The White Hand as a 'real' religion

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Warlord
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Dec 27, 2006
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It would be cool to add the White Hand as a new religion. Iirc, the priests of Mulcarn were everywhere (and not only in the Illians cities), so we can assume the White Hand can be spread everywhere, and some civs can be converted to the Illians' cause. I got some ideas :

- It will be the only religion available to the Illians.

- The White Hand religion spanws Ice terrain everywhere in the empire of the civ, and the Ice provides +1 :food:.

- When an ennemy unit enters the land, there is a % chance to spawn a Blizzard which will damage him, just like the Treants mechanic.

- Temples of the Hand and Priests of Winter can be built by every WH civ, and the temples protect the civ from hellish terrain.

- When the Illians complete the Draw, the WH civs won't declare war to the Illians (perhaps a diplo penalty)

- The religion itself can be founded by the ritual (so Illians can't rush and start converting everyone to avoid troubles with the Draw), only Illians can found it. It would be illogical to have this religion without Illians.

- You can build the hero Mokka. If he already exists, it will convert him to your cause. If he died, it will ressurect him. Fiacra the North Wind can be another hero.

- Spreading this religion will lower the AC or freeze it (it means if there is any change, it will be reduced). Demons don't like to enter a cold world...

- The religion makes anyone Evil. So if you want to change your alignment without triggering the Apocalypse (which is annoying...lol), it's an adequate alternative.

- It will grant a diplo bonus with the Illians. It will grant a diplo penalty with everyone else, but the Doviello.

- Ice mana = Temples of the Hand x% faster, and Blizzards are +x% likely to happen.

- The religion wonder would be a Great Frostling Husbandry. 1 unit out of 2 will start with the Frostling promotion. And there are the standard bonus: Ice mana, +1 :gold: for every city with the religion, etc...

- If you have the Barbarian Trait, you will be able to hire a frostling in empty lairs, just like the Clan of Embers in goblin forts.

- If Auric Ascended is built, the civs with the religion start a Golden Age.

- Entering Letum Frigus will add +1 :) in all of your cities, and a diplo bonus with the Illians - and maybe a smaller one with the Doviello.

- The civs with WH won't get the Godslayer when AA is built.

- The religion won't bring additional culture, but science instead, just like AV.

And maybe a new civic: Rationality or Cold Blood or whatever.

Here is a list of the possible effects:
- +10% Millitary unit Production with WH cities
- +1 :hammers: in Ice
- 20% chance to convert defeated units (into frostlings)
- Additionnal Diplo Penalty with everyone non-WH.
- +2 :) in all cities.
- -25% :gp: birth rate
- -25% :culture:
- -25% :mad: Weariness. (That's because people with cold blood are never angry...)
 
I believe Kael actually said that the White Hand is more like a cult than an actual religion (crucify me if I am wrong). They don't even have a god to worship, he is dead. Or at least until you ascend Auric, then the things might be possible, hard to not worship a god if he is going to freeze you like a sardine or feed you to a dragon if you don't
 
The Ljosalfar also worship a dead god. Actually, it was a reply to a previous thread (more religions or something), but it was too large so I created a new thread.
 
The Ljosalfar also worship a dead god. Actually, it was a reply to a previous thread (more religions or something), but it was too large so I created a new thread.

Yes but that 'dead' god came back to life which means that he technically isn't 'dead' anymore.
 
Yes but that 'dead' god came back to life which means that he technically isn't 'dead' anymore.

And Mulcarn also came back to life (Auric Ulvin is a weaker avatar of the god). The Fellowship of Leaves (and Ljosalfar without FoL is like chocolate donuts without chocolate, it doesn't exist) worships Sucellus, the Council of Esus worships Esus, the White Hand worships Mulcarn.
 
And Mulcarn also came back to life (Auric Ulvin is a weaker avatar of the god). The Fellowship of Leaves (and Ljosalfar without FoL is like chocolate donuts without chocolate, it doesn't exist) worships Sucellus, the Council of Esus worships Esus, the White Hand worships Mulcarn.

That's true, but what is also true is that Auric is not a god until ascended. He is Mulcarn's human-form reincarnation and does not possess a god-like power of being able to freeze you if you don't worship him and still freeze you if you do. The White Hand worships Mulcarn, but until they actually ascend Auric back to godhood, they are worshipping a dead god or at the very least, a human with some strange affinity to magic.
 
That would be fun. It could be neat to have an evil religion that slowed the AC and froze stuff, kind of like an icy hell as opposed to a fiery hell terrain hell. The numbers would probly have to be changed though, with +1 food and +1 hammer and everything turns to ice the Illians would get at least 3 food and 1 hammer from each tile without improvements, though they would only be plains for everyone else. Maybe instead of just automatically producing ice the temples could have a general cooling effect on your empire (and the world eventually? Global cooling would be neat).
 
That's true, but what is also true is that Auric is not a god until ascended. He is Mulcarn's human-form reincarnation and does not possess a god-like power of being able to freeze you if you don't worship him and still freeze you if you do. The White Hand worships Mulcarn, but until they actually ascend Auric back to godhood, they are worshipping a dead god or at the very least, a human with some strange affinity to magic.

The White Hand worships the winter (like the FoL who worships the nature) and tries to ascend Auric to godhood. It's a religion like the others, and it was a real (and powerful) religion in AoI.
 
That would be fun. It could be neat to have an evil religion that slowed the AC and froze stuff, kind of like an icy hell as opposed to a fiery hell terrain hell. The numbers would probly have to be changed though, with +1 food and +1 hammer and everything turns to ice the Illians would get at least 3 food and 1 hammer from each tile without improvements, though they would only be plains for everyone else. Maybe instead of just automatically producing ice the temples could have a general cooling effect on your empire (and the world eventually? Global cooling would be neat).

You already have the Deepening to cool the world. And it's very annoying for non-Illians players. I think +1 :food: and +1 :hammers: is too much. The Illians would be overpowered.
 
Well, when you want to destroy the world as the Sheaim, it's a bit annoying to see your beautiful hellish terrain replaced by horrible white snow terrain.

Anyway, the WH is useful if you want to be Evil without raising the AC. Even Evil leaders don't want to destroy the world....
 
Why not make hell terrain immune to deepening? I have rarely built deepening but I did make it repeatable. All those buildings to get first...
 
Well for me this concept looks great...

A new religion tied to the Ilians but not only reserved to these ones. I think it's logical that the white hand becomes a religion as basically a cult is a religion. (in fact i'm asking myself why it was not already the case in FFh)
Same thing can be done for the old Cult of the dragon BTW ;)

Lots of good ideas in the OP even if some needs to be balanced.

Why not a counter of Winter like we have the Armageddon counter at the moment?
The "Icy terrain" can be tied to this counter as Hell Terrain is tied to AC or use a similar mechanism than the propagation of Ancient forests.

Drifa and Mokka can become Religious heroes... (Auric Ascended should too except that Auric is basically an Ilian ;))
 
Drifa shouldn't be a religious hero because he (she?) is only available to the Illians. MaybeFiacra the North Wind (the bird in AoI) can be interesting, though...
 
- It will be the only religion available to the Illians.
Of course if we follow FFh... Except i'm not sure it's a so good idea...
Imagine you won a "holy crusade" against Ilians... why can't you convert them to your religion?

- The White Hand religion spanws Ice terrain everywhere in the empire of the civ, and the Ice provides +1 :food:.
I have to disagree... for me only Ilians should benefit for a +1 food in Icy terrain

- When an ennemy unit enters the land, there is a % chance to spawn a Blizzard which will damage him, just like the Treants mechanic.
Sounds great and not too difficult to code

- Temples of the Hand can be built by every WH civ, and it protects the civ from hellish terrain.
Sounds logical...

- When the Illians complete the Draw, the WH civs won't declare war to the Illians (perhaps a diplo penalty)
sounds logical....

- The religion itself can be founded by the ritual (so Illians can't rush and start converting everyone to avoid troubles with the Draw), only Illians can found it. It would be illogical to have this religion without Illians.
I'm not sure a religion can be tied to a ritual or a wonder...

- You can build the hero Mokka. If he already exists, it will convert him to your cause. If he died, it will ressurect him. Fiacra the North Wind can be another hero.
Mokka is a barbarian, isn't he?
First hero to be able to resurrect,no? What if several people follow the White hand?

- Spreading this religion will lower the AC or freeze it (it means if there is any change, it will be reduced). Demons don't like to enter a cold world...
Why? Do you really think Demons don't like cold?

- The religion makes anyone Evil. So if you want to change your alignment without triggering the Apocalypse (which is annoying...lol), it's an adequate alternative.
Logical...
- It will grant a diplo bonus with the Illians. It will grant a diplo penalty with everyone else, but the Doviello.
I suppose it shouldn't give you a penalty if the leader is following White Hand too ;)
Why the Doviello? Are they tied to Mulcarn too? I don't think so.

- Ice mana = Temples of the Hand x% faster, and Blizzards are +x% likely to happen.
Complicated as there is no such mechanism for the moment IIRC

- The religion wonder would be a Great Frostling Husbandry. 1 unit out of 2 will start with the Frostling promotion. And there are the standard bonus: Ice mana, +1 :gold: for every city with the religion, etc...
Sounds not too logical for me... stay to the "standard" bonus is better for me. (balance^^)

- If you have the Barbarian Trait, you will be able to hire a frostling in empty lairs, just like the Clan of Embers in goblin forts.
Sounds cool...

- If Auric Ascended is built, the civs with the religion start a Golden Age.
every civ with this state religion? A bit powerfull for the ilians, no?

- Entering Letum Frigus will add +1 :) in all of your cities, and a diplo bonus with the Illians - and maybe a smaller one with the Doviello.
Why???

- The civs with WH won't get the Godslayer when AA is built.
I thought there was only one god slayer...

- The religion won't bring additional culture, but science instead, just like AV.
Why? I don't see the point...

And maybe a new civic: Rationality or Cold Blood or whatever.

- +10% Millitary unit Production with WH cities
- +1 hammer in Ice
- 20% chance to convert defeated units (into frostlings)
- Additionnal Diplo Penalty with everyone non-WH.
- +2 :) in all cities.
- -25% :gp: birth rate
- -25% :culture:
- -25% :mad: Weariness. (That's because people with cold blood are never angry...)
Needs a bit of balance I think...
 
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