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TSG 248 After Actions Thread

Nizef

Emperor
GOTM Staff
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In this thread you can post the results of your game. Please state your victory/loss date (preferably in the post title) and describe your path to glory in this post! Players are encouraged to provide feedback on the game.

- Did you play peacefully or warlike? Did you use your UU?
- What technologies did you prioritize?
- What Social Policies did you choose and in what order? Which Ideology did you choose?
- How many cities did you have in the end and where did you settle them?
 
Domination victory turn 94

I planned to be peaceful as a dove, but events took on a life of their own.

Wheel and Horseback riding, Math.

Open Tradition, Aristocracy by mistake, Liberty.

Capitals went Addis Ababa, moscow, Ulundi, Persepolis (82), Beijing/Delhi (83), Istanbul/Kyoto, Ashur (94)

Army 1 (red) went south and took Addis, Ulundi, Persepolis and Kyoto.
Army 2 (blue) went north and took Beijing and Istanbul
Army 3 (brown) was bought from original st. pete's, took Moscow, Delhi, and Ankara.

I've never seen two ruins this close before.
2 close ruins.png



You can see cathy gave my st. pete's in a peace deal. That was a bad idea.
Mongolia52.png



Mongolia94.png




Conquest plan.png
 

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Domination win turn 98.

The capital is on riverhill north of the start. 4 cities of tradition. I planned to play almost peacefully until the keshiks. But I realized that it would be faster to kill everyone with chariots and horsemen. I could learn the keshiks in about 102-103 turn
1 army - Persepolis (78) - Kyoto (86) - Delhi (98)
2 army - Ashur (85) - Moscow (98)
3 army - Istanbul (87) - Beijing (93)
4 army - Ulundi (91) - Addis Ababa (98)

The huge forest in front of Moscow and Delhi was the biggest problem that slowed down the conquest.
 
Domination on turn 268. I have no idea how y'all are getting sub-100-turn victories. It takes almost that long just to scout a large map.

I took out the Zulus and Persia and started on Japan and Ottomans with chariot archers, then upgraded them to Keshiks and started building more Keshiks. (as I suspected, soon after I killed Darius, everyone declared a joint war against me) China built the Great Wall, but my Keshiks had lots of promotions by then so it wasn't really a problem. (then *I* had the Great Wall, which was useful mostly to keep barbarians out)

The only city that was difficult to take was Delhi because it had a Mughal Fort and an arsenal by the time I got there.

Social policies were Tradition opener, full Honor, finished Tradition, Patronage opener to unlock Forbidden Palace, and Commerce. There was no need for Rationalism in this one. I took the Autocracy ideology right at the end by having 3 factories, but it didn't really affect anything.

This was fun enough I might try it again to see if I can get a quicker win.
 

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Domination victory turn 129. I think, compared to the sub-100 players, I did a couple of things 'wrong': 1) I went for Keshiks (not sim until Keshiks, but not pumping out army all the time either), 2) I built only a single army, 3) I probably still built a little too much infrastructure, although I did not overdo it this time. No Temple of Artemis, no Hanging Gardens, and there were a couple of very nice city spots that I refrained from settling.

My early game was probably a little bit slow. I wanted to tribute the nearby CS, so I bought an early warrior, but that was not enough; I needed to build an additional warrior (a spearman upgrade would have been very handy here). I also got a worker out late. I was hoping to steal one, but on prince that took way too long, so I built one in the end, but that meant my horses came online late too. I had declared war on all the civs I met pretty much immediately, and that part worked out well. The gold from peace deals came streaming in (although they will only pay you for peace in case they have at least a second city), although it did not occur to me to keep a city as @fiddlesticks had. I used the gold to buy a couple of chariots, and later it went into my upgrade fund for Keshiks. At the end of the game I had 12 Keshiks, at least 10 of which were upgraded chariots, so that is 1350 gold right there (I did not have the gold upgrade policy from honor).

For my social policies, I went honor opener into a little bit of tradition, then left-side honor for the XP gain, then (finally) completing tradition. I did not build a shrine, but I had a lot of CS friendship (barb camp clearing is so useful if neither the CS nor the AI civs build much army), and eventually I even got a religion helped by late faith ruins (the AI is terrible at scouting the edges of the map): tithe, production, and pasture culture for the pantheon.

I don't recall the exact time at which I got Keshiks, but it was not as fast as the T102 I've heard other players mention (perhaps it did not help that I first built a library and then Great Library when it became apparent that the AIs that started it were not actually going to finish it any time soon). My single army went Ottomans, China, Ethiopia, Zulu, Persia, Japan, Assyria (aided by some barb-clearing units), India, Russia. I had a nice army in the end, although it was complete overkill, since the AI barely managed to field a comp bow or two (the movement of the Keshiks did help around the forests of Moscow and Delhi though).

1720108016935.png
 
A question for the strong players here. Do you ever declare a war against a strong AI just to kneecap them without taking their capitol; settle for peace and immediately attack someone else? Then finish off the first when the peace treaty expires? If they have more than one city left they will often pay dearly for peace. (if they have only one city left whether it's their original capitol or not they are never willing to do anything more than exchange embassies for peace)
 
A question for the strong players here. Do you ever declare a war against a strong AI just to kneecap them without taking their capitol; settle for peace and immediately attack someone else? Then finish off the first when the peace treaty expires? If they have more than one city left they will often pay dearly for peace. (if they have only one city left whether it's their original capitol or not they are never willing to do anything more than exchange embassies for peace)
Without claiming to be a strong player, I was introduced to the idea of declaring war on contact with all AI. It diminishes trade options (to some extent) but does open the possibility of peace deals later.

When I was learning civ 5 and the game mechanics I played the rise of the mongol scenario, and coped the strategy of a strong player. The entire game hinged on the immediate DOW and it was quite the learning experience.

I now look to DOW as soon as possible, though I am still learning the consequences, if you become more powerful than the AI then often you are gifted cities in the peace deal., just as @fiddlesticks did above, captured St Peters.. and then used city as a base that to launch a third assault. The actual strategy will depend on who the neighbours are and how much you need the trades early game. Trading with distant Ai for example, leaves a choice, if you dont DOW you have a long term trade option, if you do DOW them, by the time you get round to them the peace deal will be so much sweeter. I guess @fiddlesticks would have more experience to answer this question, but that's my take.

If you are interested have a quick read through of my write up of the mongol scenario. As I say, this was one of my first civ 5 games, just to explore the rules, I copied the entire strategy.

 
The first time just make sure you get a worker, so have a clear escape route. Try to also get a second on the turn you want to make peace, then you don’t need to worry about the escape route.

You can generally get away with a second without too much diplomatic trouble, but after that you’ll be a pariah for the most part.
 
Won turn 148, with 2 armies of lots of Keshiks and 1 Horseman each.

t105 Ulundi (had Statue of Zeus)
t113 Pesepolis (Pyramids)
t123 Addis Abbaba, Kyoto
t132 Delhi
t133 Beijing
t143 Moscow, Istanbul
t148 Assur

Incredible how fast you all are winning! Guess my warmongering can still be improved :)
 
I played it again; went Liberty and the left side of Honor this time instead of Tradition and full Honor. The Patronage opener, Commerce opener, and Wagon Trains seemed more important than finishing Honor. Victory on turn 182 this time. I went counterclockwise starting quite early with the Zulus, but the Zulus took awhile. Maybe I shouldn't have taken Shaka's last city which was on a river hill and well defended, but I thought it would come back and bite me in the ass if I didn't. As soon as I researched Chivalry, which I rushed with my Liberty finisher great scientist just as i was conquering Japan, I upgraded my veteran chariots and sent them north thru the woods to India and Russia. I dispached a couple of fresh keshiks and a knight to Ethiopia to take Addis Ababa and earn some experience. While they were doing that the veterans conquered Assyria, then they all met up to finish off the Ottomans and China.

The thing that slowed me down a little was happiness because I was trying to keep it above -10 while razing multiple cities at once. Perhaps I should have puppeted them first, then annex/raze them one at a time. For some reason I was able to liberate Edirne even though I had eliminated Souleiman. I'm 2 turns away from finishing Forbidden Palace which will solve my happiness problem (which is really not that bad at the moment because Istanbul has Notre Dame):

20240708141506_1.jpg
 
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Why don't you try taking only the capitals? It's much faster and better for happiness. I let Shaka and all the others live, they never dared to attack me because my army was by far the biggest.
That's a good question. I thought if I left Shaka with one city (a really good one BTW), when he got impis he would take back Ulundi and I'd have to capture it again -- or else leave a large military there to defend it. And Persia and Japan, if I didn't wipe them out they'd settle new cities right in my roads to connect my cities. (I suppose I could declare war again and raze those cities) The rest, I mostly just captured capitals unless the city was in the way.
 
That's a good question. I thought if I left Shaka with one city (a really good one BTW), when he got impis he would take back Ulundi and I'd have to capture it again -- or else leave a large military there to defend it. And Persia and Japan, if I didn't wipe them out they'd settle new cities right in my roads to connect my cities. (I suppose I could declare war again and raze those cities) The rest, I mostly just captured capitals unless the city was in the way.
I decided to take a chance, and turns out they wouldn't attack if your army is the strongest.

I think I just captured one non-capital, of the Ottoman empire because they had the Great Wall. Plan was to "citadel" my way to the capital. As it turns out, Keshiks are so strong not even the Great Wall can stop them with their 5 movement... I probably wouldn't even have needed to capture that city!
 
"What about the civs outside of your start area? Would you DOW these on sight? Or wait to see what trade deals may be offered?"

Generally, I'll wait a bit. On deity, you'll often need trading partners for luxuries and gold. Sometimes I will if it's a Pangea style map I will, but generally only if I can get a caravan, otherwise I'll wait.
 
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