The Macedonian Naming Dispute

[Jehoshua]

After an amusing discussion with one hellene self denied nationalist about the macedonian naming dispute I have decided to post a thread here about the topic.

What are peoples opinions, if any on the naming dispute between the Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia (FYROM) also known as the Fyromia of the dreaded fyromians by certain hellenes, and the afformentioned Republic of Hellas more commonly known as greece.

Let us begin with pieces of propoganda for both sides

-

That of the hellenes

http://history-of-macedonia.com/wor...based-their-propaganda-in-a-misunderstanding/

And that of the American Chronicle (clearly a proxy of FYROM )

http://www.americanchronicle.com/articles/view/115377

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[Ajidica]

Just lump the entire Balkans into one big country called "Land of Crazy Nationalists". It can't be any worse then the current situation.

 

[christos200]

Macedonia will always be greek, no matter what the fyromians propaganda says.

 

[Tee Kay]

Maybe we should start referring to Greece as the Former Ottoman Republic of Greece.

 

[Jehoshua]

Well its not the "Land of crazy nationalists". Its the land of balkanisation , they named the whole phenomena of nation dividing nationalism and its resulting manifestation after the region

 

[Ajidica]

Maybe we should start referring to Greece as the Former Ottoman Republic of Greece.

I retract my earlier name and completely endorse this one!

 

[Winner]

It's petty and absurd. Greece should have other things on its "mind" than fuelling a useless dispute with a small neighbouring country over its name. It's not like Macedonia wants to name itself "Republic of the True Greece" or something like that.

Also, even considering blocking Macedonia's EU accession talks over something so trivial just makes Greece look a bit... insecure.

Maybe we should start referring to Greece as the Former Ottoman Republic of Greece.

Ottoman and Republic? Nah. What were the administrative sub-units called in the OE?

EDIT, answer: eyalet.

 

[Jehoshua]

I retract my earlier name and completely endorse this one!

And its people as the Forgians

 

[ShadowNX]

As is stated before this can only cause tensions between people. Stop introducing yourself to each other with your linage. Just use Greek.

This causes tensions and breeds disrespect between people. It also causes further divides between people by labeling them. By living in the past one can not grow.

 

[christos200]

1) Fyrom has nothing to to do with macedonia so they have no right to use this name.

2)

The speech of Alexander I, when he was admitted to the Olympic games

“Men of Athens…
Had I not greatly at heart the common welfare of Hellas I should not have come to tell you; but I am myself Hellene by descent, and I would not willingly see Hellas exchange freedom for slavery….


If you prosper in this war, forget not to do something for my freedom; consider the risk I have run, out of zeal for the Hellenic cause, to acquaint you with what Mardonius intends, and to save you from being surprised by the barbarians.


I am Alexander of Macedon.”

3) Tito, Yougoslavia communist dicator, wanted the agean see so he renamed, the land know as vardar, macedonia, so he can take the macedonia that greece had freed from the ottomans during the balkan wars.

 

[SerriaFox]

Greece should be kicked out of the Euro and the EU for credit reasons. Then let the one with a balanced budget back in.

 

[madviking]

Can we just have it changed to Makedonia?

 

[filli_noctus]

As the original discussion centred on the classical Kingdom of Macedonia and whether or not it was Greek I would like to introduce this quote from Herodotus.

I happen to know, and I will demonstrate in a subsequent chapter of this history, that these descendants of Perdiccas are, as they themselves claim, of Greek nationality. This was, moreover, recognized by the managers of the Olympic games, on the occasion when Alexander wished to compete and his Greek competitors tried to exclude him on the ground that foreigners were not allowed to take part. Alexander, however, proved his Argive descent, and so was accepted as a Greek and allowed to enter for the foot-race. He came in equal first".

This quote shows Herodotus accepted that Macedonia was Greek but equally demonstrates that others did not as Alexander had to demonstrate he could trace is lineage back to the city of Argos (which is accepted to be Greek) before being allowed to compete at the Olympic Games.

 

[Camikaze]

I don't get it. That is, what's the big deal over one country using whatever name they feel like using? What difference does it actually make if Macedonia is called Macedonia or not? Are they claiming Greek land by doing so or something, or just applying a different geographical definition to the word?

 

[Tee Kay]

Ottoman and Republic? Nah. What were the administrative sub-units called in the OE?

EDIT, answer: eyalet.

Former Ottoman Eyalets of Southern Rumelia and Morea

 

[christos200]

That is fyromian propaganda.

 

[Winner]

Can we just have it changed to Makedonia?

In their language its Republika Makedonija.

---

Area of historical Macedonia according to Wiki:

3) Tito, Yougoslavia communist dicator, wanted the agean see so he renamed, the land know as vardar, macedonia, so he can take the macedonia that greece had freed from the ottomans during the balkan wars.

Just tell me one thing, do you really believe that Macedonia could somehow invade Greece and seize these territories? Really?

Really?!

 

[Mise]

If anyone wants to rename their country Albion or Kent or something I'd be down with that. Most of the English-speaking world is named after something in the UK, and frankly that's awesome. Greece is just being petty and infantile.

 

[Lone Wolf]

Every nation has the right to call itself whatever they want, so "Macedonia" is fine by me and Greece just sounds petty. Macedonian nationalism is more fun then Greek one, though, since Greeks don't have completely ridiculous claims like "Slavic Alexander the Great" and "Byzantium as a Macedonian Empire".

Let us begin with pieces of propoganda for both sides

My favourite piece of Macedonian propaganda is this series by some guy called Risto Stefov. It's a fun, enjoyable read.

 

[Winner]

I don't get it. That is, what's the big deal over one country using whatever name they feel like using? What difference does it actually make if Macedonia is called Macedonia or not? Are they claiming Greek land by doing so or something, or just applying a different geographical definition to the word?

Some Greeks apparently believe that Macedonia is about to claim half of Greece and take it from them if they allow it to use the name

It's about as justified as if Mexicans demanded that USA drops the "of America" part of its name because it could be interpreted as claiming sovereignty over all of Americas.

My favourite piece of Macedonian propaganda is this series by some guy called Risto Stefov. It's a fun, enjoyable read.

I'd love to, but the link doesn't work.