TR01 - Help a loser out

[Tubby Rower]

I've been able to beat regent easily so I moved up to Monarch....Well let me just say I stink. I'm trying to learn and seem to do well enough to get into the Middle Ages but haven't been able to sustain any amount of life after that. I have trouble getting a balance of military and expansion. When I do well with one the other bites me in the butt about 100 turns down the road. Here is how I set up my typical game. This is in C3C

Playing as: Random civ
World size: Standard map
World: completely random
Barbs: random
Rivals: 7 random civs
Difficulty: Monarch
victories enabled:
domin.
space race
diplo
conquest
cultural
desired victory: conquest or domination
respawn: on
Ai aggression: normal

4000 BC Save


Roster: FULL
dmanakho
Veovim
eldar (out til Feb)
Minute Man
Tubby Rower
DBear
ÆnigmÆffect

Please elaborate as much as you can on why actions were made instead of just what the decisions were while submitting turns as this is more of a training game. 24 hrs to get the save and 48 to play & post the save, is that normal? Please post skips or delays so that everyone stays informed....

I like what meldor phrased the turns per player for MLDR005 NOW what?

Also, each turn (except the first player) will be around ten turns +/- a few. If you don't have to complete them all then its OK to stop early and pass it on. Sometimes the game just has some natural break points beyond which you might commit the next player to a massive undertaking and you want to leave the choice up to them as they will shoulder the burden. Sometimes a war is just about over and you don't want to leave a the next player with a couple of boring "clean-up" turns or you have worked to get something done that you feel is important and you don't want it lost. Take a couple extra to do so. Try not to "hog" all the fun, but don't short change yourself either.

 

[Tubby Rower]

Succession Game Etiquette Guide
Please do:
Let the team know if you're going to be unable to play for an extended period - holiday, illness, exams etc.
Post a "Got it" notice or ask for a skip within 24 hours of the save becoming available (I reserve the right to skip a player who hasn't responded after the 24 hour grace period is over).
Play and post within 48 hours of posting a "Got it". Additional time may be requested and granted for expected delays.
Write up a log of the events occurring during your turn and post it along with your save.
Provide notes for the next player as to the current situation and any immediate plans for the future - are those Caravels heading NE or SW? is that Swordsman fortified to heal or act as a lookout? Our forces are mustering for an attack on...
Feel free to pause and ask for advice, or simply discuss, if a situation arisies in the game and you're unsure of the best course of action.

Please do not:
Automate Workers.
Use City Governors unless the team has discussed and agreed their use.
Leave units on goto orders that will extend beyond your turn. (Auto-moving is bad form in SGs)
Make deals on your last turn. However, you should notify the next player if trading opportunities exist.
Make wholesale changes to build orders on the inherited turn without consulting the team. One or two is okay, and pre-builds may naturally get changed.

Here are some saves that I generated with the above conditions (sorry no good screenshots - could someone please generate them.)

• start 1
• start 2
• start 3
• start 4
• start 5
• start 6

 

[dmanakho]

I may join to help you beating crap of monarch AI
Too bad you didn't post screen shots instead of save files...
takes much longer to open them and many of us at work can't load them anyways.

 

[Tubby Rower]

I have gif files (I forgot the colors are limited) but they are not easy to see.. Anyway, here are my gifs.

Mongols (Start #1)


Rome (Start #2)


America (Start #3)


Ottomans (Start #4)


Zululand (Start #5)


Sumeria (Start #6)

 

[eldar]

Like the Otto start best. I'd play, but I'm on holiday for the next week (back on Sun 30th/Mon31st). So if you could do without me for a week or so...?

Neil.

 

[dmanakho]

Just pick any map.... I am fine with any of them.
personally i don't like playing mongols, but i don't mind playing them if we choose to.

Rome will give as a chance for some early warmongering. (after we change government that is.)

Sumeria is quite powerful culturally, but we will try not to use their UU to avoid early GA. Same UU rule applies to Zulu.

America doesn't shine as early domination civ, but still quite doable.

and Osmans are simply unstoppable once we research MT.

 

[Veovim]

I'm pretty much in the same boat as you are, so I'd like to join if you'll have me. I don't have too much preference about the starts, but I might try to avoid Sumeria. I have played them on regent, and found that the agricultural trait and the enkidu warrior's low cost help me in the expansion vs military problem a little too much.

 

[Tubby Rower]

So I've got the roster as follows (adjust if you have a problem)

dmanakho
Veovim
eldar (out til Feb)
Tubby Rower

The Ottoman start seems to have the most support right now which is Start #4. Please elaborate as much as you can on why actions were made instead of just what the decisions were while submitting turns as this is more of a training game. 24 hrs to get the save and 48 to play & post the save, is that normal? Please post skips or delays so that everyone stays informed....

I like what meldor phrased the turns per player for MLDR005 NOW what?

Also, each turn (except the first player) will be around ten turns +/- a few. If you don't have to complete them all then its OK to stop early and pass it on. Sometimes the game just has some natural break points beyond which you might commit the next player to a massive undertaking and you want to leave the choice up to them as they will shoulder the burden. Sometimes a war is just about over and you don't want to leave a the next player with a couple of boring "clean-up" turns or you have worked to get something done that you feel is important and you don't want it lost. Take a couple extra to do so. Try not to "hog" all the fun, but don't short change yourself either.

 

[Tubby Rower]

If there are no objections, I guess we could go ahead and discuss the starting moves.

I would move worker SW to the game in forest, then road. Then go to the BG to mine then road.

We'll start out with Bronze working and Masonry, I'm not sure what to research or how much to invest in it. We are SCI & IND.

I think that the initial build would be 1 maybe 2 warriors for scouting out other civs, after that maybe a settler or granary? I don't know though. Since we are IND, workers aren't as high of a priority than if we were not Industrious.

How was that? What do you think?

 

[eldar]

1. Workers are always high priority, even more so as we're Industrious. The quicker we improve land, the better. (This is something I'm lax as myself - I rarely build more than 1 worker/city, until Steam Power.)

2. We could settle 1S. Still coastal, but less water tiles, gives us better production in the long run. It still avoids the volcano in the 20 tile radius, too.

3. Worker->game forest, chop, irrigate, road; then to BG, mine, road.

4. Warrior->Warrior(mp)->Granary (if a second food bonus), or Settler->Granary if no second food bonus.

5. Research Alphabet->Writing->CoL->Phil (Republic, free)->Lit. We should be able to manage it on max with roads up quick and the river. Lit ASAP, pre-build Libraries with Rax/Temples where possible.

6. My second city is usually a military city; Worker->Rax->Units

Neil.

 

[dmanakho]

I would settle in place, or we might lose a turn and move settler across the river to check if anything better opens up. We can move worker first of course but then if nothing opens up we will lose 2 turns before worker can reach that NW BG.
The rest of actions: move worker to BG and start mining and roading it.
i don't want to road forest, i think we should chop and irrigate it for extra bonus food from game. If there is a cow or wheat nearby we will get 4 turn settler factory, if not we should manage 6 turn factory.

We should start researching pottery at max and that should not take us longer than 16 turns IIRC.
Initial builds couple of warriors. If i see a clear short on settler factory i like to build granary 1st, if not we better build a settler then granary.

Our best bet would be to meet neigbours and trade for alphabet. Then research Writing most likely at minimum and go for a Republic slingshot gamble.

 

[eldar]

Just realised... the chop won't be too well timed, we probably just want to road the game forest and time the chop to happen in the Granary build. Should def. go Warrior->Warrior->Granary, as we won't have the food for a Settler in time, if we go for that third.

Neil.

 

[dmanakho]

3. Worker->game forest, chop, irrigate, road; then to BG, mine, road.

Neil.

I don't like this idea because we will most likely waste shields from chopped forest since we are building warriors in the beggining.

EDIT: I am also against roading the game... It will give us 1 gold anyways because it is on river but wasting 4 worker turns roading that game is waste of time
We will be better off roading and mining BG 1st.

 

[Tubby Rower]

Wouldn't roading the game give us an extra G each turn. IIRC game in the forest gives 2 food & 2 shield +1 G (for river). If we road it, it will give us 2 of everything until the chop for the granary, correct? Also moving the worker to the game would show us the tiles that we'd get from settling to the S. Then go for mining the BG. What could be seen in order to delay settling? another BG, cow?

about the research, I've had trouble buying Alpha from AI in my games. Is this an expensive tech normally? or am I not doing things right?

eldar, can you play first before vacation or are you not available to play until after next weekend? BTW, what is Rax?

 

[Minute Man]

Do you guys have room for one more? I've beaten Monarch a couple of times, but I'm far from a great player, so I'd welcome the chance to polish my skills a bit.

BTW, Rax = barracks.

 

[Tubby Rower]

Do you guys have room for one more?

Sure, we'll call it full now though. I'll update the signup thread and the 1st post to reflect it.

 

[Minute Man]

Thanks.

I agree with mining and roading the BG first. The problem with roading the game immediately is that it wastes three worker turns - two more to road a forest (compared to doing it after chopping) and then one extra move to get to the BG.

I also agree with researching Pottery at max so we can build a granary early. Then, depending on who we meet, either trade for or research Alpha, then research Writing, then decide if we want to try the Republic slingshot (I'm usually paranoid about being beaten to Philosophy, so I tend to research that right away and take Lit. as the bonus).

Alpha is expensive (I think it's the most expensive of the first tier techs), but it's still usually possible to trade for, at least in my experience.

 

[Tubby Rower]

So mine then road BG. research Pottery @ max. Settle in place?

dmanakho, you can go ahead and get the save when you are ready unless eldar wants to have a shot at it first since he's going on vac. Just post your intentions. The save is in the 1st post.

I also updated the second post in the thread to put the Succession Game Etiquette Guide that I got from scoutsout's Jumpmasters 1C. Since this is my first SG, it was more for me than anyone else and it's nice to see some guidelines....

 

[dmanakho]

I am toying with idea on:
1 moving worker to BG and if nothing good opens up within city radius if we settled in place i will move settler one tile south and settle there if nothing else opens again.
The final decision will depend on what we see when more tiles open.

I understand team has agreed to start researching potter at max and then gamble for republic slingshot.
Build 2 warriors 1st and then it will pretty much depend on surrounding environment
I will wait until late tonight and if eldar doesn't say he wants to take it i will play.

 

[DBear]

Great, put it up this morning and it's already full! Well as one who isn't doing much better, I'll be sure to follow this one. If anyone drops, let me know.