The IMF, Rubles and the Russian Economy

[REDY]

At no point in my post did I mention Iraq.

All imperial powers are comparable to one another. History can't be measured in the last 20 or 30 years alone, it's far more complex than that. And I get, people don't like that. It's inconvenient. But US' historical imperial informs its modern-day imperialism, and while it doesn't do the same things on-paper as Russia (and I am repeatedly on-record as saying the Russian invasion of Ukraine is illegal), it's still very factual to say the end results around the world are comparable. Even in the modern day (as per Lexi's post).

Like, I had a go at Crezth for daring to excuse the Chinese genocide of the Uyghurs. We can't have our cake and eat it and then say "the US hasn't done a genocide". Not only has it, it's also tried to do more.

You reacted on Akka´s post. And Akka post´s "other" was obviously not something century+ ago. This kind of whataboutism shift belongs to the world history section.
The interesting idea is that all imperial powers are comparable to one another. Everything is comparable, but IMHO USSR is more comparable to small communist Albania than to US.

 

[Gorbles]

You reacted on Akka´s post. And Akka post´s "other" was obviously not something century+ ago. This kind of whataboutism shift belongs to the world history section.
The interesting idea is that all imperial powers are comparable to one another. Everything is comparable, but IMHO USSR empire is more comparable to small communist Albania than to US.

I reacted to Akka's post, yes. Iraq was only one of the countries he mentioned. His point was that Russia is not comparable to the US. I disagree. I'm not the only person who disagrees.

So can we please focus on what's actually being written? Instead of accusing folks of cheapening genocide, or the infamous "whataboutism", insisting that I'm focusing on a country that I never focused on, when I was very clear and deliberate with what I was saying?

 

[REDY]

I reacted to Akka's post, yes. Iraq was only one of the countries he mentioned. His point was that Russia is not comparable to the US. I disagree. I'm not the only person who disagrees.

So can we please focus on what's actually being written? Instead of accusing folks of cheapening genocide, or the infamous "whataboutism", insisting that I'm focusing on a country that I never focused on, when I was very clear and deliberate with what I was saying?

So what was the literal genocide then? Indians? Seize of Texas?
"Whataboutism" is imho correct term for posting these in The IMF, Rubles and the Russian Economy,

 

[Gorbles]

So what was the literal genocide then? Indians? Seize of Texas?
"Whataboutism" is imho correct term for posting these in The IMF, Rubles and the Russian Economy,

No, what you're trying to argue is it's "off topic". This tangent started because someone expressed their opinion, on a forum, that they're frustrated with how the geopolitics of the conflict are portrayed. They were then accused of peddling a "false equivalence" common to "Russian tankies", and a couple of pages later here we are.

We're all in this tangent now, it's not whataboutism, it's "debate the subject or don't bother". This has no place in the Russia news thread for a variety of reasons, and sure, it's not really related to the Russian economy. But the reason why "the West" is aiding Ukraine is because of geopolitics. It's not out of the goodness of their hearts. If that were the case, "the West" wouldn't go around funding warlords, backing coups, and whatever else it likes to do on a pretty regular basis. And yes, genocide. Lexi already gave a pretty good starting point for that kind of discussion.

It's amazing that "I think Russia is bad, and completely in the wrong for invading Ukraine" gets completely ignored because some posters want to have an iota of nuance when it comes to discussing that thing called geopolitics. And you're here concerned about "whataboutism" when posters like Akka are hilariously suggesting posters are Russian all because they hold some critical opinions about NATO. It's wild. Just a complete lack of introspection.

 

[REDY]

With good heart only US would of course support Ukraine much more. If it would care as Estonian the war would be over.
US geopolitics would be something like why support Ukraine when its win would make EU to cancel military at all and we would lose all influence in Europe.
So yes there is some compromise but US is not comparable to horsehockeyholes like Russia.

 

[NinjaCow64]

So yes there is some compromise but US is not comparable to horsehockyholes like Russia.

I invite you again to read this post where Lexicus details the many times when America was being as evil as Russia is right now.

And if you want to talk about "low-key genocide" the US did that in Vietnam, and since then has armed and trained a number of state and nonstate actors which have done it since then, including but not limited to:

-the Turkish state
-the Indonesian state
-the Guatemalan state
-the Mexican state
-the El Slvadoran state
-the Contras
-(ironically) Saddam Hussein

Of course, what these things all have in common is that the victims weren't white Europeans, which I'm sure has nothing to do with how you'll inevitably dismiss them as false equivalencies.

 

[NinjaCow64]

It's amazing that "I think Russia is bad, and completely in the wrong for invading Ukraine" gets completely ignored because some posters want to have an iota of nuance when it comes to discussing that thing called geopolitics. And you're here concerned about "whataboutism" when posters like Akka are hilariously suggesting posters are Russian all because they hold some critical opinions about NATO. It's wild. Just a complete lack of introspection.

Its pretty incredible lol. Figured it was likely to happen alas.

 

[REDY]

I invite you again to read this post where Lexicus details the many times when America was being as evil as Russia is right now.

I do not feel qualified. Maybe if there were more details, I could discuss them. Otherwise, I would stick with the thread

 

[NinjaCow64]

I do not feel qualified. Maybe if there were more details, I could discuss them. Otherwise, I would stick with the thread

If you don’t feel qualified to discuss them then why do you keep implicitly trying to discuss this stuff by saying things like “Russia is worse than the US”?

 

[NinjaCow64]

Which makes essentially no difference, the "landgrab" thing is just a mental shield against the cognitive dissonance resulting from thinking and feeling very differently about the Iraq War compared to this one. This war would be criminal and wrong even if Russia had not annexed any Ukrainian territory.

Thank you for pointing this out - this one talking point made me feel like I was completely losing my marbles! Like people cared more about lines on a map than the innocent people who were dying! Good grief...

 

[Akka]

Pretty ironical to see people who claim they "are not black and white thinker" and "wants some nuance" being the ones who put everything on the same level. Guess they don't get the concept of "nuance" to begin with.

 

[NinjaCow64]

Pretty ironical to see people who claim they "are not black and white thinker" and "wants some nuance" being the ones who put everything on the same level. Guess they don't get the concept of "nuance" to begin with.

What are you talking about? I don’t think I have done that.

 

[Birdjaguar]

Moderator Action: How about we get back to the Ruble and the Russian economy?

 

[banzay13]

The sharp fall in the ruble exchange rate, which put the Russian currency among the world's weakest, turned out to be a "gold mine" for the Russian banking system.
In January-July, banks earned 662 billion rubles as a result of "currency revaluation". The growth of currency rates provided every third ruble of the banks' profit, which set an absolute record and reached 2 trillion rubles in 7 months. In July, which brought the Russian currency market a jump in the dollar above Br100, banks earned Br327 billion.

Since the beginning of the year, the dollar exchange rate has jumped by 30% and the euro by 36% @banksta

And same happened in the end of 2022, then usd rose from 50 in June.
So it's just speculation. On of the big beneficiary is Sberbank, the next is Raiffeizen bank.

 

[Hygro]

Russia raising interest rates to strengthen the ruble has to be one of the dumbest economic moves on its face. It makes me wonder if there’s more to the story I don’t know, or if their kleptocrat state has so failed to find qualified economists.

 

[Lexicus]

It makes me wonder if there’s more to the story I don’t know

This can hardly avoid being the case, given the near-complete lack of transparency in the Russian economy.

 

[Hygro]

It could really just be the incompetence of authoritarians. “Strong is good! Money is economy! Strong currency for strong economy!”

 

[Ajidica]

I was listening to Adam Tooze's* podcast recently and last week he had an episode on the rouble. Assuming I remember it right, Russia is likely raising interest rates to keep imports from getting too expensive. Russia has big cash reserves from oil and ag exports sitting in Chinese, Indian, and Arab banks where sanctions are half-hearted at best. Keeping the rouble from collapsing serves both a psychological purpose domestically and lets them stretch their external cash reserves further for sanction busting. Increasing interest rates also has a benefit in holding down inflation. The recriminations and finger pointing inside Russia, including by serious economists, isn't over the action of the Russian central bank but rather they let it get to this point before they did something.

*I think most of us know who Adam Tooze is, but for those who don't, he is the author of The Wages of Destruction on the Nazi economy, Crashed about the 2008/2012 great financial screw-up, and arguably one of the better political economy communicators these days.

 

[Hygro]

But what are they buying that it is worth reducing domestic economic activity for? That can’t work long term.

 

[Lexicus]

But what are they buying that it is worth reducing domestic economic activity for? That can’t work long term.

Presumably what they need to keep making weapons.