Tides of Crimson mod - Game 1

haluu

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Tides of Crimson (Fantasy Mod) - Succession Game

Game #1
Please post here if interested in joining us. Thanks!


Mod:. Civ 3: Tides of Crimson v2.92
Succession Game Players Max: 6
2/6 Players currently (4 open slots)
We have started this game, but new players can feel free to jump in at any time! Just leave a post below!

Map Type: Random
Map Size: Normal (12 races)
Difficulty: Monarch
Game Settings: Continents
Race selected for Succession Game: Moon Elves
Rules: 20-turn hand-off. Each player plays 20 turns, then hands off save file to next player.

Tides of Crimson info & Download:

@tjs282 @Arexander @r16 @Nwoll @tomma @Lamabreeder just FYI =)
 
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I'm in! ;)

I've played all my most recent ToC games so far at Emperor, and won (or at least, reached a winning position). I'd propose at least Monarch for this game, so the AIs can pose some challenge -- but without any major risk of being inconvenienced by any still-undiscovered .biq-errors.

Normal size map is fine with me. Though I random-roll most of my epic-games, I prefer getting 60-70% water and Continents/ Archi over Pangaea.

Related to the map-type, my preferred VCs would then be Ultima, Domination, or Diplomatic (roughly in that order). Conquest can get grindy, especially if we have to mop up small islands which require Amphibious units, and Culture-VCs can get really grindy. (Plus, IIRC, the Culture-targets in ToC still need some balancing/testing, is that right?)

I have no major prefs regarding our tribe, though it would be nice to play as one I haven't yet used (that is, excluding the Wood Elves, Frostlings, Blood Cult, Amazons, Orcs, Ramayanians, or Undead).

Do we also need to discuss Flintlock-Flintlock-patch level? I have definitely DL'd C3X_R13 (quite possibly alongside ToC 2.92!), but can't remember offhand if I installed it on my internet-capable comp (which I may/will need to upgrade to Win11 at the end of January next year, when M$ stop supporting Win8.1...)
 
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I've played all my ToC games so far at Emperor, and won (or at least, reached a winning position). I'd propose at least Monarch for this game, so the AIs can pose some challenge -- but without any major risk of being inconvenienced by any still-undiscovered .biq-errors.
Great! I'm ok with Monarch as well. I usually play on Regent so will have to step up my game slightly, but that seems suitable and it will be a good learning experience!

Normal size map is fine with me. Though I random-roll most of my epic-games, I prefer getting 60-70% water and Continents/ Archi over Pangaea.

Related to the map-type, my preferred VCs would then be Ultima, Domination, or Diplomatic (roughly in that order). Conquest can get grindy, especially if we have to mop up small islands which require Amphibious units, and Culture-VCs can get really grindy. (Plus, IIRC, the Culture-targets in ToC still need some balancing/testing, is that right?)
Yep, I will probably do 60-70% water continents with those settings. Culture vic will be adjusted in next version. Indeed in current state it is quite unattainable.

I have no major prefs regarding our tribe, though it would be nice to play as one I haven't yet used (that is, excluding the Wood Elves, Frostlings, Blood Cult, Amazons, Orcs, Ramayanians, or Undead).
Ok, Moon Elves is my vote here. =)

Do we also need to discuss Flintlock-Flintlock-patch level? I have definitely DL'd C3X_R13 (quite possibly alongside ToC 2.92!), but can't remember offhand if I installed it on my internet-capable comp (which I may/will need to upgrade to Win11 at the end of January next year, when M$ stop supporting Win8.1...)
If you are already on v2.92 of ToC we should be good. Either C3X_R13 or C3X_R14 should be just fine. =)

* I think maybe best for us to wait a couple days to see if we can get any additional players and/or suggestions for game settings. (They can always join after we've started as well). Then, would you like to do the honors and start us out with the first 20 turns, or would you like me to?
 
I agree, give it another day or two for people to see the thread and express interest.

Then the usual procedure is to roll 3-4 starts using the chosen parameters, post screenshots of each, collectively pick the one we like best, and get going.

(Moon Elves is a nice idea, BTW; Thestris[?] has died in every one of my games so far, so let's see if we can keep her alive in this one!)

I'd be happy to take the first set if that's what you'd prefer, but this is your mod... ;)
 
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Tristus, I believe. But yes, let's hope she fares better this time. =)

Sounds good to me, and I'd prefer you start. I'd rather you get us off to a good start before I go in and muck things up. :lol:
 
I just rolled 4 starts, all on Continent-maps, with Random Krogs. I first clicked Random for the geography, and then picked "Wet" (= more Forest + Jungle; possibly also more Rivers and Lakes, never been sure about that). We are going to play as the Moon Elves, against the full 11 opponents (all Random, Normal Aggression) at Monarch difficulty.

After arriving on the map-screen, I moved both the Waywatcher and the Demon Hunter in roughly opposite directions, to explore the local area and pop the nearby Krog-Huts (you'll notice that in Starts 1-3 we now have 125g, instead of 100g).

Start 1 (60% water)
ToC-SG1 Start 1.png

Start 2 (60% water)
ToC-SG1 Start 2.png

Start 3 (70% water)
ToC-SG1 Start 3.png

...and Start 4 (70% water)
ToC-SG1 Start 4.png

I dismissed Start 1 immediately, since it's right on the edge of the southern Tundra (that's why the screenie's smaller than the others; I saw snow, and thought "Why bother?"!).

Starts 2-4 are all more temperate/ equatorial, which is far preferable, with freshwater (= no Warehouses needed), but for me Start 3 is the no-brainer best choice: a nice long River surrounded by Grassland for easy growth + shields (after mining), but also more Rivers, quite a few resources, and a variety of other terrain-types nearby (I already have a pretty good idea where I'd like to place our next couple of towns!).

Since this is 'only' Monarch ;) we could certainly afford to move our Builder to a better spot if we wished to do so (and on Starts 1, 2 and 4, I probably would, to improve the 1st-ring site-selection), but on Start 3 we don't need to: it's already on Grassland (so we will get a "free" shield that we otherwise wouldn't have got without Mining), and right next to the River, so I'm going to Settle in place.

No turn-by-turn plan at this stage: I stupidly didn't note what techs Tristus starts with, and since I haven't founded our capital yet, I don't know what units she has immediately/soon available to build, or what those units cost.

But my usual procedure in ToC-games to date has been roughly the same as in any Civ3 game: once I've Settled our capital, (assuming that I can do so) build a Worker-type unit to start roading and improving the local tiles and a cheap garrison for military-police happiness at Pop2 (not necessarily in that order, depending on relative shield/pop-costs), maybe another 1–2 cheap military unit(s) while our capital grows back up to Settler-building size, then at least one Settler-type unit. First settlement-priority would be a town upstream (on the Diamonds) which can then use the Floodplains + Desert-shields to go on Settler-building duty itself, allowing our corruption-free capital to grow bigger/ research faster.

Set research at max-SCI% for [the techs allowing Mining + Irrigation] first, then beeline Philosophy (freebie tech!), trade for other techs as and when possible.

In the meantime, the Waywatcher and Hunter can continue mapping the local area, smashing any nearby Krog-huts (since we are Exploratory, I don't need to worry about spawning Krogs out of them, right?), and hopefully meeting some nice neighbours (or at least, finding out where the nasty ones are!).
 
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I would vote for start 3 as well, was thinking along the same lines. Especially like the nearby flood plains, and the nearby diamonds are a dragon's best friend. =)

I like the settler pump idea. Although this early more of a settler very small pump. =D Getting lots of weaker defenders is very easy with the Moon Elves, as Spirits are very cheap, and also very quick. Not good in battle, but we can leave the fighting for later we we start getting some Hunter Apprentices (Hopefully I'm NOT the one that causes us to lose our one and only Hunter Elder, but we'll see lol).

And correct, exploratory so we won't need to worry about Krogs from Huts. Let's hope we get a lot of Krogs otherwise though, to grow our army. =D
Excited to see how your first 20 turns goes! Let's do this!
 
Okay, I played my 20 last night, but I don't feel great about passing it on, because on the very last turn (1 turn before we learn Mining, 2 turns before we complete our first Steward and 4[ish] turns before Demasus reaches Pop4), a pair of Swarm units (Larvae + Mantis) which we'd met earlier on while exploring, turned up right outside Demasus :eek:
ToC_SG1 Swarm incoming, 20 AD.png
Whenever I have seen the AI do this in previous games, it is pretty much a given that they are going to sneak-attack over the next interturn. We have 1 Spirit (D=4) already fortified in Dem, and I just ran our Hunter Elder (D=7) back to town as well, but it took all 3 moves so he's not fortified. We are going to suffer attacks at A=6 and then A=5.

—Absolute best case scenario (although highly unlikely): the Swarm loses both the upcoming battles and we gain 2 Hunter Apprentices (if that happens, we could immediately go on the offensive)
— Most likely outcome is that we lose at least one of the defenders (probably the Spirit), and will need to switch the current build to another Spirit (wasting >5 shields), then spam more of them for the next 10-15 turns, to stave off further attacks
— Worst case scenario (a little under 50% probability, based on my back-of-the-envelope "calculation"): we lose both our defenders, and with them our capital, and the game

Since the Swarm's aggressive move is likely the result of my decision to focus on early food/growth instead of shields/units (but even if I'd gone for just Spirits, we'd still only have ~2.5 of them, and Demasus would still be at Pop2), rather than handing off — with the risk that all you will be able to do is watch us lose — I'd like to play another couple of turns to see what happens. Would that be okay?
 
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Of course! That sounds good to me! I'm actually glad we are about to get attacked. Makes it more exciting lol.

Also, I like our odds still with the Hunter Elders higher defense and extra HP
 
Hooray! Best case! Not only did we win, but we got 2 Apprentices out of it!
Spoiler (T)urn(L)og(D)on't(R)ead :

1 AD
Demon Hunter + Waywatcher explore, Krog-hut popped for 25g
Demasus founded, growth in 7T --> Steward (30T)
Research set to Mining (=21T at SCI%=70%)
IBT

2 AD
Waywatcher N/W
Hunter S/E, learns Warrior Code from Krogs
IBT

3 AD
Our Ww meets the Frostlings (Ww coming from the north), and sells them Warrior Code for Farming + 11g
Hunter meets the Swarm (Larvae+Mantis coming from due west) and sells them Pottery for 102g
Maybe one of them will build the Clafestian Mound for us...
IBT

4 AD
Zzzz...
IBT

5 AD
Zzz...
IBT

6 AD
Hunter finds Ankor-Whil, only 7 tiles due west of Dem!
Our WW meets the Swarm WW, approaching Dem!
IBT

7 AD
Ww + Hunter head back towards Demasus
Switch Steward-build to Spirit just in case
MM Dem to use BGrassland instead of Floodplain to avoid food-waste on growth
IBT
Swarm-WW heads north

8 AD
Hunter skirts south of still-ungarrisoned Dem, finds Frostlings-Ww only 2 tiles away. Hope RemG is feeling friendly...
IBT
Frostlings skirt Dem to the north (phew!)

9 AD
Ww sent to Mountain SW, to keep an eye on the Swarm
IBT

10 AD
Hunter confirms only Jungle/Marsh along our southern border, heads north
IBT

11 AD
MM Dem to finish Spirit in 2T...
IBT

12 AD
Our Ww waves at the Amazons' Ww as it heads SE from Ankor-Whil. We are up WarCode on Kerrigan, who has only 6g
IBT

13 AD
Hunter fortitfied on Hills NE of Dem: "My strength is yours!" :lol:
IBT
Dem --> Steward (30T, but growth in 2T)

14 AD
Spirit fortified, Dem MM'd for 3FPT and 2 SPT (plus bonus shields on growth)
IBT

15 AD
Dem MM'd for 2 FPT and 4 SPT (Steward now in 7T, growth in 10T)
IBT

16 AD
Zzz...
IBT

17 AD
Zzz...
IBT

18 AD
Zzz...
IBT

19 AD
Zzz...

20 AD
Swarm-units incoming, due S of Dem!
Hunter sent back to town as emergency defender!
Mining in 1T, so SCI to 30% for +5 GPT
GAME SAVED
Take a deep breath...
IBT
The Swarm declare war!
And our Hunter Elder wins both fights, and trains 2 Apprentices!
:woohoo:
Mining --> Writing (45T at SCI%=70%)

21 AD
All 3 Hunters sent towards Ankor Whil to go Swarm-hunting
MM Dem for Steward in 1T, no waste
IBT
Dem --> Spirit
Rama Ww passes by Dem to the east

22 AD
Ww fortified on Mountain near Ankor Whil, Hunters sentried on nearby Hills
Steward sent to road Grass towards next planned town site
We are up Mining on Brihadratha, who is broke (6g)
GAME SAVED
Handoff

Military:

With the initial Swarm-attack repelled, I would suggest for now just using our Hunters to kill their units as they pass by on the way to Dem, or later Towns 2+3 (see the dotmap below).

They have given us War-Happiness, so don't sign peace unless we lose the Hunter Elder and/or our towns are directly threatened -- or unless the Swarm come begging for peace and offering all their towns, techs + gold! But also don't move to attack Ankor Whil unless/until we can be reasonably sure of taking it in 1 turn: i.e. not before either we can bring an overwhelming number of healthy veteran Apprentices (say, 5-6) to that fight -- or we learn Ballistics and can build [...Rangers?].

Expansion:

Since we're safe for now, here's where I suggest planting our 1st-ring towns (this is of course open to discussion, but I think it makes pretty good use of the terrain, and eyeballing it, every town should eventually get enough space/food to reach Pop13):
ToC-SG1 Dotmap 22 AD.png
I numbered the freshwater sites 1-4 in my preferred order of settlement priority:
No.1 will grow fast, so can build our Settlers and Workers
No.2 will get Lumber, and can build (a Barracks and) units
No.3 is coastal: by the time we're ready to plant this one, we should also be well on the way to learning the tech(s) we need to build our first ships, for coastal/ overseas exploration
No.4 will need a lot of Worker-turns to improve it, which is why I gave it lower priority
And the sites marked "W" will need a Warehouse to reach Pop13, so are also less important, except as 'filler' to close Cultural gaps without building Cultural buildings

Black lines mark an initial road-network, to be completed in order of "next prospective town site" (of course, we'll eventually road everything, but these lines should get all these towns connected with minimum work)

As you can see, Dem has just started building a second Spirit, and will grow over the interturn. I have switched on "Emphasise production", so the new citizen will likely be sent to one of the Forests: he/she will need to be reassigned to a BGrass next turn, to maintain town-growth at +3FPT net (=7T to Pop4, instead of 10T). Once the Spirit is done, we can probably start on our first Pandaren.

Techs/Research:

We are currently up Mining on everyone we've met (Frostlings, Amazons, Ramas; probably also the Swarm, but CAII won't show me that yet, because they won't talk to us!), and none of them know anything that we don't. The Frostlings and Amazons currently have 134 and 83 gold, respectively, so you could easily extract that by selling Mining to them, but you might want to wait and see if either of them comes up with another tech to trade first.

As you'll also notice, we have just started researching Writing at max.-SCI%, with the intention being to get to Philosophy first (and grab that freebie!). Yes, progress looks very slow at present, but once we've got some roads down, and Pop4-5 in Dem (before the first Settler is finished) it should pick up. And once we've got Town2 founded, it will go even faster.

Remember also that at this early stage, to prevent riots it's much more efficient to use the LUX%-slider (or convert unhappy citizens to Sorceresses), than to build units just to act as military police, and/or Happiness-buildings. Lunar Ponds may be useful for cheap Cultural expansions -- but don't set every town to building one immediately on founding! First priority for all towns should be 1-2 Spirits for defence, and at least one Steward per town.

I would suggest leaving Forests unchopped, until we've learnt our first Sphere and are ready to start putting up important buildings (e.g. Chieftains Guilds, Scholars' Quarters, Warehouses, Fisheries, etc).

Anything else, just ask. The save is attached.
 

Attachments

  • ToC-SG1 MoonElves 22 AD.SAV
    155.5 KB · Views: 16
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actually do nothing , if you have orcs that walk on water . Isn't their myths and whatnot that suggest their technological prowess can not be explained ? Add more dakka if you have suitable graphics !

Hooray! Best case! Not only did we win, but we got 2 Apprentices out of it!
Spoiler (T)urn(L)og(D)on't(R)ead :

1 AD
Demon Hunter + Waywatcher explore, Krog-hut popped for 25g
Demasus founded, growth in 7T --> Steward (30T)
Research set to Mining (=21T at SCI%=70%)
IBT

2 AD
Waywatcher N/W
Hunter S/E, learns Warrior Code from Krogs
IBT

3 AD
Our Ww meets the Frostlings (Ww coming from the north), and sells them Warrior Code for Farming + 11g
Hunter meets the Swarm (Larvae+Mantis coming from due west) and sells them Pottery for 102g
Maybe one of them will build the Clafestian Mound for us...
IBT

4 AD
Zzzz...
IBT

5 AD
Zzz...
IBT

6 AD
Hunter finds Ankor-Whil, only 7 tiles due west of Dem!
Our WW meets the Swarm WW, approaching Dem!
IBT

7 AD
Ww + Hunter head back towards Demasus
Switch Steward-build to Spirit just in case
MM Dem to use BGrassland instead of Floodplain to avoid food-waste on growth
IBT
Swarm-WW heads north

8 AD
Hunter skirts south of still-ungarrisoned Dem, finds Frostlings-Ww only 2 tiles away. Hope RemG is feeling friendly...
IBT
Frostlings skirt Dem to the north (phew!)

9 AD
Ww sent to Mountain SW, to keep an eye on the Swarm
IBT

10 AD
Hunter confirms only Jungle/Marsh along our southern border, heads north
IBT

11 AD
MM Dem to finish Spirit in 2T...
IBT

12 AD
Our Ww waves at the Amazons' Ww as it heads SE from Ankor-Whil. We are up WarCode on Kerrigan, who has only 6g
IBT

13 AD
Hunter fortitfied on Hills NE of Dem: "My strength is yours!" :lol:
IBT
Dem --> Steward (30T, but growth in 2T)

14 AD
Spirit fortified, Dem MM'd for 3FPT and 2 SPT (plus bonus shields on growth)
IBT

15 AD
Dem MM'd for 2 FPT and 4 SPT (Steward now in 7T, growth in 10T)
IBT

16 AD
Zzz...
IBT

17 AD
Zzz...
IBT

18 AD
Zzz...
IBT

19 AD
Zzz...

20 AD
Swarm-units incoming, due S of Dem!
Hunter sent back to town as emergency defender!
Mining in 1T, so SCI to 30% for +5 GPT
GAME SAVED
Take a deep breath...
IBT
The Swarm declare war!
And our Hunter Elder wins both fights, and trains 2 Apprentices!
:woohoo:
Mining --> Writing (45T at SCI%=70%)

21 AD
All 3 Hunters sent towards Ankor Whil to go Swarm-hunting
MM Dem for Steward in 1T, no waste
IBT
Dem --> Spirit
Rama Ww passes by Dem to the east

22 AD
Ww fortified on Mountain near Ankor Whil, Hunters sentried on nearby Hills
Steward sent to road Grass towards next planned town site
We are up Mining on Brihadratha, who is broke (6g)
GAME SAVED
Handoff

Military:

With the initial Swarm-attack repelled, I would suggest for now just using our Hunters to kill their units as they pass by on the way to Dem, or later Towns 2+3 (see the dotmap below).

They have given us War-Happiness, so don't sign peace unless we lose the Hunter Elder and/or our towns are directly threatened -- or unless the Swarm come begging for peace and offering all their towns, techs + gold! But also don't move to attack Ankor Whil unless/until we can be reasonably sure of taking it in 1 turn: i.e. not before either we can bring an overwhelming number of healthy veteran Apprentices (say, 5-6) to that fight -- or we learn Ballistics and can build [...Rangers?].

Expansion:

Since we're safe for now, here's where I suggest planting our 1st-ring towns (this is of course open to discussion, but I think it makes pretty good use of the terrain, and eyeballing it, every town should eventually get enough space/food to reach Pop13):
View attachment 647144
I numbered the freshwater sites 1-4 in my preferred order of settlement priority:
No.1 will grow fast, so can build our Settlers and Workers
No.2 will get Lumber, and can build (a Barracks and) units
No.3 is coastal: by the time we're ready to plant this one, we should also be well on the way to learning the tech(s) we need to build our first ships, for coastal/ overseas exploration
No.4 will need a lot of Worker-turns to improve it, which is why I gave it lower priority
And the sites marked "W" will need a Warehouse to reach Pop13, so are also less important, except as 'filler' to close Cultural gaps without building Cultural buildings

Black lines mark an initial road-network, to be completed in order of "next prospective town site" (of course, we'll eventually road everything, but these lines should get all these towns connected with minimum work)

As you can see, Dem has just started building a second Spirit, and will grow over the interturn. I have switched on "Emphasise production", so the new citizen will likely be sent to one of the Forests: he/she will need to be reassigned to a BGrass next turn, to maintain town-growth at +3FPT net (=7T to Pop4, instead of 10T). Once the Spirit is done, we can probably start on our first Pandaren.

Techs/Research:

We are currently up Mining on everyone we've met (Frostlings, Amazons, Ramas; probably also the Swarm, but CAII won't show me that yet, because they won't talk to us!), and none of them know anything that we don't. The Frostlings and Amazons currently have 134 and 83 gold, respectively, so you could easily extract that by selling Mining to them, but you might want to wait and see if either of them comes up with another tech to trade first.

As you'll also notice, we have just started researching Writing at max.-SCI%, with the intention being to get to Philosophy first (and grab that freebie!). Yes, progress looks very slow at present, but once we've got some roads down, and Pop4-5 in Dem (before the first Settler is finished) it should pick up. And once we've got Town2 founded, it will go even faster.

Remember also that at this early stage, to prevent riots it's much more efficient to use the LUX%-slider (or convert unhappy citizens to Sorceresses), than to build units just to act as military police, and/or Happiness-buildings. Lunar Ponds may be useful for cheap Cultural expansions -- but don't set every town to building one immediately on founding! First priority for all towns should be 1-2 Spirits for defence, and at least one Steward per town.

I would suggest leaving Forests unchopped, until we've learnt our first Sphere and are ready to start putting up important buildings (e.g. Chieftains Guilds, Scholars' Quarters, Warehouses, Fisheries, etc).

Anything else, just ask. The save is attached.


Welp, I feel like i messed up our game already, but here we go...

Turn 24
Ethropa Swarm's Mantis and Waywatcher come out from the West. I'm especting them to stop near our garrisoned units onthe mountains, but they run right past. Now I either have to attack them directly or make a b-line back to Demasus to defend the city and our only Pandarin worker.

Turn 25
I wake our Hunter Apprentices fortified on the mountain tops, to slash at the 2 unit Swarm stack. They both go down relatively easily. Especially surprised by how easily the enemy WayWatcher went down, as they are quite defensive. But attacking them on flat terrain seems to have helped.
Out of nowhere, another Mantis comes out from the West. I'm really tempted to attack the city directly to stop this nonsense, but then remembered what you said about being cautious. So I refortify.

A couple other rival Waywatchers are now in the picture. Talked to the Ramayanians, but they only have 12 gold, so not yet willing to part with my only tradeable tech (Mining). But also ran into the Frostlings, who had 143 gold and happily parted with it all for Mining. Now we're rich! 420 something gold.

I set our 3 pop city to 4 production and 2 excess food, trying hard to get this Spirit out, which will be done in 2 turns.

Turn 26
Lone mantis from the West is trying to pass up my garrison on the mountains again. I take a gamble to try to grow our army, and attack with the Hunter Elder. I win the battle, but no trained Apprentice. =(

Our Nature's Steward is done building whatever he was building (road I think?) and now I'm going to work on a road and some irrigation in the flood plains directly west of Demasus.

Turn 27
Our second Spirit is complete! I'm going to have her cautiously explore. There is yet ANOTHER mantis coming from the West. The Ethropa are just hatching these things like mad. Gonna keep slaying them. Starting to build a Pandarin Settler.

Turn 28
Talked to the Frostlings again, gave them 192 gold for Mysticsm, which I promptly traded to the Amazonians, along with 57 gold, for Woodworks.
Slayed another Mantis (yawn) lol.

Turn 34
Explored around with my Spirit, unveiling a lot of lush green land, and even an Oasis to the Northeast. But none that we will probably be able to attain before it gets settled on, but we'll see!

Turn 38
Lost a citizen in our capitol due to disease. Sending my exploratory Spirit back to console the populace. =)
The Ethropa must have felt sorry for us too, since they offered a peace treaty, but I said 'aw hell no'.

Turn 39
Going to use the Nature's Steward to build a road to incense, think that will help us with some future hapiness. Our settler will FINALLY be done building next turn, due to the delay from lack of population due to the diseased citizen we lost, and also due to my mismanagement for not focusing on shields enough.

Turn 40
Settler is now available, saw a Frostling Grey Wolf to the north. Not escorting a settler so I'm not sure what he's up to. Going to have my other Spirit guide the settler to city spot #1.

Turn 42
Damn Grey Wolf was sitting in our city spot. He finally went away so I plopped down our second city. Already a Spirit there, but I started another one, feel free to switch production. We are still at war with the Ethropa, but I haven't seen any units from him in a while. I think they must be licking their wounds from the beating we gave them earlier. Really good RNG here, I don't think any one of my units lost 2 HP in any single battle. Let's hope that keeps up!
Our population in capitol is struggling (1), but the irrigation on flood plains I built there should help us build back up quickly!

Turn 42 Game attached!
 

Attachments

  • ToC-SG1 MoonElves 42 AD.SAV
    165 KB · Views: 15
More bugs squished, no units lost, some good tech-trades, and our second town founded? That doesn't sound to me like you messed up at all! That sounds like a job well done!

(Pop-losses to disease are beyond our control, so don't worry about that)

I think I'd like the first build out of Town2 to be a second Steward, then he can start mining the nearby Grass/ Plains/ Desert to balance the Floodplain-food, for faster Pandaren-builds.

Will try and DL the save to play later on today (unless any lurking Lurker wants to join in?)
 
Only played 18 turns this time, to make up for the extra 2 turns I took on my first set.

Didn't do as well as you, though: I squished another couple of Mantises, but lost our Waywatcher (D=7 on a Mountain, and an attacking A=5 Mantis killed him, go figure...) :cry:
Spoiler (T)urn(L)og(D)on't(R)ead :
42AD
Why is our Steward roading a useless Desert tile, when there's an unimproved BGrass right next to him?! Job interrupted and reassigned
IBT
Yet another Mantis comes into sight from Ankor-Whil

43AD
Hunters stacked on Mountain nearest A-W, Ww moved to Mountain closer to Dem
IBT

44 AD
Apprentice retreats from Mantis, Elder kills it, no promotion or Summons
IBT
RG wants to sell us Masonry: I pay 52g + 3gpt
Sell Masonry to Kerrigan: she pays 96g
Amazon Ww comes into view, heading south: Krog-hunting?

45 AD
Elder sent south to beat Amazons to any Krog village
IBT

46 AD
Zzz...
IBT
Mantis appears 2SW of Hunters

47 AD
Zzz...
IBT
Mantis kills our Waywatcher!

48 AD
Apprentice runs ahead of Mantis, to defend Dem
IBT

49 AD
Apprentice kills Mantis, returns to Ww's Mountain
Elder finds choke-point in southern Jungle
IBT

50 AD
Elder found no Krogs, heads back NW
IBT

51 AD
IBT
Dem --> Watermill (14T, before growth)

52 AD
Zzz...
IBT

53 AD
Zzz...
IBT

54 AD
Zzz...
IBT

55 AD
Elder rejoins Apprentices, who move to block the Hills
Amazons + Frostlings are now up Ballistics + Iron Working!
Ramas are up Ballistics but missing Masonry + Mysticism
I buy Ballistics from the Ramas for Myst + 34g
IBT

56 AD
Drop SCI% to 30% for a little bit of extra gold on the last turn of Writing
IBT
Writing --> Inundation (22T)

57 AD
Embassies built with Amazons (34g; )
ToC-SG1 Junglehaven 57 AD.png
... Frostlings (31g, Hope's Temple in 157T !!!)
ToC-SG1 Winterhaven 57 AD.png
... and Ramas (48g; Sultan's Residence in 4T)
ToC-SG1 Remjaki 57 AD.png
We could easily get Iron Working + lots of gold for Writing, but I'll hold onto it for now, just in case someone else is working on Inundation (besides, the Ramas are almost certainly working on IW themselves, and we still have Masonry to sell to them...)
IBT
Incense-Road completed

58 AD
Worker to mine roaded Grass
IBT
Amazons and Ramas begin Hopes Temple as well!

59 AD
Ramas just got Masonry + HbR from Sultans Residence and traded for IW? Yes, they sold HbR to the Frostlings (who suddnely have no gold)
Time to sell Writing:
Kerrigan has the most gold so she gets a straight buy: 451 g
Brihad has almost as much gold, but HbR is expensive = Writing + 95g
RG has only 28g, gives IW + 18g
We're now at tech-parity, with 493g (+2gpt income)
IBT
Nassu --> Pandaren (51T, growth in 3T)

60 AD
Spirits moved to Mountains for better view of surrounding areas
GAME SAVED
... but we're still keeping up with tech, we now have Embassies with the Frostlings, Ramas and Amazons, and a biggish pile of gold if you want/need to sign any Alliances.

Handover

Once Dem finishes its Watermill in 2T, it has a Barracks queued. Feel free to skip the Barracks and go directly to mil-units (Spirits and/or Rangers) if you need to. With most of our strong buildable units still some way off, we will need Rangers primarily for their (lethal) bombardment, so that we can use the Spirits and Hunters to attack at lower risk.

But be careful: We don't want to set off our Golden Age until we have a lot more towns up!

Speaking of which, I made a revised dotmap (red cross marks a Desert tile which would be outside all BFCs with this plan -- but it's only a Desert, so no great loss...):
ToC-SG1 Dotmap 60 AD.png
(W3 is crowding Blizzard Falls, because I intend the latter town to be demolished once it's under our control: resettling it 1NE from that location, will give eventual access to Wheat that no town can currently use...)

Our Stewards are busy roading (near Nassu) and mining (near Dem).

Concentrate on roading and mining (B)Grass tiles near Dem for (corruption-free!) commerce and shields, and let the irrigated Floodplains keep it growing fast (should get 4 FPT net if the rest of the citizens work Grass-tiles). Once it hits Pop7-8, we can exchange the fast growth for more (Forest) shields, to build Stewards/ Pandarens quickly (if needed, to keep it happy).

Conversely, Nassu needs shields much more than food, so we should road and mine the Plains tiles first, then the Deserts, and only start roading/irrigating Floods once we get to a point where Steward-/Pandaren-builds will be completed faster than the population is being replenished.

(I wouldn't bother wasting Steward-turns on the Iron-Hill yet: researching Steel/ building our Metals Camp is not a high priority...)
 

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lurker's comment:
Would it not have been better to grab HbR and some gold for Writing first, before selling it for gold only? I don't know how much they would have offered for it, so it's possible straight up gold was worth more still, it just feels weird to me to base selling priority on gold instead of potential tech trades, especially if the AI know each other and the price drops dramatically after you lose monopoly.
 
lurker's comment:
Would it not have been better to grab HbR and some gold for Writing first, before selling it for gold only? I don't know how much they would have offered for it, so it's possible straight up gold was worth more still, it just feels weird to me to base selling priority on gold instead of potential tech trades, especially if the AI know each other and the price drops dramatically after you lose monopoly.
In the space of 1 turn, we went from being up Masonry on the Ramas (with the Frostlings and Amazons having 400-500 gold each, plus IW), to being down HbR + IW to all three of them, with most of the Frostlings' gold apparently transferred to the Ramas (we were also down IW vs. the Swarm -- but we are still at war with them).

Our monopoly on Writing alone was not worth both IW + HbR (would have had to add some gold), and because of the Embassies I'd just set up, we only had ~100g left. With hindsight, maybe I could have first sent Writing to the now nearly broke Frostlings, before taking straight gold from the Amazons + Ramas. But I could get full-monopoly gold-value from either the Amazons or the Ramas, and I wanted to be sure of getting IW as well, without handing out too much gold myself.

Either way, though, the initial sale of Writing was going to devalue it to the same degree, whatever I got in return. So I essentially chose to take 80% of Kerrigan's gold (and then pass some of it on to Brihad, who has so far been researching rather slower than Kerrigan + RG -- and us!) -- rather than taking 30-50% from both of them, for RG's 'sloppy seconds'.

BTW, rather than just lurking, would you be interested in joining in...? ;) :deal:
 
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lurker's comment:
Fair enough, I suppose, and no, sorry. The Christmas season is on us and the trucking business is booming, so I'll be rather busy driving for a while.
 
@tjs282

Nice work, and thanks for the tips! I started building irrigation on the desert b/c I use a screen filter that eliminates blue light at night, but it also made the desert look like plains. =)

Here I go....

Turn 62
Watermill complete in Damasus - switched to building a Ranger

Turn 63
Purchased Mathematics from the Ramas for 140 gold.
Amazonians show up at our borders to the Northwest. Should I go exporing or encounter them?
No, I'm scared, so I'm staying right here.

Turn 64
Amazonians built a new city to the Northwest, right next to Nassudru. One more Mantis coming from the West. I attacked with my Hunter Elder, and he lost and narrowly escaped with 1 HP. Moved in a Hunter Apprentice and he barely won, 1 HP left. Almost some big casualties here. Ran back to the mountains to heal.
Also started building a mine just north of Nassudru, on the Gaja Stone.

Turn 67
Sneak attack my another Mantis unit, that took out my injured Hunter Apprentice. Our Ranger is done building in Demasus, so I queued up another. Going to send my current lone Ranger to help deal with the Mantis threat. Mantis attacked the Ranger while she was on a mountain... bye bye Mantis.

Turn 69
Irrigation built near Demasus. Going to connect the Agatte crystals now.

Turn 70
2nd Ranger complete in Demasus, switching to Barracks. MOving 2nd Ranger onto the mountains with the Spirit, west of Nassudru.

Turn 71
Inundation finished researching, switching to Philosophy. There is civil disorder in Nassudru, so moving my 2nd Ranger into the city to help with military police.
Azjol-Nerun of the Ethropa Swarm offer peace, but they want Ballistics in return. I said hell no, take that little contract back to your Hive.

Turn 74
We have a Panderan Settler! I'm asking him to settle in city site #1. Switched production in Nassudru to a Spirit. Mine finished north of Nassudru, going to build another road/mine irrigation nearby. Really thought about going for a forest since that's quicker and gives 2 shields, or maybe even mining the Iron hills for +2 Shields (not sure if you knew Hills/Mountains mining in ToC gives +2 shields now). But thought, neh, I"ll go the simple route and just work the plains.

Turn 75
Barracks finished in Demasus, I'm going Scholar's Quarters since i'm seeing the high science investment already in our capitol.

Turn 76
New city Jenova Ridge founded at city site #1. So close to Lumber, I can't wait to get up our Lumber Mills that will cost less maintenance than Windmills or Watermills! =) Also going to use the lumber for my fireplace since it's getting really cold this winter. Started Jenova Ridge on a Spirit.

Turn 77
Just realized you did a great job growing Demasus. I mean the production, with the Watermill in that city, is rediculous. I'm finished the Scholar's Quarters in 2 turns! Nice! We have gobs and gobs of science now. Switched production to Settler.
Nassudru finished building another Spirit, production switched to a Nature's Steward. I'm going to move this Spirit to our new town Jenova Ridge, and switch that city's production to a Lunar Well.

Turn 78
Philosophy is done researching! OMG OMG what should I choose for free tech? Chose Construction. Bad choice? I'm not sure. But I really wanted the Moonlight Dancers, so I switched to Enchanted Waters after we got the free tech.

Turn 81
Didn't realize i overdid my turns, sorry! Panderen Settler and Nature's Steward are done building.. Switched to a Ballista in Nassudru and a Ranger in Demasus, but only because I wasn't sure what to build next.. feel free to change!
Handing the save game back to you!

Thanks!
 

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