The third UHV of Byzantium is too easy

[TercioViejo]

I think that the third UHV is still very easy, because if you have already achieved the second UHV as a result you already have the game won, you should only decrease the proportion of research or steal the gold from the pope and wait for the Ottomans to destroy them instantly.

Constantinople only needs a cathedral and a racecourse to stay as the most cultured city

I think it would be better to restore the Roman Empire or be the first nation to enter the Renaissance. The reason for this is because the Byzantine empire was the bridge to the classical world, in addition to the fact that the intellectual refugees from Greece brought with them knowledge that led to the renaissance in Italy and historically the fall of constantinople was also the end of the middle ages.


And thanks for the good work you have done with the mod I follow it for a few years, sorry for my bad english xd

 

[AbsintheRed]

I think that the third UHV is still very easy, because if you have already achieved the second UHV as a result you already have the game won, you should only decrease the proportion of research or steal the gold from the pope and wait for the Ottomans to destroy them instantly.

Constantinople only needs a cathedral and a racecourse to stay as the most cultured city

I think it would be better to restore the Roman Empire or be the first nation to enter the Renaissance. The reason for this is because the Byzantine empire was the bridge to the classical world, in addition to the fact that the intellectual refugees from Greece brought with them knowledge that led to the renaissance in Italy and historically the fall of constantinople was also the end of the middle ages.


And thanks for the good work you have done with the mod I follow it for a few years, sorry for my bad english xd

Thanks!
I absolutely agree about the 3rd Byzantine UHV being too easy, or even pointless.
To be the first nation to enter the renaissance sounds great, that idea fits perfectly thematically.
Unfortunately I'm not sure if it's possible to have a tech related goal for them balance-wise.
They need to have severe tech penalties because of their early and relatively developed start.
A big empire is also needed for the civ, which makes teching with Byzantium even harder.

 

[Genghis Khaiser]

How do you achieve the 1st UHV on time? Like, where to build settlers and so on.

 

[Rafaelito]

The first goal is just a matter of conquering with your spawning troops on the Mediterranean (Belisarius army). Conquer 6 cities, leave then undefended for a while so you can keep fighting with your units.
The second and the third goal are straight forward, just survive the barbarian invasion and kill the arabs and you should be good.

 

[Rafaelito]

As a hardcore byzantine player I have to admit that I really liked this idea of changing the 3rd UHV to be the first to enter the renaissance. It makes totally sense if we ponder the outcome had Constantinople not fallen to the Ottomans. Then there is no Italian renaissance (at least not on that time period).
Perhaps, in order to help the necessary tech research power to achieve this goal, some great people should simply spawn in the empire as of unique events, like historical philosophers or scholars that fled to italy during the fall of the empire or those that stayed until the very end.
The one that I can remember from the top of my head is Manuel Chrysoloras, who strongly influenced Italy with his teachings.
Here is a full list of greek scholars for reference: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greek_scholars_in_the_Renaissance

Obviously those people would never have exiled to Italy had the empire remained strong and prosperous, therefore it is fair to say they would have boosted the empire science wise.

 

[gilgames]

Imo balancing this lategame teching for Byz is a super difficult task, therefor i would recommand something else. Maybe have a road network of 500 tiles or have x traderoutes and xy merchant ships. Or create a safe route to Paris (ie: from capital to capital, you are at peace and have OB with everyone). Or some ahistorical uhv, like have a colony or conquer 5 capitals (1/nation). idk

 

[Rafaelito]

Indeed it is a very difficult task but I believe it can be done. Maybe some rebalancing in terms of GP tech discovery (boost the tech research power generated by a GP discovery in order to be compatible with the number of cities). Currently, the GP discovery research power is not proportional with the research cost of your empire which is based on the number of cities you have. Therefore, the bigger your empire is, the more useless Great scholars are. On my last Byzantine campaign, after achieving the 2nd UVH (thus the extension of my empire was big enough to cover the required areas) a new born Great scholar was worth only 1 turn of the tech I was currently researching, in other words, useless. My tech discoveries ended up strongly relying on espionage missions over Venice, which was able to pop out a new super tech every 4-5 turns.

Should the 3rd UHV become be the first to enter the Renaissance era, then I can only think of a few strategies or game modifications:

1. Rebalance the tech discovery by a GP (doesn't necessarily have to be a super buff but a slight improvement would help).
2. Add the Greek renaissance event as explained on the post above, where new scholars would born in your empire.
3. The player would have to kill all the advanced competitors in order to ensure you will be the first to enter the renaissance.
4. Give away the majority of your cities (the least scientifically productive cities at least) so you would reduce your tech cost.
5. beeline one key tech that would unlock the Renaissance era (e.g. Astronomy).
6. Generate new GPs through the right civics and city focus so you can have endless golden ages to boost your science.

Honestly, I reckon this goal is achievable even without the tech rebalancing or the suggested GP event, although only experienced players would be able to accomplish this.