Treasure Planet

[Zkribbler]

I loath the movie Treasure Planet. I imagine this is mostly because I love Treasure Island , especially the Wallace Beery version, and Treasure Planet is a betrayal. Also, the star ships look like tall ships from the Golden Age of Pirates. "Spacers" run around on deck with no breathing gear and the hulls of the star ships are build for sailing on seas, not navigating deep space. (I'm willing to accept the sails because they are explained to be solar sails.)

Recently I came across a YouTube vid wherein the reviewer likes Treasure Planet.

The reviewer makes several salient points. So I am willing to give the movie another viewing.

What sayeth you? Treasure Planet: good movie or terrible movie?

 

[Valka D'Ur]

I loath the movie Treasure Planet. I imagine this is mostly because I love Treasure Island , especially the Wallace Beery version, and Treasure Planet is a betrayal. Also, the star ships look like tall ships from the Golden Age of Pirates. "Spacers" run around on deck with no breathing gear and the hulls of the star ships are build for sailing on seas, not navigating deep space. (I'm willing to accept the sails because they are explained to be solar sails.)

Recently I came across a YouTube vid wherein the reviewer likes Treasure Planet.

The reviewer makes several salient points. So I am willing to give the movie another viewing.

What sayeth you? Treasure Planet: good movie or terrible movie?

Modern Disney cartoons are crap. I'll take the live action stuff from the '50s - '70s, thanks.

 

[Ajidica]

I was ambivalent when I first saw Treasure Planet, but after a watched it a couple years ago I loved it. The animation is great and the story is a fun retelling of the standard Treasure Island story. It is a lot like Atlantis: The Lost Empire in that it had outstanding animation and was clearly a labor of love by the creators but just didn't click with audiences in an already saturated market. (Sort of like Dreamwork's The Road to El Dorado which had a surprisingly good soundtrack by Elton John.)
Disney's recent John Carter was similar. A fun pulpy action movie where the hero and princess were attractive and just about capable of acting. Unfortunately, it was let down by a terrible advertising campaign* and the first ten minutes of the movie made no sense.

*IIRC it was just advertised as "John Carter" and featured some generic dusty shots of the hero fighting a big brown monster. I had no idea what it was and completely ignored it. After watching it, I realized they should have called it "John Carter of Mars" and then I think it would have reminded me of the old pulpy sci-fi space operas.

 

[Zkribbler]

This took longer than I anticipated. Although YouTube presented a menu of full movie choices, one turned out to be in Spanish, one in Hindi, one in German, and the English version is nearly inaudible. Nevertheless, I made it through.

I continue to loath Treasure Planet.

I inferred from the video I saw that the movie explained the universe there was full of air. But then I saw no such explanation. I saw a movie ignoring that outer space is a vacuum. I saw a movie base upon a premise that solar sails can take a ship across the galaxy in just a few days. I saw star ships shaped like 17th centure sailing ships for no particular reason. I saw a science fiction movie bereft of science.

 

[Zkribbler]

Modern Disney cartoons are crap. I'll take the live action stuff from the '50s - '70s, thanks.

I doth protest!

The Incredibles, Tangled, Brave, Lion King, Aladdin, Lilo & Stitch, and Frozen are terrific movies.

 

[Ajidica]

I inferred from the video I saw that the movie explained the universe there was full of air. But then I saw no such explanation. I saw a movie ignoring that outer space is a vacuum. I saw a movie base upon a premise that solar sails can take a ship across the galaxy in just a few days. I saw star ships shaped like 17th centure sailing ships for no particular reason. I saw a science fiction movie bereft of science.

Is your enjoyment of a movie dependent upon it being scientifically accurate? Are you grumpy about Wallace and Gromit's A Grand Day Out because the moon isn't made of cheese with a coin-operated robot living on it?
It's alright if you don't like Treasure Planet, but this seems like some very odd criticisms to make.

 

[Zkribbler]

Is your enjoyment of a movie dependent upon it being scientifically accurate?

Good point. I'd say it's a matter of degree.

For example, the very concept of a starship isn't scientifically accurate because we have no science which will allow a ship to traverse interstellar distances in a reasonable amount of time. Yet I can live with this, esp. when the writer makes an effort to explain it. But here, the movie presented people breathing in outer space, which we all know, is impossible.

 

[Valka D'Ur]

I doth protest!

The Incredibles, Tangled, Brave, Lion King, Aladdin, Lilo & Stitch, and Frozen are terrific movies.

The only one of those I've seen is Aladdin. I never even heard of two of them.

Is your enjoyment of a movie dependent upon it being scientifically accurate?

If it calls itself a science fiction movie, the science had better at least be plausible.

Good point. I'd say it's a matter of degree.

For example, the very concept of a starship isn't scientifically accurate because we have no science which will allow a ship to traverse interstellar distances in a reasonable amount of time. Yet I can live with this, esp. when the writer makes an effort to explain it. But here, the movie presented people breathing in outer space, which we all know, is impossible.

Exactly. And now for a very good Doctor Who story on this theme... have you ever seen the Fifth Doctor story "Enlightenment"? It's the final one in the Turlough/Black Guardian story arc. The Doctor, Tegan, and Turlough get mixed up in an interstellar boat race being held by a race of immortals, and some of them are fascinated by the Doctor and his companions because they're not immortal - the word used is Ephemerals.

The immortals don't need air to breathe on deck, but Ephemerals have to wear space suits.

This story features quite a bit of Tegan's cleavage in a fancy dress, and we see that the Doctor really is someone who occasionally notices things like that.

 

[Zkribbler]

... have you ever seen the Fifth Doctor story "Enlightenment"?

I've never seen a Dr. Who.

 

[Valka D'Ur]

I've never seen a Dr. Who.

Whut?

Seriously?

Okay, your fannish education has a humungous gap in it.

Did you ever see the TV version of Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy? All Creatures Great and Small? Campion? I won't ask if you've seen the Tomorrow People episode called "A Man For Emily"...

All of the above are shows Peter Davison was in, either as a guest star or as the star.

 

[Zkribbler]

Whut?

Seriously?

Okay, your fannish education has a humungous gap in it.

No argument from me.

I worked psychotic hours at work and then retired to the Land of Sucky TV: No US networks, no Netflicks, we had BBC for awhile but it's gone. When I got here we had two stores which had DVDs & CDs. I built up an awesome library, but they've now closed.

Did you ever see the TV version of Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy?

I've seen a few excerpts ...

All Creatures Great and Small? Campion? I won't ask if you've seen the Tomorrow People episode called "A Man For Emily"...

Nope, nope, nopity nope. And I don't have a cat!

 

[Valka D'Ur]

No argument from me.

I worked psychotic hours at work and then retired to the Land of Sucky TV: No US networks, no Netflicks, we had BBC for awhile but it's gone. When I got here we had two stores which had DVDs & CDs. I built up an awesome library, but they've now closed.


I've seen a few excerpts ...


Nope, nope, nopity nope. And I don't have a cat!

What do cats have to do with anything?

 

[Mouthwash]

Modern Disney cartoons are crap. I'll take the live action stuff from the '50s - '70s, thanks.

Actually, Treasure Planet was something of an auteur film. It was super original at the time, with a unique animation style, and its failure at the box office made Disney run in a whole different direction.

If it calls itself a science fiction movie, the science had better at least be plausible.

If it's set in our universe, then you have a point. Treasure Planet's universe is retrofuturist ('Georgianpunk?'), and is under no obligation to conform to our reality. Really, don't you think realism is a strange demand to make of a universe where people can breath the ether in space?

 

[Valka D'Ur]

Really, don't you think realism is a strange demand to make of a universe where people can breath the ether in space?

The point is that they shouldn't be able to breathe it. Even the Fifth Doctor story "Enlightenment" had the human characters needing space helmets and oxygen when they were up on deck.

When science fiction ignores such basics and doesn't provide a plausible explanation, it ceases to be science fiction and should call itself fantasy. And even fantasy needs a consistent set of in-universe rules for how the fantasy works.

 

[Mouthwash]

When science fiction ignores such basics and doesn't provide a plausible explanation, it ceases to be science fiction and should call itself fantasy.

I disagree, but if you insist we can call it speculative fiction. Your example doesn't work because Doctor Who is still ostensibly set in a version of our universe.

And even fantasy needs a consistent set of in-universe rules for how the fantasy works.

Does it not have them?

 

[Valka D'Ur]

I disagree, but if you insist we can call it speculative fiction. Your example doesn't work because Doctor Who is still ostensibly set in a version of our universe.

Is it? There are three different versions of Atlantis, and The Day of the Daleks makes no internal sense when you try to sort out the time travel issues - particularly when trying to match it up with the other Classic Who time traveling Dalek stories.

Let's just not get into the fairy tale nonsense of nuWho.

 

[Zkribbler]

Treasure Planet's universe is retrofuturist ('Georgianpunk?'), and is under no obligation to conform to our reality.

I don't recall the movie making this point clear. What did they say about the seagoing hulls on space-going ships or the ability to cross the galaxy in just a few weeks?