Trying this out, but a little confused...

[licker]

Right so since my machine doesn't run elemental worth a damn (hope they improve that as they patch along) I thought I'd dust off this one since I know Civ4 runs well.

Anyway, can't remember the last time I played, but it was years ago, so I DLed the .41 version, and ran the patch-o (I think that's what it was called) and last night everything was working.

This morning though, nothing moves. I mean i can move, animals wander, but barbs just sit on their lairs, and the AI units (other than what they start with I assume, and workers) just sit in the city that builds them. I didn't change any settings, other than tech brokering being on, but apparently something got borked somehow. Any advice?

Also, I poked around a bit but couldn't find a clear answer...

Can you run BUG with FFH2? Can I use Blue Marble?

Thanks in advance.

 

[Emptiness]

The when the game first starts, there are no barbarians (except for the occasional Skeleton/Goblin/Lizardman). Then the game enters a period during which barbarians are spawning in the areas that are not in vision of any of the civs. Then, as time progresses, those barbarians stop spawning and barbarian cities begin to appear. When a new barbarian city appears one Warrior will move out. The city will begin to produce Warriors, and once four Warriors have been built they will move out in a stack.

You are probably at the point in your game where barbarians have stopped spawning in the unseen areas of the map, and several barbarian cities have appeared (and sent out their initial Warriors). You won't see more barbarians until those cities can build a stack of four Warriors, at which point you will see those stacks moving to attack.

Barbarians on lairs won't leave them undefended (normally). The lair will occasionally spawn a second barbarian, at which point the first one will move to attack and the second will take up the duty of guarding the lair. The spawning is random, so at times long periods can pass without new barbarians leaving from a lair. Also, eventually no new barbarians will spawn at lairs.

-------------

Blue Marble can be used with FfH2. You can download the FfH2 version of Blue Marble here. Personally, I think that Blue Marble doesn't suit the smaller scale and fantasy setting of FfH2 as well as the normal FfH2 terrain, but the option is there for those who want it.

 

[licker]

Thank you for the information.

My concern with the units not moving is not exactly what you describe.

In one game my borders expanded to encompass two goblin camps, which just sat there and eventually had 6 and 7 units on them. They never moved, even if I stuck a worker next to them.

The AI players behaved exactly the same. A city with a dozen warriors in it, I could declare war and pillage every tile they had, and the units would just sit in the city.

I found it very odd because the night before I did not experience this behavior. A constant stream of lizardmen would start poking around my borders, though no stacks. I guess I wonder if there is a setting somewhere in the start up options which controls this behavior, though as I said, the only setting I changed was tech brokering.

Or is this behavior somehow map based? I've been using the techtonics maps.

Thanks for the link to BM, I'll check it out, but you may be right that the 'feel' won't be as good. Pity there's no BUG for it though, I like those improvements, especially the city happiness warnings, I guess I have to get used to checking those manually again

 

[Breunor]

Licker,

Do you have the latest patch? It shoudl be patch o.

Best wishes,

Breunor

 

[deanej]

The first time you played you might have been the target of the barbarians. Unlike base civ, in FFH barbarians target a civ to attack, and will largely ignore the other civs.

The AI leaves units in cities. While a human's strategy is to attack units entering its borders, the AI's is to fortify cities and hope for the best. This is normal.

 

[Emptiness]

In one game my borders expanded to encompass two goblin camps, which just sat there and eventually had 6 and 7 units on them. They never moved, even if I stuck a worker next to them.

The only time I've seen this happen is when I was playing a leader with the Barbarian trait, and there was no path for the barbarian units to get to another player. What leader are you playing?

The AI players behaved exactly the same. A city with a dozen warriors in it, I could declare war and pillage every tile they had, and the units would just sit in the city.

Did the AI have more than one city? I know that if you declare war on an AI civ early enough then they will pull back to their capital and wait until they have "enough" troops to take you on before attacking, even if this means you are able to pillage all their improvements. This is a defensive measure, intended to make it harder for you to bait their Warriors out of the safety of the city and so harder for you to capture their only city. Of course, in the long run the civ still loses, but the overall challenge of the game for you is greater because you spend more time and resources defeating that one city.

If an AI has more than one city then it will tend to have units that defend their cities (which generally stay there), and then a big stack of units that moves around to defend their territory and attack their enemies. I suppose that if the AI's civ was big enough you might be able to go in and pillage their improvements for a while and not see their big stack because it was elsewhere - but usually it will move to attack you when you invade the AI's territory, and so you would probably have seen it by now.

I found it very odd because the night before I did not experience this behavior. A constant stream of lizardmen would start poking around my borders, though no stacks. I guess I wonder if there is a setting somewhere in the start up options which controls this behavior, though as I said, the only setting I changed was tech brokering.

Or is this behavior somehow map based? I've been using the techtonics maps.

Map selection should not cause what you are describing, and as far as I know none of the game options can cause this either. It's possible that something else is interfering with FfH2. Did you install any new mods or modmods for Civ IV or FfH2 between when enemies were acting normal and when they started standing around?

It might be helpful for you to post a copy of your game (assuming you are using Patch O) in which this is occurring, so someone else can load it and see how the enemy units behave. Also, try creating a new game - does the same problem exist, or are the barbarians behaving as expected in that game?

 

[licker]

Ok, thanks for the feedback everyone.

I do have the -o patch installed and no other mods, and have started maybe 5 or so new games just running around to see what kind of barb action I'm up against.

Perhaps everything is working as intended, if so that's fine, I'll just have to adapt to it. As stated in the title I was confused, not disappointed

I'll be back with more questions probably, but for now let me see what kind of trouble I can get into. Seems much easier than I was expecting after my 1st game, since I was constantly pressured by something in that one.

 

[licker]

Ok, great, fired up a new game last night and everything seemed to be 'working', at least it was more interesting than the attempts where nothing seemed to be moving.

But some more questions if you all don't mind repeating stuff that's probably around here somewhere

Playing as Hippus on Prince level, epic speed, large map 10 players Mediterranean map so all land should be connected somehow , some leader with financial and the trait that speeds settler growth (got him randomly since I don't really know any of the differences anyway).

Anyway, the game is nearing the 300 turn and I've met 3 other civs, only 2 of whom I actually have seen. My empire is 8 cities right now, but I'm in a mass expansion phase since I managed to finally knock out some annoying barbs/animals.

Is that normalish? I know it's harder to explore, but it seems as though I should have met more civs, or they should have met me. Does the AI not sign as many open border agreements in FFH?

I'm about 90 points behind the leader (of the 4 civs I know, including me) and about 90 points ahead of the other 2, of course those points don't necessarily mean anything, but techwise I'm lagging the leader by 3+ techs, and ahead of the other guys by a few as well, I guess I don't really have a feel for the tech pace, or important techs to bee-line for (depends on play style and map and all that anyway...).

Anyway, having some fun with it, but hoping that I don't have it too easy, since I don't see any units from any of my neighbors, even though my relations with my closest are pretty bad (-4 or -5 depending on the phase of the moon I guess). Of course my military isn't horrible, but it's also likely not that large compared to what the AI usually does in BTS, though again, no idea if that's a good comparison. I've got ~16 archers ~8 horsemen and a smattering of left over warriors from the early game. Oh yeah, one of my archers was sent out to a forested hill to suck up the stream of skeletons, and he's gotten pretty buff, but... he got diseased. Medic 2 will cure it, but is there a building or other way to heal him? I'm running the religion you get from Honor (can't recall the name...).

Thanks in advance again, and I hope my questions aren't too annoying.

 

[Emptiness]

Playing as Hippus [...] some leader with financial and the trait that speeds settler growth

That would be Rhoanna (who is female, btw).

Anyway, the game is nearing the 300 turn and I've met 3 other civs, only 2 of whom I actually have seen. My empire is 8 cities right now, but I'm in a mass expansion phase since I managed to finally knock out some annoying barbs/animals.

Is that normalish? I know it's harder to explore, but it seems as though I should have met more civs, or they should have met me. Does the AI not sign as many open border agreements in FFH?

It sounds normalish, though I don't play on epic speed or on the Mediterranean map or on large map size - all of which would influence how quickly contacts are made. Leaders in FfH2 are very easy with the open borders agreements, with a few exceptions, so that is probably not a factor. The main limitation on early contact is the fact that the mortality rate of early scouting units is very high. It can be difficult to get a unit around to make contact with everyone. This will vary a lot from game to game, as there is a lot of luck involved in how long your scouting units can survive.

Anyway, having some fun with it, but hoping that I don't have it too easy, since I don't see any units from any of my neighbors, even though my relations with my closest are pretty bad (-4 or -5 depending on the phase of the moon I guess). Of course my military isn't horrible, but it's also likely not that large compared to what the AI usually does in BTS, though again, no idea if that's a good comparison. I've got ~16 archers ~8 horsemen and a smattering of left over warriors from the early game.

Four units per city is, by FfH2 AI standards, a small army. You'll need much more if you want to deter AIs from declaring war on you. (You may not care, though, since number of units doesn't really determine who will win a war.) If you have less than four units per city then you should expect that even leaders who seem to like you will want to declare war...you just seem too easy a target to them. Of course, this is just a guideline. You should try to have as large an army as you can support without damaging your economy.

Oh yeah, one of my archers was sent out to a forested hill to suck up the stream of skeletons, and he's gotten pretty buff, but... he got diseased. Medic 2 will cure it, but is there a building or other way to heal him? I'm running the religion you get from Honor (can't recall the name...).

Medic 2 just increases the passive healing rate of units in the stack. You need a tier 2 priest (a Vicar, for the Empyrean faith, which is associated with the Honor tech) to cast Remove Disease.