Trump-Merkel meeting :o

[Kyriakos]

Regardless of Trump being a clown, this was funny to see, nomatter why he did it

Yes, looks like it was a very pleasant discussion indeed.


-Do you think that US-Germany relations are changing?

 

[Kyriakos]

^She can't do anything to him, though. Or the US. Which is why this is interesting. Battle between two pieces of crap

 

[VicRatlhead5199]

He just looks so ridiculous meeting other world leaders. It's depressing. The childish way he acted around the German Chancellor was kind of disturbing really. I can see Kyriakos' point though. From a fellow EU member's PoV, where Germany has been playing a strong hand, it probably is kind of funny to see her kind of impotent next to a douche like Trump.

I honestly could get on board with his stance of getting US allies to commit more to their own defense if he advocated reducing defense spending but he's suggested an increase. He talks about wanting peace with Russia and points fingers at others for being warhawks but at the same time he courts disaster in East Asia with China and N. Korea while in the Middle East he spits on Iran and shows a shocking lack of knowledge about the Isreal/Palestine issue. I really wonder what his end-game in foreign policy is. War with Iran? N. Korea? China? Is he trying to get peace in the Middle East by joining Isreal in completely subjugating the Palestinians?

2020 can't come soon enough. Even impeachment doesn't offer much solace since Pence is a bit of an extremist himself.

 

[Lillefix]

He seems to be way over his head.

 

[Broken_Erika]

Nothing beats the moment when he tried to shake Trudeau's hand. Best. Picture. Ever.

 

[GenMarshall]

2020 can't come soon enough. Even impeachment doesn't offer much solace since Pence is a bit of an extremist himself.

What about the midterm elections? It can partly curb Trump's damages via checks and ballances from Congress. So long as Trump doesn't manage to rewrite the constitution, Congress still has the power in the treaty department.

But then he'll wine on twitter that congress is not going his way, blinded by fake news.

 

[VicRatlhead5199]

What about the midterm elections? It can partly curb Trump's damages via checks and ballances from Congress. So long as Trump doesn't manage to rewrite the constitution, Congress still has the power in the treaty department.

But then he'll wine on twitter that congress is not going his way, blinded by fake news.

The judicial branch has been doing alright at curbing his more overtly unconstitutional moves and the GoP senate isn't exactly 100% in support of him. His feuds with Ryan will only push the House further away from supporting him. The system is sort of working anyway. I'm mostly interested in ending the international embarrassment his presidency is. We're stuck with that until 2020.

 

[Gigaz]

Germany elects a new Bundestag on september 24th and Merkel is closer to loosing than ever. I actually hope I get to see some decent anti-American rants. The defense spending issue is a legitimate point of possible disagreement. If Germany doesn't increase its spending from 1.2 to 2% but instead only to 1.5%, then what is Donald going to do? Leave Nato? Everyone would say he lost his mind and Putin blackmails him.

 

[Kyriakos]

Germany elects a new Bundestag on september 24th and Merkel is closer to loosing than ever. I actually hope I get to see some decent anti-American rants. The defense spending issue is a legitimate point of possible disagreement. If Germany doesn't increase its spending from 1.2 to 2% but instead only to 1.5%, then what is Donald going to do? Leave Nato? Everyone would say he lost his mind and Putin blackmails him.

US doesn't need Nato, and if it leaves it there obviously is no Nato remaining. You don't want to market it as military alliance with Canada, the other new world north atlantic nation

 

[GoodSarmatian]

US doesn't need Nato, and if it leaves it there obviously is no Nato remaining. You don't want to market it as military alliance with Canada, the other new world north atlantic nation

Here's a comprehensive list of NATO countries that have invoked the mutual-defense clause.

The USA after 9/11 2001.

That was a comprehensive list of NATO countries that have invoked the mutual-defense clause.


Few countries really need NATO more than the US. They get to stash their nukes and airplanes everywhere because they want to project power, not because of an altruistic urge to defend us, and they're more comfortable selling weapons to allies.
Sure, there's the deterrent factor against Russia, but Russia isn't powerful enough to pose a legitimate threat to Europe. They could beat Germany, but France would already give them a lot of trouble and they wouldn't stand much of a chance against NATO -USA.

 

[Kyriakos]

^It just doesn't look like the US will accomplish something extra by having Nato, instead of individual deals to secure its armies movement when needed. I mean, even now, you don't see them wanting to station troops in Britain or Spain. They have a base here (Crete), but they also have a base in Turkey (Adana, iirc), and they could just relocate if needed.

 

[VicRatlhead5199]

Trump's urging to push allies into spending more probably has very little to do with mutual defense. At the risk of sounding arrogant we really only need permission to base our military at strategic points like GoodSarmatian pointed out. It probably has a lot to do with defense contractor lobbyists' influencing him. They'd like to increase sales to other wealthy countries. Trump strong arming NATO allies is a great way to do it.

If I was a leader he's bullied like that I'd probably hire a Chinese firm just to spite him. Ugh....did that sentence make me a traitor?

 

[Broken_Erika]

Yes, Yes it did, off to Guantanamo Bay with you.

 

[FriendlyFire]

^She can't do anything to him, though. Or the US. Which is why this is interesting. Battle between two pieces of crap

If you havent already notice Trumps meeting with world leaders have been international embarrassments, filled with bloopers, empty announcements, fake rhetoric
Anyway things are in for a shake up in the EU, with UK leaving the balance of power is going to shift again, probably in German bloc direction. Maybe it will be for the better

 

[FriendlyFire]

Japan and Germany
Not sure if I like, or should be worried about new Axis powers reassembling again.
I think its time to give German and Japan security council Seats, UK and France can remain as it will help balance out a more crazy US.

 

[Commodore]

US doesn't need Nato

Yeah, we do. We wouldn't be in the alliance otherwise. Membership in NATO is actually pretty key to our own national defense strategy.

 

[Kyriakos]

Yeah, we do. We wouldn't be in the alliance otherwise. Membership in NATO is actually pretty key to our own national defense strategy.

Maybe it can be rephrased to "US doesn't need Nato as much as most of the other members"? Though it seems that Nato itself formed primarily so as to allow for swift US intervention in the case of Russian attack in other euro countries (?).

 

[Silurian]

Yeah, we do. We wouldn't be in the alliance otherwise. Membership in NATO is actually pretty key to our own national defense strategy.

I agree.

NATO stops the EU developing as a separate military power bloc, which could in the future become a threat to the US.
It also helps the US diplomatically, as NATO members are less likely to take active measures when they do not agree with the US.

Europe gains from the added security.

 

[Kyriakos]

Say, in the Euro-Crisis many non-European Anglospherians failed to understand that Germany wasn't acting alone against the periphery, but rather as the most powerful member of a hard-money camp of which they were arguably the more persuadable. At many points Germans took it as far in the direction that, say, Krugmanite Americans would have liked, as their Dutch, Austrian, Finnish, Estonian, Slovakian etc. allies would let them.

Finland would be itself under austerity/forced ruinous loans, if there was a law applying to all states. As for Estonia and Slovakia... those are so small GDP-wise that it is farcical to claim they caused any decision making, it is obvious they were an alibi for those willing to delude themselves re who decided.

All in all, the Eu under german leadership become the worst Eu of all time, and went from a serious and respectable block to something even "third world" (a rather bad term, but anyway) country leaders now mock, and is bordering dissolution, depending on this year's elections in France and Italy.

 

[Kyriakos]

I can understand how you would see it that way. And yours is the saner perspective. It's not correct thought. You undererstimate the anxiety and insecurity of the german psyche.

I probably do, but the problem is that the anxiety there is causing actual ruin here, which isn't fair. :/

To phrase it in your terms: It's worse than you thought: You're being ruled by emo girls who cut themselves.

Maybe Germany is more like Japan than you think, if your economy minister doubles as an emo girl!