Discussion in 'Civ4 - Succession Games' started by Bede, Apr 24, 2006.
respectfully suggest you push for the dyes before getting everything in order.
We may soon have the dyes if we can overcome Rome's cultural influence.
These two lists sum it up.
First thing I did was swap our civics to Hereditary Rule and Theocracy. It hurt our production of the Ironworks at Seville but I canceled that job anyway and went to producing troops instead, then I recalled the forces on the island to the north. Time enough to clean out that nest when the mainland of Rome is in our hands.
Then I moved everything on the Roman island back to Neapolis. Julio sent his cavalry right at the town from Antium and I wanted two things, to get his troops in the open and protect that town. Taking Antium at that point wuold have left us in a pocket and no good way to reinforce as there would have been no access.
That worked as expected while I put together the transport network into Ardea from Cordoba and Hurrian. Shipping out of Cordoba into Ardea put reinforcements (mostly cannon with CR 1 and Barrage 1 promotions) at the gates of Neapolis in two moves. My target was Circei on the coast, then on to Antium, then Cumae, then Pisae.
Lots of Frigates were equipped to bombard Circei and sent up the coast, sinking the occasional Roman frigate on the way. Once enough cannons and frigates were ready then it was across the hills to Circei. Caesar had cooperated all along by sending his cavalry in small numbers against Neapolis. He killed the occasional rifleman that way but his survivors were easy pickings after that.
Circei was captured by battery fire (lost two), reinforecments arrived by sea and land and then it was time to capture Antium. The batteries did their job nicely and the town fell to Pinch promoted Grenadiers and Cavalry mopping up the catapults.
Julio landed a two galleon loads at Barcelona at one point but a conscript rifle and a couple of cavalry ended that threat.
I renegotiated all of the deals with Toku except the one for gold and managed to reap 20gpt from him for fewer resources supplied.
The Forbidden Palace is building in Neapolis as the city is fairly secure. Julio has no more cavalry left unless they are hiding in the far north or at Pisae which has so many ships in it I can't see all the defenders as the Frigates have had a look in everywhere. Bismarck is shipping him horses and I would really like to break that deal but Otto is unhappy that we attacked his bosom buddy.
The economy is a bit of a wreck but changing to Hereditary Rule helped with the war weariness. The Globe was built in Cordoba and the town has been drafting a rifleman every three turns or so with little impact on its other outputs. It still needs a barracks.
Pound on Cumae with the Frigates while the assault force moves into position then hit the town with the Barrage promoted cannon. It should fall easily. There is a galleon load of reinforcement on the way if it proves a harder nut to crack.
Once Cumae is on our hands we can put together a transport network to serve the advance on Pisae but keep one galleon handy for the Cordoba-Ardea- Neapolis-Circei route.
There is a worker team outside Neapolis to moine the iron and get the road network straightened out.
Our Roman Holiday may have started a little prematurely but we are on a roll now. Grenadiers and rifles with Combat 1 and Pinch promotions and Cannon with CR 1 and Barrage 1 are the way to finish the Roman counter clockwise around his island. Unless you want to pile up an army at Circei and take on Rome directly
I think I'll leave it for Kylearan to fix the economy.
@romeo, since Kylearan won't be back in play for a bit, do you want to try your hand?
nice work bede
Since romeo didn't pick up the hammer, Kylearan is up!
my life's gone back to normal again finally, and I'll have plenty of time to play SGs again.
I see the game. I will read what had happened during the last turnsets today, and will play tomorrow.
We've fallen quite a bit behind technologically, and our economy is not up to the task of catching up again. Let's see what I can do...
First, I switch civics from Theocracy to Free Religion. We save 9gpt, gain additional happiness in our cities, and an extra 10% research, all in exchange for 2xp for our units. While the extra 2xp are very nice while at war, I think we have to think long-term: I think we can finish off Rome without Theocracy, and I don't want to fight the next opponent with a tech disadvantage.
Then I notice we are paying 36gpt in unit upkeep. I take a look which units we might be able to disband. For example, there's still the scout fortified on our starting continent, originally to keep the barbs at bay. That's no longer needed, so begone with him! I also disband some obsolete garrison units, as I think with a strong navy and Nationhood, we can cope with any attempted landings.
Going through our cities, I have to voice my usual complaint: Why are so many cities not set to max growth? Especially the cities on our eastern island have a lot of potential to grow, and yet do so only very slowly. Their build orders I do not understand as well: For example, both Kushans and Valencia are building harbors, although they don't (yet) have health problems, and with their mininum trade routes the extra +50% trade route yield won't be so hot either. On the other hand, most of our cities lack crucial improvements like universities and observatories, and that at 1900AD! Plus, some unhappy cities lack cheap theatres and markets. I leave some cities on military, but switch some back to building infrastructure.
I sell Monty clams for 11gpt, figuring that an extra health won't help him as much as 11gpt does help us. I also think we can't really afford paying Toku 34gpt, so now we give him our only marble instead (and, as before, horses) for gold and fur. Saladin gets cows for 8gpt.
Research is fired up again at 50%.
1902AD: I send two galleons on a trip to our eastern island. On the island are some city raider riflemen and some medic units which should really be fighting on the front, not guarding cities. On the Roman front, I advance the stacks Bede nicely had prepared on Cumae.
Most (all) units recently produced on our home continent are promoted already. Again: Please do not promote freshly produced units, even if you think they will get these specific promotions anyway! Sometimes, other promotions might be needed, or they are needed to heal the unit (after the stack has suffered collateral damage, for example).
After seeing just how many units we have to fight Rome, I switch even more cities to infrastructure.
1904AD: Madrid starts to build Wall Street.
Cumae falls, although we lose a cannon and a rifleman in the process.
Scouting Pisae reveals that Julius has at least 14 galleons in the city, plus potentially more I can't see because of the stack display bug! I hope the navy AI has been upgraded for Warlords...
1906AD: During the IT, we lose a rifleman to a Roman cav. Bismarck completes the Kremlin, and Pisae gets prepared for the attack by our frigates.
1908AD: Caesar asks for straight peace, and I almost die laughing. On our eastern island, the city raider units move unto the galleons, and only now do I notice that two workers are fortified there (even if the island still lacks tile improvements, like farms and cottages?!?). I wake them up and send them to work.
Our attack stack reaches Pisae, and I wonder what dangerous units might be hidden under all the galleons?!?
1910AD: Ouch! Six cavs attack out of Pisae, but we win all fights miraculously. I still see several cannons and cavs, so I decide we won't have enough units yet to take the city now and retreat the attack stack to heal and reinforce. Maybe we get lucky and Julius moves out the units in his galleons, where they are easier to kill.
1912AD: Our stack gets attacked by three cannons. We kill one, and lose one cav.
1914AD: Too bad, Julius leaves his units in Pisae. More units join the healing attack stack.
1916AD: Assembly Line comes in, and I set us on Scientific Methods next. I debated Fascism to fight WW, but I think we have to make peace soon anyway, and Sci Meth leads to all kinds of goodies like Artillery, Biology, ...
Our attack stack advances on Pisae again, and three galleons unload reinforcements at Pisae, too. Embrace yourself for Roman suicide cannons...
1918AD: ...which do not attack. I guess the AI has flagged the cannons in Pisae as "city attack cannons" to load unto the galleons one day, not defensive ones. After suiciding most of our cannons (none retreats ), I'm glad I brought the city raider riflemen, as they get rid of the most dangerous defenders easily. After killing 16 defenders(!), we finally take Pisae (and sink a gazillion galleons in the process).
I trade Assembly Line to Saladin for Railroad and 110 gold, and cancel our silk-for-gpt deal with Elizabeth and trade her silks for incense instead. Research gets shut down for one turn, to upgrade our city raider riflemen to infantry.
1920AD: The city raider rifles get upgraded, and the stack starts to heal in Pisae.
War weariness is unbearable now (IIRC +18 in Madrid...), and we're running 60% culture and 10% science. But Rome has only two cities left on the continent. One city only has three riflemen in it; what Rome itself has as defense can only be seen next turn, when the frigates arrive. What shall we do?
My vote would be to capture these last two cities, if[/i] Julius does not upgrade his defenders to Machine Gunners (he could do this), probably Rome first to releave Cume from its cultural pressure. One problem is that we only have two cannons left on that continent plus one we could ferry over from home (sorry for that), but the frigates could take care of the city defenses, and the city raider infantry could be used to attack the riflemen. If we then lose some of our countless grenadiers or riflemen, I wouldn't care - we have to fight our next war with better units anyway, and losing some units would do our economy some good. Opinions?
I haven't optimized the cities yet because of this pending decision.
Here's the save.
Looks like I left you with more than enough to work with, huh? Both economically and militaryily .
I would claim all of the Roman island whatever it costs in losses and leave him his three cities on the eastern island.
And I await your tuning of the economy with great anticipation.
Let's grab those last 2 cities. Arty for our next conquest?
ky, i defer to your expertise. IMIO, I'm hanging on to Civ3 too tightly and I'm too reluctant to go for growth rather than money.
take what you can from the Romans, without worring about the military loses. I agree with going to Rome first.
do we have oil?
it looks like we agree on capturing the last two Roman cities on that island. Let's hope Caesar won't upgrade his defenders, and won't have too many units in Rome!
I think the next player can start to advance on Rome on the next turn, when the first units of our attack stack in Pisae have healed. We have enough frigates to have Rome stripped off its defenses until our forces arrive. I only hope the two cannons and the three city raider infantry are enough to deal with any city garrison riflemen we find, but I'd also say we can afford to throw away some cheap grenadiers first to weaken them before attacking with the infantry.
Research will be nearly non-existant until we make peace unfortunately. I think we have enough units to finish this war, so all cities are on infrastructure. There are several units on MP duty on our home continent.
I think we can make another land-based attack with lots of artillery and infantry while researching tanks and battleships, and then can apply the Sirian doctrine to the target after the next. Question is, who shall we attack with arty/infantry? Or shall we wait until tanks for our next war?
Regarding oil, we do not know yet if we have any - we're still researching Scientific Methods.
Who's up next?
And the roster
grahamiam - up
Bede - waiting for a shot at Julio
Whomp - got us into Rome
Admiral Kutzov - sank the Arab navy
Kylearan - kept up the pressure
ok, i'll see what I can do. I only have tonight as I'm away again this weekend. Will try to play at least 5 turns, but no promises
Preflight check: Find an unmoved Frigate, so move him towards Rome and find a Frigate. Look at Rome 1st before trying to Kill it (lost ) but find 6 rifles (1 with CG2), 1 Cav, and 2 cannons. 3 workers for a booby prize
T1: 1921 AD Move Frigates into range of Rome. We are down Sci Method to everyone, and Combustion to England, Arabs, and Germany.
Our Frigate kills a Roman one near Setia, whose defenses I drop to 32%. SoD in Pisae still needs another turn of healing. Ship-chain a cannon up towards town.
IBT: kill a Cav that Attacks Pisae.
T2: 1922 AD Kill the lucky Frigate near Rome, then use 4 Frigates to drop the defenses from 80% to 48%. Start moving towards Rome. Have 1 big stack and 1 small stack (3 rifles) as decoy.
IBT: Rome uses cannon on small stack, loses cannon. Saladin offers corn for silk, I sell him crabs instead.
T3: 1923 AD Near Pisae, move a second group out with 2 cannons, Gren attacks Roman rifle protecting iron, wins.
Rome bombed down to 8%, Setia to 22%
IBT: Saladin demands we cancel deals with Aztecs, no thanks
T4: 1924 AD Bomb Setia down to 10%, Rome to 0%. 1st wave reaches Rome's doorstep.
IBT: Saladin wants open borders, ok.
T5: 1925 AD 2 Cannons crash into Rome, 1 retreats. 3 Infantry kill 3 rifles (the CG2 ones), Grens kill 3 rifles and a cannon and we take the city + 144g + 3 workers.
1 rifle protects the city, 1 protects the injured stack, 3 Grens will join the 2nd wave which now moves towards the last city.
IBT: cannon attacks the Gren stack and we lose 1.
T6: 1926 AD Satia down to 0%, send in 2 Cannon, lose both. Inf kills cav, Gren dies to rifle, Gren dies to rifle, 2 rifles kill 2 rifles, and 2 cavs kill a rifle and cannon and we take the city + 165g.
Ceaser's Palace is now in Arpinum.
We can now sign peace if we want. I must finish though, as my son just woke up and we have to go out towns are probably a mess thanks to all the WW.
ky, I t was thinking about the promotions today. You found some promoted troops in the homeland? Not sure if you know, but we had an invasion to fend off; that may be where they came from
Nice going Gman! Time for some economic stability methinks.
That could be and I massively upgraded our units (archers etc.) which were already promoted.
Nah, I am the bozo who ran the promotions before leaving home. A bad habit I've formed, I guess. I'll see if I can break it when next we go to war
Got it and play it tomorrow. Another chance to do the economic thing with Isabella.
Great work grahamiam! We lost a lot fewer units than I had thought. Has Rome some intact buildings, especially wonders?
I think peace is much needed for our catching-up efforts. Who do we want to attack next? Saladin, because of managable logistics? Or somebody else, either the tech leader to stop him, or the weakest opponent because that way we can still use our outdated units while going for tanks?
So, plan for war while enjoying the respite of peace, eh?
Personally I think Monte needs to have his feathers trimmed. And I am pretty sure he meets the criteria of "weaker".
peace will get that ungodly lux tax down from 60%, so that is good. build some jails in critical unit-pumping cities for the next war, + lots of infantry. imho, let's go for air-units rather than arty, as they can move faster and having air superiority (even just fighters) makes things easier.
imho, expanding into Saladin (our NW neighbor) seems like a good idea as turning the beast towards the Aztecs will take some time. Also, being closer to our FP will make those cities more productive and we can probably get Japan to slam into them from the N, thus splitting the attack forces and leaving the AI in it's standard Turtle Position 
I have no evidence to support, but we should take on bizzie or lizzie next.
Sal is fourth on the food chain. unless we're going for easy snacks.
fyi, I'm on holiday starting tomorrow. i have no idea what access i'll have until I get there. if you don't here from me promptly, don't wait
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