To be or not to be...a genocide

[Che Guava]

...and the debate now goes to congress!

Spoiler :

US bill on Armenia moves forward


A bill recognising the killing of Armenians in Ottoman times as genocide has cleared its first hurdle in the US Congress despite Turkish warnings.

It passed through the House Foreign Affairs Committee by 27 votes to 21 - the first step towards holding a vote in the House of Representatives.

Turkish President Abdullah Gul reacted swiftly to the result, saying that the move was "unacceptable".

President George W Bush had urged US legislators not to pass it.

A spokesperson for the National Security Council told the BBC that the White House was "very disappointed" by the outcome of the vote.

Turkey is a regional operational hub for the US military, which uses its airspace to supply US forces in Iraq.

'Sobering'

The result means that only a change of heart by the opposition Democrats, who control Congress, can now stop a full vote.

Divisions within the Foreign Affairs Committee crossed party lines with eight Democrats voting against the measure and eight Republicans voting for it.

Tom Lantos, the committee's chairman, had opened the debate by admitting the resolution posed a "sobering" choice.

"We have to weigh the desire to express our solidarity with the Armenian people... against the risk that it could cause young men and women in the uniform of the United States armed services to pay an even heavier price than they are currently paying," he said.

Mr Lantos, himself a survivor of the Jewish Holocaust, said he would introduce a resolution praising US-Turkish friendship next week, according to AFP news agency.

The Senate Foreign Relations Committee is expected to take up their version of the resolution in the future.

Only the democrats can stop it now! What will they do...?

 

[Stewbert 08]

Bush to veto no doubt. He really saves them for the crucial issues.

 

[Che Guava]

Bush to veto no doubt. He really saves them for the crucial issues.

What would be the point though? It's a non-binding resolution already, all it does is state that the US government beleives what occurred was a genocide, and if the bill passes, we'll all know that at least a majority of the legislative branch thinks that it is..

 

[Masquerouge]

What would be the point though? It's a non-binding resolution already, all it does is state that the US government beleives what occurred was a genocide, and if the bill passes, we'll all know that at least a majority of the legislative branch thinks that it is..

I see it as a win-win: the Senate passes the bill, showing that people think it's a genocide, and Bush vetoes it, allowing his administration a way to salvage the relationship with Turkey.

 

[ParkCungHee]

What would be the point though? It's a non-binding resolution already, all it does is state that the US government beleives what occurred was a genocide, and if the bill passes, we'll all know that at least a majority of the legislative branch thinks that it is..

 

[luiz]

This is the first time in my life that I'm glad that Jews have so much power in American politics. Because this thread clearly demonstrates that, without that influence, Americans are pretty much blasé about genocide. "It happened in another country!" "It was so long ago!" "What's the point of involving ourselves & hurting relations w/ an ally?" Despicable.

Ah, so it's all about the Jews...

Is anti-semitism the new thing among the low IQ lefty crowd? (forgive my redundancy).

 

[Che Guava]

I'm impervious to your wit

 

[Bill3000]

Ah, so it's all about the Jews...

Is anti-semitism the new thing among the low IQ lefty crowd? (forgive my redundancy).

Nah, the left generally is pro-Israel within the US, but that's because the left includes the Jews.

 

[ParkCungHee]

This is the first time in my life that I'm glad that Jews have so much power in American politics. Because this thread clearly demonstrates that, without that influence, Americans are pretty much blasé about genocide. "It happened in another country!" "It was so long ago!" "What's the point of involving ourselves & hurting relations w/ an ally?" Despicable.

Okay, and whats so special about the Armenians? I don't see resolutions going out against the Qin Dynasty either.

 

[Bill3000]

Okay, and whats so special about the Armenians? I don't see resolutions going out against the Qin Dynasty either.

I'm actually surprised it came so late, considering the large Armenian immigrant population we have here.

 

[Stewbert 08]

Ah, so it's all about the Jews...

Is anti-semitism the new thing among the low IQ lefty crowd? (forgive my redundancy).

Get it straight, I'm not dissing Jews or Israel.

I'm saying I'm glad they're around because judging by the posts in this thread it doesn't look like nonJewish Americans are able to summon up any sense of moral outrage over genocide. In fact it's the apathy they exhibit that's friggin outrageous. And shameful.

I wonder, if Germany was an important ally in the ME, had oil, and the Holocaust happened 90 years ago, and America didn't have a sizable Jewish population, then would everyone here be "Meh, it happened long ago, what's the point of a nonbinding resolution condemning Germany's continued neonazist denial of its past crimes?"

Okay, and whats so special about the Armenians? I don't see special resolutions going out against the Assyrians.

Don't be disingenuous, Turkey is an existing nation and in denial of a horrific crime in its past, Assyria is neither.

 

[Stewbert 08]

The Qin Dynasty: an equally crappy analogy.

 

[Shadylookin]

I don't know why the US should bother mainly because I don't think we should legislate historical issues and pass non-binding resolutions giving a slap on the wrist to a country that doesn't even exist anymore. Nor do I think Turkey should care what we think about the issue since it obviously has nothing to do with modern Turkey.

 

[Stewbert 08]

It obviously has a LOT to do with modern Turkey, since modern Turkish kids are educated that it never happened (judging by internet convos I've had with several Turks).

 

[ParkCungHee]

The Qin Dynasty: an equally crappy analogy.

I'm sorry I forgot China no longer exists.

Fine, you want to start picking on random countries for things that happened over a century ago, start with Mongolia. They teach that Ghenghis Kahn was a benevolent leader, and a precurser to modern liberal democracy. I don't see you going nuts trying to get congress to condemn those Mongols though.

Or maybe you just don't mind Genocide when it happens to Arabs. Or are you a part of the Mongol Conspiracy to control the goatherding?

 

[luiz]

Get it straight, I'm not dissing Jews or Israel.

I'm saying I'm glad they're around because judging by the posts in this thread it doesn't look like nonJewish Americans are able to summon up any sense of moral outrage over genocide. In fact it's the apathy they exhibit that's friggin outrageous. And shameful.

Nope, you were implying that the Jews use their supposedely vast power within american society to gather sympathy for a cause that otherwise would receive nothing but "yawns".

I wonder, if Germany was an important ally in the ME, had oil, and the Holocaust happened 90 years ago, and America didn't have a sizable Jewish population, then would everyone here be "Meh, it happened long ago, what's the point of a nonbinding resolution condemning Germany's continued neonazist denial of its past crimes?"

When the Holocaust happened the Jews were not a particularly influent minority in America, and it did gather plenty of outrage when the facts became known.

 

[Stewbert 08]

Nope, you were implying that the Jews use their supposedely vast power within american society to gather sympathy for a cause that otherwise would receive nothing but "yawns".

Yes, I'm clearly one of the endless crowd of left-wing antisemite pro-Palestinian Green-Day-listening college students.

ROFL. Listom et ha peh, luiz.* Oh WAIT, how on EARTH do I know how to speak Hebrew? I WONDER.

Does your foot taste good?

*Shut your pie-hole, luiz.

 

[amadeus]

sounds like some people here need to grow balls and not be so PC

Where in the Constitution does it say the federal government is supposed to nitpick about things that happened in countries that don't exist anymore 90 years ago?

 

[luiz]

Yes, I'm clearly one of the endless crowd of left-wing antisemite pro-Palestinian Green-Day-listening college students.

Indeed you seem like one. Pretty much all of your posts are what would be expected by the above described type. Like comparing that venetian doge to Richard Nixon in the other thread. Really good stuff.

ROFL. Listom et ha peh, luiz.* Oh WAIT, how on EARTH do I know how to speak Hebrew? I WONDER.

Does your foot taste good?

*Shut your pie-hole, luiz.

私はまた訳者を使用してもいい

ولا يسعني ايضا استخدام مترجم

나는 또한 통역을 사용해서 좋다

我还可以利用翻译

That's Japanese, Arab, Korean and Chinese for "I can also use a translator".

 

[downtown]

Okay, and whats so special about the Armenians? I don't see resolutions going out against the Qin Dynasty either.

Because its the 3rd largest ethnic lobby in the United States, only behind the Jews and the Cubans, in terms of $$$ donated to congressional campaigns, and political parties.