The next defenders of religious freedom in America

[mangxema]

Fighting fire with fire. From their website:

In response to what The Satanic Temple have dubbed a “pernicious encroachment” of “informed consent” laws regarding abortion, the organization is asserting a religious exemption from the burden of state mandated “informational” abortion materials for those who share their deeply held beliefs.

According to their website, “The Satanic Temple believes that the body is inviolable subject to one’s own will alone.” Further, “we strive to make all decisions regarding personal health based on the best scientific understanding of the world, regardless of the religious or political beliefs of others.”

Are they serious? Is this a good idea? What do you guys think?

 

[Timsup2nothin]

Yes they are serious. I find their efforts commendable.

 

[Antilogic]

That is some quality trolling, Satanists.

(Also, good to see you, mang!)

 

[KMRblue1027]

Ah I love a good religious troll.

 

[warpus]

That is some quality trolling, Satanists.

(Also, good to see you, mang!)

I don't see it as a trolling, I see it as a religious group asking to be treated the same way other religious groups are.

If we're going to allow for religious exceptions to things, we must consider them all, and not just the ones from one particular religion.

People seem to think that satanists are just a bunch of jokers. Maybe some of them really believe all that stuff? Maybe they're bona fide satanists? Isn't it offensive to assume that they're not? Imagine if we were talking about Christians here and people assumed that they're not "for real".

 

[EgonSpengler]

I haven't looked around their website. Is this an American organization? If it is, and if they're just trying to call out the influence of religious dogma on public policy, health care in this case, then good for them. If they're genuinely asking for accurate medical information on religious grounds, then I don't quite support them. Everyone should get accurate medical information, imo, religion be damned (pardon the pun).

Imagine if we were talking about Christians here and people assumed that they're not "for real".

I do frequently wonder about that, actually.

 

[mangxema]

More intrigue:

In response to a recent School Board decision in Orange County, Florida that allows for the dissemination of religious materials in public schools, The Satanic Temple has announced they will follow suit by providing Satanic materials to students during the new school year. Among the materials to be distributed are pamphlets related to the Temple’s tenets, philosophy and practice of Satanism, as well as information about the legal right to practice Satanism in school.
...
The Satanic Temple’s spokesperson, Lucien Greaves, explains, “We would never seek to establish a precedent of disseminating our religious materials in public schools because we believe our constitutional values are better served by respecting a strong separation of Church and State. However, if a public school board is going to allow religious pamphlets and full Bibles to be distributed to students -- as is the case in Orange County, Florida -- we think the responsible thing to do is to ensure that these students are given access to a variety of differing religious opinions, as opposed to standing idly by while one religious voice dominates the discourse and delivers propaganda to youth.”

The book in question is here.

 

[kramerfan86]

I respect their mission and respect that they are a group that picked the most trolly name possible for the opponent they are facing.

 

[Borachio]

I think there's something irretrievably self-contradictory about Satanism. (Not that other religions aren't also contradictory, of course.)

It's like a religion that doesn't even try to fool itself.

 

[Lights]

I like the book. But cerberus doesn't have 3 heads.

 

[IglooDame]

Yeah, the FSM (Flying Spaghetti Monster, for the three people in OT that don't already know it) is kind of easily dismissible because everyone knows it is trolling. But Satanists are tougher, they've been around under various names for a long long time, and Christians are the first ones to assert that Satan does actually exist.

 

[Tahuti]

Yeah, the FSM (Flying Spaghetti Monster, for the three people in OT that don't already know it) is kind of easily dismissible because everyone knows it is trolling. But Satanists are tougher, they've been around under various names for a long long time, and Christians are the first ones to assert that Satan does actually exist.

The Church of Satan (I'm aware this one is distinct from the Satanic Temple mentioned in the OP) see Satan explicitly as a non-deity and identify as a non-religion. It is mostly a bunch of showmanship and hardly worshipping Satan as an actual deity or even a bona fide religion - even though they got religious tax exemption.

Now, the Satanic Temple more seems to be troll directed for socially 'progressive' causes.

 

[classical_hero]

It is good to see them showing their true colours.

 

[Arakhor]

CH, aren't you the one who likes to flash out the line about Satan's greatest deceit being to convince people he doesn't exist? How could this possibly be a greater deceit?

 

[gay_Aleks]

If Satan was real, he'd enjoy a religion in his name constructed only and only for tax-evasion.

 

[Borachio]

But if Satan did exist, and was the personification of evil (let's say), why would any living person worship him/her/it?

And if Satan didn't exist, why would any living person worship him/her/it?

 

[Farm Boy]

But if Satan did exist, and was the personification of evil (let's say), why would any living person worship him/her/it?

And if Satan didn't exist, why would any living person worship him/her/it?

In that good/evil as constructed roughly in the Judeo-Christian sense is the individual struggle between self interest and communal interest it isn't totally unreasonable to pick out a deity focused on self empowerment rather than communal health. One could even say that if only everyone acted in their own best interests then the interests of all would be better served. Sounds kinda like unfettered capitalism, really.

 

[Tahuti]

But if Satan did exist, and was the personification of evil (let's say), why would any living person worship him/her/it?

And if Satan didn't exist, why would any living person worship him/her/it?

For LaVeyan Satanists (i.e. Church of Satan, not Satanic Temple or theistic Satanist who worship Satan as a literal being) Satan represents the rejection of Christian values. They don't worship Satan, a LaVeyan Satanists worships herself/himself.

I doubt it can called a bona fide religion, given that is explicitly designed to mock other faiths, notably Christianity and Islam. Likewise, Scientology is a pseudoreligion, since it simply seeks to explicitly define already existing religions as the result of an alien conspiracy (and make lots of money doing so).

Christianity wasn't designed to mock Judaism, even if it ran counter to it at some points. René Guenon raised an interesting point that any self-declared religion that explicitly targeted another pre-existing religion was a pseudoreligion. Interestingly, he considered Buddhism to be a pseudoreligion as well because he considered it to be conceived as simple Anti-Hinduism, much like Satanism of any form can be viewed as simple Anti-Christianity (or inverse Christianity).

 

[bhsup]

For LaVeyan Satanists (i.e. Church of Satan, not Satanic Temple or theistic Satanist who worship Satan as a literal being) Satan represents the rejection of Christian values. They don't worship Satan, a LaVeyan Satanists worships herself/himself.

Or maybe that's just what they want you to think. Could it not be that they are attempting to take the whole "the greatest trick Satan performed was convincing the world he didn't exist" thing to the next level? An entire cult secretly worshiping Satan while denying that the object of their worship even exists?

And that also brings up a good point. If they claim Satan does not exist and don't actually worship anything, then it's not really a religion. It's just a philosophy or creed.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

And that also brings up a good point. If they claim Satan does not exist and don't actually worship anything, then it's not really a religion. It's just a philosophy or creed.

Buddhists don't worship anything, and Buddhism is pretty widely considered to be a religion. Most Taoists don't worship the path, they just follow it. I'd say for the most part the whole 'religion=worshiping invisible Gods' business is a European/Mediterranean thing.