Trade Discussion $6: Oy, Now What?

[Stuck_as_a_Mac]

Discussion 6. Oy, now what do we have to kvetch with?
I fear for the value of Steam. Joan, for instance, would only trade a WM for it.
China will now only trade Incense, WM, 140g and 13gpt.
Russia, thankfully, will still pay Ivory, Spices, WM, 130gpt and 50g.
I suggest we do that trade immediatly before anyone else researches steam and cashes in on it.
America will pay us WM, 22gpt and 90g for Steam.
Zululand would give us WM and Democracy
I think we should consider having a fire-sale for steam. Just sell sell it and get what we can from it.

Suggestions?

And note: the only person willing to trade Steam for Nationalism is Cathy, but we dont want to do that.

SaaM
MoT

 

[Provolution]

China trade Incense, WM, 140g and 13gpt.
Russia, Nationalism plus whatever
America: WM, 22gpt and 90g for Steam.
Zululand : WM and Democracy


We really do need Nationalism for the Foreign Affairs people, so they can read who has whos MPP agreements, if we are seriously going for a Diplowin, we should at least know what is going on. We also need nationalism for riflemen, so we do not have to build muskets we need to upgrade anyways. Avoiding nationalism is dumb, ineconomic, hurts security and makes a diplowin harder. (we actually polled diplowin)

 

[Ginger_Ale]

Sell to these civs in this order (obviously some civ will discover it soon):

Russia
China
America

And then any other 'profitable' trades.

@Provo + Nationalism: It's EXTREMELY expensive. Wait until more civs have it, then we can trade...

 

[Stuck_as_a_Mac]

@Provo: While I do normally agree with you, Nationalism will us nothing from the Russians and only make us loose out on a deal. and @ga- they basically all have it, but none of them seem to want to budge. I propose we just wait until rep parts and the infantry. besides, re mpps: isnt if one civ has the ability to sign them, you can propose it? like maps in c3c when you dont have the tech.

and also @ga- the order is how id do it as well.

SaaM

 

[blackheart]

@Provo: While I do normally agree with you, Nationalism will us nothing from the Russians and only make us loose out on a deal. and @ga- they basically all have it, but none of them seem to want to budge. I propose we just wait until rep parts and the infantry. besides, re mpps: isnt if one civ has the ability to sign them, you can propose it? like maps in c3c when you dont have the tech.

and also @ga- the order is how id do it as well.

SaaM

Yep, if they have the tech for it and we don't, we can still propose it as long as we have an embassy there. Nationalism is going to cost us an army and a leg, I suggest perhaps signing a ROP to increase relations before trading for nationalism.

 

[Cyc]

Russia, Ivory, Spices, WM, 130gpt and 50g.
China, Incense, WM, 140g and 13gpt.
America, WM, 22gpt and 90g for Steam.
Zululand, WM and Democracy

I'd say at this point we should trade steam all the way around in the above order. I think Nationalism can wait and I really see NO reason for signing ROPs.

 

[Sir Donald III]

Don't forget, once we sell to 1, the price drops.

In which case, the Zulu Trade should be either 1st or 2nd, and America should be done last.

Yep.. France has NOTHING to offer us, except techs which are valued higher than what Steam is worth to them... Meh...

President's Recommended Order:
If we want Nationalism:
1. Russia (Nationalism)
2. Zulu (Democracy)
3. China or America
4. The other

If we don't:
1. China (Incense)
2. Zulu (Democracy)
3. Russia if they can give a lux, America if they won't
4. The other

Poll Recommendation:
Poll Trade Plans, especially ones offered by this thread. Alternately, the peoiple can choose which countries to trade for, but leave the order at the DP's discression. (Separate options for Russia with Nationalism, and Russia without Nationalism)

In other news:
Someone gave the Aztecs the Printing Press.

Rome, however, still doesn't have it. It also does not have Chemistry. And I think I'd rather give them that, IF we don't get Democracy. (If we do, Press & 4 Workers will suffice for now...)

 

[TimBentley]

Note that Russia doesn't have democracy. We might be able to get more gold out of them (assuming they have any left). Also, is there the possibility of getting more gold instead of luxuries? Three luxuries may be more than we need. We are only importing dyes from America. Zulu would be willing to sell democracy for 2000-3000g, assuming PTW isn't too far off. The AI does value government technologies more in trading (I think).

I think I'd prefer this order: Russia, China, Zulu, America (in PTW they were willing to give all their gold + gpt + WM).

 

[MOTH]

I think we should 1st trade Zulu for Democracy. One the price for Steam drops I doubt the Zulu's will do a trade for Democracy without us paying.

We should then use Democracy @3rd and Steam @3rd in the next trades to get the most possible from the AI's.

My overall order would be:
Zulu, Russia, China, America, France (if they will pay anything for Democracy)

We can then open up discussion about trading Industry for Nationalism.

 

[Stuck_as_a_Mac]

Alright. I will post a poll later this afternoon based on the paths outlined here. Of course, we will have Russia w/ Nationalism and Russia w/o it. DP will have the power to make up the order, though I will advise that Russia be done first and Zulu done second (max cash, followed by tech)

Look for the poll in an hour or two.

SaaM
MoT
Mayor of Yatta
Chair of Preforming Arts, University of Zojoji

 

[Stuck_as_a_Mac]

The Oy Oy Oy Show

Note: Title stolen from Al Franken and Air America Radio.

 

[Furiey]

Russia will give 171gpt (not 130) in addition to Ivory, Spices, WM and 50gold for Steam (at least on my Vanilla Civ they will). The most gpt they have is 198gpt. They want 112gpt for Ivory, Spices, WM and 50 gold, making the deal for Steam from Russia equivalent to 238gpt!

Zulu want 112gpt for Democracy, but have no gpt to give, therefore if we do the Zulu trade first we will get less than the full value of Steam - only the equivalent of 112gpt. Trading Steam to Russia first will give us the maximum value for the first trade. It will then depreciate, but 112gpt is less than half what Russia will give for it, so do the Russian deal first, then Zulu - if we have to throw in a few gpt to get Democracy so be it, but we make enough on the Russian trade to do so.

China want 31gpt for Incense making that deal the equivalent of 64gpt

America only has 22gpt available

My order would therefore be:

Russia
Zulu
China
America

and hopefully the depreciation is roughly in line with what they are able to pay.

If people are worried about taking so much from Russia and leaving them with nothing - better to take it and then gift it back, same result in money terms, but we get them happier with us for the gift - we get no credit for selling cheap.

 

[Cyc]

From Russia with Steam.

I think too many people are still using C3C to make analysis and recomendation.