    - removed lethal land bombardment from all air units. Air units are too cheap to have it. I think, that bombardment and rate of fire are bad enough already. Siege gun costs more with similar stats and shorter range;
    - removed sea trade from ports and air trade from airdromes, gave sea trade to major ports to compensate to certain extent. Turns are pretty fast RN;
    - added "wheeled" flag to tanks to represent their clumsiness;
    - Secret Police HQ is not tied to Bolshevism - any nation can build it;
    - for some unknown reason at the start of a game I've got a message that Austo-Hungrians started to build The Schlieffen Plan. Just in case, I tied all auto-production wonders to respective governments;
    - I don't know what to do with mines. British fleet just try to bombard them and become easy prey to German battleships;
    - fixed Germany's inability to build sumbarines;
    - removed transport capacity from submarines. More on that: according to civilopedia and dummed torpedo unit, submarines were ment to carry torpedoes only. But, as far as I know, there's no way to force AI to use Cruise Missile-flaged units from vessels with "Transport only Tactical Missiles" flag. I recall a discussion about this, but don't remember conclusions.

    Any additional suggestions would be highly appretiated.
     
  2. Lanzelot

    Lanzelot Moderator Moderator

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    There is nothing to correct. The Kaiserjäger were a regular Austrian-Hungarian unit that saw heavy action in WW1, on the Gallizian Front as well as on the Italian Front.

     
  3. Lanzelot

    Lanzelot Moderator Moderator

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    Interestingly, the first famous Jäger unit, von Lützows Freikorps, was a "combined arms" unit consisting of Infantry, Cavalry and Artillery. They served as an irregular unit of volunteers during the War of Liberation against Napoleon (1813-1815), and the colors of their uniform gave the democratic movement in Germany its flag: Black-Red-Gold, which later became the national flag of Germany. Their song "Lützows wilde verwegene Jagd" was composed by none other than Carl Maria von Weber.
    Lützow Free Corps - Wikipedia
    (The English Wiki page is unfortunately only a shortened version. For full information see the German page: Lützowsches Freikorps – Wikipedia )

    And as I said, Jäger were not just ordinary light infantry, they were always something "special", e.g Gebirgsjäger are special troops for mountain warfare, Fallschirmjäger are parachuters and Panzerjäger are tank busters.
     
  4. Fortis1

    Fortis1 Prince

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    Thank you very much for your reply! I have one last question, however. I don't deny at all, that Kaiserjagers took part in WWI. What bothers me is how exactly they are set up in the mod. Here's the civilopedia description.

    The lines I highlighted with bold are the reason I started the discussion in the first place, because the civilopedia literally described them as "a stormtroopers" and, more importantly, as "german forces". So, my final question is - can you, please, confirm that this description is correct?

    Thank you once again for you help and input!
     
  5. Civinator

    Civinator Blue Lion Supporter

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    Of course there is something to correct. When looking at the prerequisites and the stats of that unit (including the civ that should use this unit), one can recognize that Kaiserjäger is the wrong name for that historical unit. Here nothing is changing, when a historical unit, that isn´t meant here, was existing.

    Sturmtruppen.jpg
     
  6. Lanzelot

    Lanzelot Moderator Moderator

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    You are right, this description looks indeed wrong. Even though the Germans also had "Jäger" units at least since the Napoleonic Wars (as shown by the references given by Civinator and myself), the term "Kaiserjäger" is definitely a genuine Austrian-Hungarian unit, dedicated to the Austrian Kaiser Franz Joseph. (Sorry, I got confused here. The last time I played The Great War is more than 10 years ago, and I didn't remember the Kaiserjäger unit in that game is a German unit. I thought we were talking about an Austrian unit...:crazyeye:)

    I can only imagine that the creators of this scenario confused the term "Kaiser" and thought it referred to the German Kaiser Wilhelm II (instead of to the Austrian Kaiser Franz Joseph...) and therefore they thought it would be a German unit?

    In that case the unit should be renamed "Sturmtruppen", then the Wiki entry would be correct.
    And perhaps add a similar unit as "Kaiserjäger" for the Austrians?

    Edit: aargh, crosspost with Civinator...
    The reply is meant for Fortis1.
     
  7. Fortis1

    Fortis1 Prince

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    I suppose, name of the German 1918 operation - Kaiserschlacht - could add confusion here. And unit "kaiserjager" in the unit library is called "ww1 germn trench infantry" for some reason.

    I would like to, but I don't want to add new units for now. Maybe, I will add it as a flavored unit later. I feel like I am adding a bit too much already.

    I made a test game with Italians and, regrettably, as a singleplayer mod, TGW is simply to easy for the human player. I won in the first half of 1916 by domination. Strategy is very simple - spam light artillery and have as much corps as possible, steal technologies from allies and Germany to reach Siege Guns ASAP. After that all you need to build are light arillery/field howitzers and siege guns. Use machine gunners to cover artillery and cavalry to capture cities. LLB on siege guns just makes them too good. No need neither in aviation, nor in tanks. All AI is doing is trying to send machine gunners to pillage territory around cities. For the whole game Germany only ruined Lodz (I didn't use NoRaze, but really should've) and captured Liege. Ottomans took other Arabia and Russia did quite an advance on Southern front, capturing several coastal cities. Britain captured single Turkish city and that's it.

    AI does like building machinegunners and partisans way too much. I think, they may dislike building infantry because of pop cost. I think, that pop-cost on infantry and cavalry doesn't really add any challange to the player and makes thing even easier, because AI build partisans instead. Rome had about 70 citizens and a new citiez poped up every turn by the end of the game. I could easily spam infantry, if I wanted to.

    As for grapics update, I still have some things to do. Not all teches and improvements are replaced and I need to find/make some more flags, especially for minor powers, like Montenegro and Albania.
     
  8. Civinator

    Civinator Blue Lion Supporter

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    Yes, this mix-up with the real existing Austrian-Hungarian Kaiserjäger - which also took part in WW I (but are not part of the Great War scenario), is very understandable. :yup: Here is the Wikipedia link to the Austrian-Hungarian Kaiserjäger: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kaiserjäger
     
  9. Lanzelot

    Lanzelot Moderator Moderator

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    I found this quite interesting for the topic we just discussed ("Kaiserschlacht"):
     
  10. Ozymandias

    Ozymandias Archivist, redux Supporter

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    Well, then, amigo, here's to necromancy! (Unless, of course, you wind up unleashing some sort of zombie apocalypse... :shifty: )

    Seriously!?!? ( ;) ) Delta-Strife has some magnificent work in the db, and imperator1961 has some astonishing units, grouped together in packs of up to 20 or so - just posted in improbably bizarre places, like the Wehrmacht being posted in the Renaissance unit library. Also a lot of @Wyrmshadow's "toys" (as he liked to call them) remain first rate - although, now hat I think about it, those might already be packaged in the mod :think:
     
  11. Moff Jerjerrod

    Moff Jerjerrod Deity

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    I'm so glad to see interest in this WWI scenario. I have found my old scenario that I created called Moff's La Grande Guerre which is based off of this scenario plus the old board game of the same name.

    I could post it here if anyone is interested. I would also love to play a PBEM game with people.
     
  12. Wagoncrash

    Wagoncrash Chieftain

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    can you post link or in private message pls? :O
     
  13. Moff Jerjerrod

    Moff Jerjerrod Deity

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    I will try to PM it to you. :)
     
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  14. Wagoncrash

    Wagoncrash Chieftain

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    Tyvm. You are now great spirit animal! btw, is that the original version that was last uploaded years ago or is it an earlier one? even still it is very nostalgic and enjoyed it. Your scenario, the one posted here great war 2.1, the ww2 one, and AoI are for me tied as probably the best. Yours was smaller and focused on europe part just like this one and has great artwork and units. I remember when I added other music to it too to expand the playlist.
     
    Moff Jerjerrod likes this.
  15. Moff Jerjerrod

    Moff Jerjerrod Deity

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    You're welcome and my pleasure. I'm glad you are liking it. :)

    This is not the original version that Saverok uploaded many years ago but it is a heavily modified version of his game. I have been working on it over the past year or so to bring it where it is today.
     
  16. JSmitty

    JSmitty Chieftain

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    Hey all,

    I've been trying to find a way to play this game. I've downloaded the main game folder with no .biq and also the .biq for the division version but no game file. Does anyone have these bits? Thanks in advance, really keen to play this!
     
  17. Chalito

    Chalito Chieftain

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    I can't download the the Art and Text files, the link on the first page doesn't work. Is there another place where I can get this one?
     
  18. Chalito

    Chalito Chieftain

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    Found the download! Started right up with the Germans without reading any of the info. Saw some sea mines with 1000 defense, we’ll see what that’s about later on. I have a very big army though! :) Thought about invading Denmark and The Netherlands to prevent them from being a nuisance later, but it appears no military alliances can be signed. So they are safe, for now.

    Week 30 1914 - Sent some 48 units to Liege, 31 to Lods and 21 to Warsaw. Left the cities on the north coast with just 1 unit, hopefully there are no enemy units that can attack by sea nearby. Fortified all existing units on the border. I left my Great Leaders in Berlin as I think they throw the AI off balance, will use them only in emergency situations.

    Didn’t realize that French territory was right outside of Metz and the French kept coming and coming. I’d say some 40 to 50 units including 3 Army units attacked. All of my remaining units were down to 1hp, but I managed to survive, whew! No real activity on the east so far.
     
  19. vmxa

    vmxa Deity Supporter

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    Could you post the link to where you found the scenario for those who come later, thanks.
     
  20. Chalito

    Chalito Chieftain

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