The Sword of Islam: RFC Medieval Middle East

No, it's also the correct answer you get when you offer yourself as a vassal to the AI, and you're too powerful for them. The power criterion isn't necessarily the same as when you want to be released, it's probably lower. You don't normally see it since human vassals are disabled in BTS.

But I want him to be my vassal, not the other way around. And he wasn't too powerful to become my vassal. If he was too powerful to become my vassal then it would say "You must be joking" or "We're doing fine on our own." So I don't understand why it's coming up like that.

Did you implement a voluntary vassal limit?


That's what IDW is about really, and it's only a portion of culture. Remember that culture is rather silly concept, especially in a mod like this one, where the actual culture of the natives is not represented. It's more like the populace accepting the new ruler because he is capable. Exactly such things happened many times e.g. in Syria, Egypt or Persia, where people were ruled by different foreigners all the time.

Also, spies can do the same, in BTS and elsewhere.

Ok, that makes sense. But I'm don't understand the spies sentence. What can they do?

I didn't even think of this - but I think they should provide culture so it's fixed now.

Your changes list doesn't include the Orthodox shrine. Was this changed as well?

What do you think about giving the Intelligence Agency +3 to Spies/Assassins so that Spies start out with two promotions?
 
I thought I should mention the fact that you forgot to change the Dawn of Man texts for the Sindh and the Seljuks ;)
 
The Sword of Islam 0.3.4 has been released.

You can download it from Sourceforge. For bug reports and other feedback, please use the new 0.3.4 thread here.
 
One thing that has always bothered me is the relative uniformity of CivIV armies. It may just be my playstyle but I find myself exclusively building lancers for offense, marksmen for defense, and a couple of trebuchets for sieges. I know some people prefer horse archers for their movement, but simply replacing lancers with horse arches does not expand the diversity. This is quite unlike armies of the era.

I was thinking of having each unit cost X gold per turn with better units like lancers costing more than spearmen. In the current system cities support X number of units without regard to the type. This could be changed to cities putting up X gold per turn to support units.

I don't know if this is possible to code or if it is even a good idea.
 
One thing that has always bothered me is the relative uniformity of CivIV armies. It may just be my playstyle but I find myself exclusively building lancers for offense, marksmen for defense, and a couple of trebuchets for sieges. I know some people prefer horse archers for their movement, but simply replacing lancers with horse arches does not expand the diversity. This is quite unlike armies of the era.

I was thinking of having each unit cost X gold per turn with better units like lancers costing more than spearmen. In the current system cities support X number of units without regard to the type. This could be changed to cities putting up X gold per turn to support units.

I don't know if this is possible to code or if it is even a good idea.

On that note, you could have something like Medieval II TW, where peasant infantry cost no upkeep when they are stationed in cities, while knights and heavy infantry cost a lot more to maintain. The question though is that, units take a while to produce, in most cases, so is it really worth it? And will the AI respond to such a system correctly?
 
One thing that has always bothered me is the relative uniformity of CivIV armies. It may just be my playstyle but I find myself exclusively building lancers for offense, marksmen for defense, and a couple of trebuchets for sieges. I know some people prefer horse archers for their movement, but simply replacing lancers with horse arches does not expand the diversity. This is quite unlike armies of the era.

I was thinking of having each unit cost X gold per turn with better units like lancers costing more than spearmen. In the current system cities support X number of units without regard to the type. This could be changed to cities putting up X gold per turn to support units.

I don't know if this is possible to code or if it is even a good idea.

Very complex to code and nearly impossible to make the AI smart about it. Given the simplicity of CIV4 combat I don't think this is fitting. In general, I think most play the same way, with other units being extra "counters" (i.e. Pikeman & Maceman/HeavySwordsman). Only thing that bothers me here really is that Spearmen line isn't really useful in SoI, even though I've made them much cheaper than in other mods. Possibly they should have something like +10% or +20% City Defense.

I've been making a Sengoku period mod that's also been on hold for some time; it uses a system similar to Total War that is simple and AI friendly:
- Ashigaru units count as civilians (which means some are upkeep-free from civics)
- Samurai units are limited, i.e. you can have 2 + 1 per city Samurai units of all types
- Max. 1 Warrior Monk per Temple; Max. 1 Ninja per Ninja House, Max. 1 Geisha per Geisha House etc.
This works and forces army diversification but I'm not sure if there's any point in complicating SoI like this (there it was needed because there's little to no tech tree, and nearly all units are available at the same time).
 
Very complex to code and nearly impossible to make the AI smart about it. Given the simplicity of CIV4 combat I don't think this is fitting. In general, I think most play the same way, with other units being extra "counters" (i.e. Pikeman & Maceman/HeavySwordsman). Only thing that bothers me here really is that Spearmen line isn't really useful in SoI, even though I've made them much cheaper than in other mods. Possibly they should have something like +10% or +20% City Defense.

That's too bad. I rarely see Spearmen as well. On the other hand the AI sure love their Marksmen.

I've been making a Sengoku period mod that's also been on hold for some time; it uses a system similar to Total War that is simple and AI friendly:
- Ashigaru units count as civilians (which means some are upkeep-free from civics)
- Samurai units are limited, i.e. you can have 2 + 1 per city Samurai units of all types
- Max. 1 Warrior Monk per Temple; Max. 1 Ninja per Ninja House, Max. 1 Geisha per Geisha House etc.
This works and forces army diversification but I'm not sure if there's any point in complicating SoI like this (there it was needed because there's little to no tech tree, and nearly all units are available at the same time).

I like this.

Does changing civics reset your stability? If you have no anarchy for a long time and you're doing well your stability is usually high. If you decide to switch civics it temporarily brings your stability down significantly, but are there other permanent changes from anarchy?
 
Article on wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Massacre_of_the_Latins

~20 years before the crusade, all Latins (Venetians, Genoans and Pisans) in Constantinople were killed, expelled or enslaved and sold to the Turks. This is the reason why Venetians and other Latins were hostile towards the Greeks. Not saying that the Greeks were asking for it as Italian merchants in Constantinople weren't exactly nice, fighting with each other, setting up fires etc.

The massacre I explained - the hostilies turn into a culminating point and the Greeks start killing Venetians and Genoans in your cities. You can stop it, or let the killing continue. Both options are bad, obviously - you can get some gold and happiness + *possible* crusade later, or pay gold, face multiple revolts and unhappiness, but fear no crusade. The AI will opt for the "historical" option.

The crusade spawns a small fleet & army (3-4 Foot Knights, 2-3 Trebuchets, Italian Crossbowman & Infantry) led by Boniface of Montferrat, and follows up with a historical revolt in the city (that puts the walls down).

How does this affect the companies? If you kick them out, do they ever come back?
 
I like this.

I was thinking about another possibility today - limited resources a'la Civ5:
- each Iron, Horse, Sulfur, Copper provides 3-5 units of the actual resource, total amount is displayed on the screen
- swordsmen, axemen etc. cost 1 Iron each, horsemen & horse archer 1 horse each, heavy cavalry 1 horse + 1 iron, cannons 1 copper + 1 sulfur etc.

This way you'd have limited good units, filling the rest with spearmen, archers and mercenaries. Just thinking aloud cause it's certainly nothing I'd do in near future, although there's a modcomp for this I think. Also, back to CIV4 combat - realistic armies have a point in Total War because of battles; in CIV4 combat is pretty much binary, strongest unit wins, and fighting with levies would be just suiciding them.

Does changing civics reset your stability? If you have no anarchy for a long time and you're doing well your stability is usually high. If you decide to switch civics it temporarily brings your stability down significantly, but are there other permanent changes from anarchy?

It doesn't reset your stability, but apart from the temporary hit, there is also a permanent penalty for every turn spent in anarchy (usually -3 per turn, but can be higher if your stability is very high). This is from vanilla RFC, although Golden Age in SoI works like in BTS, so you can avoid the hit.

The penalty is also 2/3 of normal with Epic speed, since anarchy lasts longer.

How does this affect the companies? If you kick them out, do they ever come back?

Yeah, after 25 years they'll start coming back.
 
Limiting resources to units would make it impossible to win domination.
 
I have often thought about something like this. i played a board game once where you had a general unit which gained experience. A higher level general could field larger armies. Perhaps something like this could be implemented. limiting units based on resources is not a good idea as it wouldn't allow you any options to increase the limit once all the resources available were used up. One based on general units, or somehow tied to the idea of supply lines might be better as then it would give you more options.

So if you had a general unit he could get promotions like cavalry tactics, melee tactics etc, which would allow you to increase the number of regiments of each type you could control.

Perhaps different civs's starting generals would have different starting promotions which would vary the way each civ s millitary was built.

Another broken aspect of the military in civ is the use of archers, which civ 5 attempted to fix by allowing you to attack from a distance (which I don't like). However, in real warfare archers were used for much more then just guarding cities.

Also, every time I see a catapult defending against a horse warrior i cringe. I have always thought that you should have to attach melee units to siege units to work as guards and an unguarded siege unit should not have any defence (like a worker)


also, I am curious why you changed the name of the mamluk UU? Is it because of what happens when you google Toassin?
 
lol @ googling Toassin. :lol:
 
The Sword of Islam 0.3.5 has been released.

You can download it from Sourceforge. For bug reports and other feedback, please use the new 0.3.5 thread here.

Sorry for the streak of new versions, but there was a couple of issues that had to be fixed to make sure the latest version is actually playable & stable. 0.3.5 is save-compatible with 0.3.4.x.
 
The AI still doesn't know how to use religious prosecutors. Playing as Ajmer I gifted one to my vassal Malwa and it just stood there for hundreds of years.
Spoiler :


The barb dhows that spawn on the Indian Ocean, on an ocean tile surrounded by ocean, aren't really threatening as they can't move.
Spoiler :
 
embryodead said:
No, it's also the correct answer you get when you offer yourself as a vassal to the AI, and you're too powerful for them. The power criterion isn't necessarily the same as when you want to be released, it's probably lower. You don't normally see it since human vassals are disabled in BTS.

Here is the relevant code:

Code:
if (GC.getGameINLINE().getAdjustedPopulationPercent((VictoryTypes)i) > 0 || GC.getGameINLINE().getAdjustedLandPercent((VictoryTypes)i) > 0)
			{
				if (bLandThreat && bPopulationThreat)
				{
					return DENIAL_POWER_YOU;

Does this mean that if you add the civ as your vassal that puts you over the top for a Domination Victory, then they'll say you've grown too powerful for us? Or is it just meeting the Land Threat and Population Threat levels, which I think is defined here:

Code:
for (int i = 0; i < GC.getNumVictoryInfos(); i++)
		{
			bool bPopulationThreat = true;
			if (GC.getGameINLINE().getAdjustedPopulationPercent((VictoryTypes)i) > 0)
			{
				bPopulationThreat = false;

				int iThreshold = GC.getGameINLINE().getTotalPopulation() * GC.getGameINLINE().getAdjustedPopulationPercent((VictoryTypes)i);
				if (400 * getTotalPopulation(!isAVassal()) > 3 * iThreshold)
				{
					return DENIAL_VICTORY;
				}

				if (!atWar(getID(), eTeam))
				{
					if (400 * (getTotalPopulation(isAVassal()) + GET_TEAM(eTeam).getTotalPopulation()) > 3 * iThreshold)
					{
						bPopulationThreat = true;


Code:
bool bLandThreat = true;
			if (GC.getGameINLINE().getAdjustedLandPercent((VictoryTypes)i) > 0)
			{
				bLandThreat = false;

				int iThreshold = GC.getMapINLINE().getLandPlots() * GC.getGameINLINE().getAdjustedLandPercent((VictoryTypes)i);
				if (400 * getTotalLand(!isAVassal()) > 3 * iThreshold)
				{
					return DENIAL_VICTORY;
 
That's only because we rock! :band:

Can you please get nerf it for non-Islamic civs that have Cairo (e.g. I don't think Mansa Musa can even get through Cairo with his baggage if the Christians controlled it)?

Did Mansa happen to you when you were not either the Fatamids, Ayyubids, or Mamluks?
 
Did Mansa happen to you when you were not either the Fatamids, Ayyubids, or Mamluks?

Don't know...because I've not tried to conquer Cairo before 1350, and Mansa appears in the late 1300's.
 
The barb dhows that spawn on the Indian Ocean, on an ocean tile surrounded by ocean, aren't really threatening as they can't move.
:eek:
That's awesome, you can upgrade your own boats by attacking them whenever you want !
Wait, is that what they're meant for ? :mischief:
 
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