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Tomatekh's Historical Religion Mods

Discussion in 'Civ5 - Mod Components' started by Tomatekh, Oct 23, 2012.

  1. ruhrgebietheld

    ruhrgebietheld Warlord

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    California
    I've noticed that the Mormonism religion has now been changed to Restorationism. As a devout Mormon, I'd suggest maybe rethinking that one. While the Restoration is a major part of our doctrine, it is not something we use as the name of our religion. The official name is The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Since that's pretty unwieldy, most of us don't mind if people just refer to it as Mormonism. Restorationism, though, is not one of the possible names for it. It would be a bit like calling the Catholicism religion in the game Trinitarianism.
     
  2. Tomatekh

    Tomatekh Sahib-i-Qirani

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    It is a temporary edit to the Complete version of the mod (it is still currently unchanged in the Christian Denominations add-on) while I re-arrange some things. However, like most updates, it has taken me longer to actually getting around to doing it than I originally planned.

    The change was not meant to be seen as me renaming Mormonism per se. There are several independent and doctrinally unrelated Christian faiths that I frequently get requests to add to the mod. A this point in the life cycle of the mod (and Civ V in general) it is not really feasible for me to add them all. However, most of these requests are for faiths that can broadly be grouped under the Restorationist movement. So, rather than renaming Mormonism, it was me subsuming it into a more general "Restorationism" group to also include representation for stuff like Jehovah's Witnesses, Quakers, Anabaptists, etc. As these faiths are doctrinally separate, it's not an ideal solution (and not the same situation as grouping things under "Protestantism" or "Orthodoxy", etc.); however, it is still technically correct.

    As I said, this is meant to be a temporary change until I figure out another way to represent these requests without overwhelming the mod with a dozen more Christian religions.
     
  3. Alkimyai

    Alkimyai Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2016
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    Thanks for all your work Tomatekh

    I have a small suggestion/request with regards to the names of some Islamic denominations and offshoots.

    My primary concern is that Sunni and Shia are adjectives. The denominations are properly and commonly called Sunni Islam and Shia Islam respectively. "City State desires Sunni" sounds as silly as "City State desires Catholic." It seems you changed Ibadi to Ibadiyya in HR Complete, which I guess is a fine alternative to Ibadi Islam.

    Similarly, I believe Baha'i should be called Baha'i Faith for the same reason. I have a similar concern about Druze (which refers to the community, not the religion), but not sure what to call it. Druze Faith possibly?

    Alternatively, you could just add -ism to everything (Sunnism, Shi'ism, Ibadism, Baha'ism, Druzism, Mu'tazilism...), but I don't think these terms are common. (It's a very bland approach too, honestly.)

    I also have a question: Are E&D religious Events (Atheism, etc.) available only as part of HR Complete mod, or also in other HRs/as a standalone?

    Thanks again for your hard work!
     
  4. turingmachine

    turingmachine Emperor

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    I don't know about Bahai (and am a little unsure about Sunni) but isn't Shia just a shortened form of "Shī'at 'Alī", which means something like "sect of Ali"? I've seen it used as a collective noun before so it never struck me as odd that Tomatekh used it that way in his mod (since it's just an abbreviation of a collective name anyway). I'd be against just adding -ism to it, as it kind of seems like lazy English, and would rather he just use the long form if he's going to change it.
     
  5. Tomatekh

    Tomatekh Sahib-i-Qirani

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    I did a minor update to HR Complete today. Some copy editing, added more Great Prophet Names, and added two more events. HR Complete is turning into a nice little E&D add-on at this point. Though all the events are set to be pretty rare and/or have very specific era requirements, so they probably don't show up much :p (Then again, they can trigger for anybody so, even being rare, they likely trigger in most games even if not for the human player).

    I've had it as Sunni/Shia Islam in previous versions. The thing is, every time I have it as Sunni/Shia Islam I get people telling me to change it to Sunni/Shia and then when I have it as Sunni/Shia people tell me to change it to Sunni/Shia Islam :p I'll consider changing it again next time I do a major update.

    The events are only available in the HR Complete version of the mod.
     
  6. Danmacsch

    Danmacsch Geheimekabinetsminister

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    Great - thanks for this. Is a World Event notification sent if one of the Event occurs? That would be a nice touch I think :).
     
  7. Tomatekh

    Tomatekh Sahib-i-Qirani

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    All my events (in this and my other mods) do trigger a message for any met players once they occur (though I think the way I do it is different than the specific "world event" notification).
     
  8. Danmacsch

    Danmacsch Geheimekabinetsminister

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    Okay, great, that's what I meant. The notification in referring to is, iirc, just a notification of the generic type, just sent with JFD's SendWorldEvent function.
     
  9. isnorden

    isnorden Amnesiac Modder

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    Location:
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    I'm currently working on a modpack featuring typical Norse resources, buildings, and beliefs; it's meant to finish what I started in the "Brewery and Mead Hall" mod. Could I please use your icon, preference codes, and Civilopedia entry on the Forn Siðr religion? You'd get proper credit for those parts, of course.
     
  10. Tomatekh

    Tomatekh Sahib-i-Qirani

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    Sure, it's no problem. Feel free to use whatever will help from my mods.
     
  11. Tomatekh

    Tomatekh Sahib-i-Qirani

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  12. Civ Spies&Lies

    Civ Spies&Lies Chieftain

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    Appreciate the heck out of your work. Honestly, as petty as this makes me look, I just couldn't get hooked by the religion aspects of the game when immersion breaking was on the scale of Buddhist Spain (why the cross Izzy? Just "bling?") Shinto France and Hindu Germany were all fighting for my "would you like to enter a trade agreement?" affections.

    So you saved me from that which led into me taking the time to learn the mechanics which I have enjoyed way more than I expected. So thank you for that.

    My current trouble is the fall back religion. Since Christianity is preferred in abundance, I get the Arianism consolation prize. As this is often the 2nd or 3rd religious civ, it spreads wildly and the map is full o' Aryans.

    If I understand other posts correctly, the engine can only have one default then it goes by alphabetical order. Arianism seems likely high on the alphabet list so it always founding makes sense.

    First, is the a simple commenting edit I can make in a file to take it out of the ai's mix but leave the underlying Mod work intact?

    Second, any clever ideas as to a work around? Not specifically "proper" religions to their civs (which, after the first of a Orginal "major" seems impossible) but maybe something along the lines of "stacking the deck" more in our favor?

    I found myself wondering, if things are as I understand them, if much of anything (religions) ever gets picked as there are founding limits and within those contraints, you'd have to have mulitple civs forced into repicking before you get even out of the As and Bs of the list.

    Thanks again for all of your tireless work. The complete mod really is a thing of beauty.
     
  13. Civ Spies&Lies

    Civ Spies&Lies Chieftain

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    I'm out of my depths but a thought might have just occurred to me. Love to hear any flaws in my plan or just thoughts about the pros and cons of my actions (I really no very little of the religion "game")
    • Normal game, no limit on civs by religion
    • Auto Saves 999 max, 1 per turn
    • Play to the turn where a "founding" occurs
    • Go into some file on the mod and make edits
    ex. Spain snags Catholicism on turn 50 so that default is now taken.

    Austria gets stuck with Arianism so some magical edit gutting Arianism and putting in place the characteristics of the religion I would have prefered (symbols and such)

    I know I don't have a full idea here but I'm trying to fill out some sort of work around. A name change can't be in the cards because the ai would skip over my changes (due to them being lower on the alphabet list) and take Arianism anyway.

    In AI logic, are there symbols or letters that would make MY (desired for the AI civs) religion's name higher in the list but are mostly inoffensive or rather small

    ie. ~Sunni or (Anglican)

    Obviously I would backup and move the original mod work to an external and restore it next new game (I play Epic and very slowly so could be months :p

    Then there's the matter of symbols and the like... hmm.

    Sorry I'm so scattered, I have the drive and desire but neither the overall religious component understanding or coding ability to come close to a fix even if I had the former.
     
  14. isnorden

    isnorden Amnesiac Modder

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    My game often includes several early Norse/Germanic civs side-by-side. For instance, I'll take Denmark (lots of Norse building/unit mods!), and my AI opponents will include Iceland or Norway. Logically, all those civs would prefer Forn Siðr and not some Christian sect; would a mod to "split" Norse religion into sub-cults interest other players if I wrote one? (I'd choose four or five major deities and give each an appropriate symbol.) If any other Viking buffs would play with that remod, I'd like to hear from them. Tusen tack! :viking:
     
  15. Tomatekh

    Tomatekh Sahib-i-Qirani

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    With one or two exceptions, you can comment out any religion in the files to remove it from the game, but you should only do this before starting a new game. I really wouldn't recommend changing XML/SQL files in between saves. This will invariably cause problems, especially if you're outright removing stuff since the ID order will be missing entries. It will cause problems all over the place, though the most obvious would be with the font icons used by the game. It is also important not to delete any religion that a civ is specifically programmed to prefer or they will end up never founding a religion in game.

    Now, there is technically a way to get multiple preferences to work for a civ. Although the XML/SQL doesn't support it, I figured out a way to do it with lua thanks to the GetReligionToFound hook added in the final patch. It has come up before and there are a few reasons why I don't officially implement it in the mod, which I won't get into, but you're free to try and implement it on your end.

    There are a few caveats, the first is that I've only included the necessary lua in the Historical Religions Complete version of the mod, so you have to use that version instead of the "Basic" or "Edit" versions.

    To set it up, first you need to open the "Historical Religions Preference.lua" file in the mod folder: ~/Historical Religions Complete (BNW or GK)/Lua/
    You need to delete the two comment lines:
    --[[ (at line 11)
    and
    --]] (at line 33)

    Second, go into ~/Historical Religions Complete (BNW or GK)/SQL/ and replace "HistoricalReligionsMasterPreference.sql" with the same named file downloaded here:

    http://www.dropbox.com/s/nl3ihrbsth6efko/HistoricalReligionsMasterPreference.sql

    (The dropbox link will probably show the text, but just download it completely from the link at the top right of the page and overwrite the mod file).

    A few other caveats, if you are using any mod with a custom DLL, you need to make sure it was updated for the last patch and includes GetReligionToFound or every civ will be unable to found a religion. This system is not 100% stable so there might be a rare crash or sometimes it might just fail and one civ will still default to Arianism, etc.. The biggest one, though, is that it's not going to give multiple preferences for mod civs. For various reasons, it's a lost cause trying to implement it consistently for them, so you sort of have to be content with just the official civs getting multiple preferences.

    (It's been a long while since I tried to re-implement this, so I might have forgotten a step. Let me know if you have problems getting it working).
     
  16. Stef09

    Stef09 Warlord

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    Minor bug I noticed on being able to enact a decision related to religion: the button that shows up announcing you're able to enact gives a "txt_key_ description". 2 examples:

    (Founded Ibadiyya) txt_key_decisions_religionevents_1islam for "Go on haji to the holy city"
    (Founded Anito) txt_key_decisions_religionevents_1anito for "Celebrate the Kadwayan festival"
     
  17. Tomatekh

    Tomatekh Sahib-i-Qirani

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  18. Tomatekh

    Tomatekh Sahib-i-Qirani

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  19. Stef09

    Stef09 Warlord

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    Any news on this one? For every religion it's giving "txt_key_decisions_" when a decision becomes enactable. Not gamebreaking but if there's a quick fix...
     
  20. Tomatekh

    Tomatekh Sahib-i-Qirani

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    Oh, yeah, I did look into that a long time ago. However, I believe the issue was in the decisions mod itself and not hr so there wasn't anything I could do about it. Sorry for not getting back to you.
     
    Stef09 likes this.

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