The inhumane conditions of Bradley Manning's detention

[MobBoss]

How insecure are military prisons in regards to maintaining the ongoing incarceration of the general population (non-solitary confinement)? Are successful escapes common? If so, this is yet another area the government should cede to the free market for a solution.

Silly question but if that's a justification for putting somebody in solitary confinement what does that say for the general security of prisons?

It's 'a' justification...not the sole one. Come on guys.

It's disturbing that America is torturing one of it's own citizens...

Its been established that he is not being tortured.

However.

I think its disturbing that the current trend of thought by some apparently think simply being in prison the equal to torture.

 

[kosiosko 1]

Its been established that he is not being tortured.

However.

I think its disturbing that the current trend of thought by some apparently think simply being in prison the equal to torture.

would you accept that its at least equal to punishment, before being found guilty

 

[JollyRoger]

I think its disturbing that the current trend of thought by some apparently think simply being in prison the equal to torture.

I agree. It's not like he is having to shower with gays.

 

[MobBoss]

would you accept that its at least equal to punishment, before being found guilty

Sure. Which is why he gets credit for it as 'time served'....

 

[JollyRoger]

Sure. Which is why he gets credit for it as 'time served'....

So that will lower the sentence he has to serve if he is found not guilty?

 

[MobBoss]

So that will lower the sentence he has to serve if he is found not guilty?

Nope. AFAIK, he is still getting his military pay and allowances. So, in essence, his duty location is in that cell, and will remain so until he is either found not guilty or otherwise.

 

[JollyRoger]

Nope. AFAIK, he is still getting his military pay and allowances. So, in essence, his duty location is in that cell, and will remain so until he is either found not guilty or otherwise.

Why are we wasting taxpayer money paying this guy to do nothing? This kind of nonsense can only happen in a government-run program.

 

[MobBoss]

Why are we wasting taxpayer money paying this guy to do nothing? This kind of nonsense can only happen in a government-run program.

Because thats the rules.

 

[JollyRoger]

It's 'a' justification...not the sole one. Come on guys.

It's not much of one unless you know something about the weakness of military prison security that the rest of us don't.

Because thats the rules.

Typical of a governmnet run program. Private prisons at least try to get an honest day's work out of their prisoners.

 

[Ajidica]

I'm curious, how would the defense attempt to defend Manning?
I understand he is innocent right now, but given the preponderance of evidence regarding his culpability, it seems unlikely at best he will be found innocent.

 

[JollyRoger]

I'm curious, how would the defense attempt to defend Manning?
I understand he is innocent right now, but given the preponderance of evidence regarding his culpability, it seems unlikely at best he will be found innocent.

Without knowing the details of the charges, my guess is that you perhaps try to plea bargain. Or you plead guilty at the guilt phase of the proceeding and work for mitigation at the punishment stage, thus depriving the prosecution of some punches that are more effective in the guilt stage than the punishment stage.

The birther Lakin (who refused to deploy because he hadn't seen Obama's long-form birth certificate), once he got a decent attorney, attempted something like this. There were two counts against him. He plead guilty to 3 sub-parts of the first charge and got the 4th sub-part dropped. He then went to trial on the 2nd charge where he had a technical argument that gave him a shot at getting a not guilty.

He lost on that charge and then they moved to the punishment stage (on the guilty plea count and the found guilty count) where he didn't end up with as much prison time as he could have. If he had stuck with his original attorney and insisted on focusing on winning at the guilt stage on both counts, he likely would have ended up with a worse result.

 

[civ_king]

What was the crime?

Espionage against the United States of America

 

[Berzerker]

Its been established that he is not being tortured.

However.

I think its disturbing that the current trend of thought by some apparently think simply being in prison the equal to torture.

long term solitary confinement is torture

who said being in prison is torture?

 

[Hehehe]

I think its disturbing that the current trend of thought by some apparently think simply being in prison the equal to torture.

http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2009/04/solitaryconfinement/

http://serendip.brynmawr.edu/exchange/node/1898

Also no-one is saying being in prison is torture, we're talking about solitary confinement.

 

[holy king]

is this guy potentialy facing the death penalty, btw?

 

[Flying Pig]

It's 'a' justification...not the sole one. Come on guys.

It's a justification for putting him in prison, not in solitary. Hence why I picked you up on it.

 

[Formaldehyde]

Its been established that he is not being tortured.

No, it's just been "established" by you and other ultraconservatives that is it not torture. Obviously, others have "established" it is.

Its I think its disturbing that the current trend of thought by some apparently think simply being in prison the equal to torture.

What I think is "disturbing" is the continual use of such absurd strawmen instead of addressing the issues. Or can you provide evidence of even one person in this thread who has claimed that being incarcerated is "equal to torture"?

 

[bhsup]

It's disturbing that America is torturing one of it's own citizens...

Wait, I thought this was about the guy who leaked the stuff. Who are you talking about that the US is torturing? Do we need a new thread for this other person?

 

[Ajidica]

Wait, I thought this was about the guy who leaked the stuff. Who are you talking about that the US is torturing? Do we need a new thread for this other person?

At the very least, solitary confinement isn't good for the individual psychologicaly. Putting an innocent person in conditions that are known to be harmful to mental health is at least morally dubious.

Solitary confinement—that is the confinement of a prisoner alone in a cell for all, or nearly all, of the day with minimal environmental stimulation and minimal opportunity for social interaction—can cause severe psychiatric harm. It has indeed long been known that severe restriction of environmental and social stimulation has a
profoundly deleterious effect on mental functioning;

The paradigmatic psychiatric disturbance was an agitated confusional state which, in more severe cases, had the characteristics of a florid delirium, characterized by severe confusional, paranoid, and hallucinatory features, and also by intense agitation and random, impulsive, often self-directed violence. Such disturbances were often observed in individuals who had no prior history of any mental illness. In addition, solitary confinement often resulted in severe exacerbation of a previously existing mental condition.

Indeed, even a few days of solitary confinement will predictably shift the electroencephalogram (EEG) pattern toward an abnormal pattern characteristic of stupor and delirium.

Link:
http://law.wustl.edu/journal/22/p325grassian.pdf

 

[MobBoss]

long term solitary confinement is torture

This isnt really solitary confinement on that level. He gets visitors. He watches tv. He even has a pillow and bedsheets. Give it up.