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Tuning Religion Founder Beliefs Round 2

Discussion in 'General Balance' started by CrazyG, Mar 8, 2017.

  1. ElliotS

    ElliotS Warmonger

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    What if you got a regular missionary in your holy city every time you passed a policy instead of faith? That would be way cooler and a small buff imo.
     
  2. CrazyG

    CrazyG Deity

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    Overall the founder beliefs are a lot weaker than before, so I don't think you can compare to the old version and claim its weaker therefore buff it
     
  3. ElliotS

    ElliotS Warmonger

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    That's fair, but also something I considered. It seems weaker than all of the other founders 99% of the time now too. Do you agree or disagree?
     
  4. CrazyG

    CrazyG Deity

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    I haven't used it yet. I've never liked Holy Law and always thought it provided a lot less than the other options

    On paper it looks weaker than some other options, but if you changed it to 2 per follower it might be way too good
     
  5. ElliotS

    ElliotS Warmonger

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    So what about a missionary per policy instead of faith? Bit better early, worse later. Nice buff overall imo. Thoughts?
     
  6. CrazyG

    CrazyG Deity

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    Its not a bad idea, there isn't anything like it. It does make that belief extremely appealing to India
     
  7. CrazyG

    CrazyG Deity

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    Spoiler Pic :

    20170512115231_1.jpg

    So this happened using Apostolic tradition
     
  8. Gazebo

    Gazebo Lord of the Community Patch Supporter

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    What did you do?
     
  9. CrazyG

    CrazyG Deity

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    Churches let missionaries spread 3 times
    Pacifism + Piety means missionaries cost 110 faith during Medieval era
    I can buy about 1.5 missionaries a turn, currently they earn 240 food on each spread (and every time I spread that amount increases)


    It would probably make sense to cap the amount you can get, or take away scaling with era. Beliefs like Sainthood don't scale with era; populations increase as games go on so it scales naturally
     
  10. Gazebo

    Gazebo Lord of the Community Patch Supporter

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    That makes sense. I debated scaling with era or not. Seems not is the better choice
     
  11. Gazebo

    Gazebo Lord of the Community Patch Supporter

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    I'm going to strip away era scaling from apostolic tradition, and double yields from followers for Holy Law. I feel that this should balance things out well.
     
    CrazyG likes this.
  12. Enrico Swagolo

    Enrico Swagolo Deity

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    That's too much for Holy Law imho as it seemed very good in my Denmark game (though maybe slightly weakish as it gave me maybe 1.5 turn's worth of Science every renaissance policy), but the apostolic tradition nerf is probably deserved. Only tried it once and was surprised to see Spain's UA doesn't proc this. It should probably be mentioned it's only for missionary spreads
     
  13. Gazebo

    Gazebo Lord of the Community Patch Supporter

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    Policies don't come all that often, though. One catch could be doubling it, but then removing one of the three yields it generates. I don't want to get into decimals (1.5) as that's a pain to code.

    G
     
  14. ElliotS

    ElliotS Warmonger

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    Yeah, let's double it for now and nerf if it needs it.
     
  15. Horvath Broncos

    Horvath Broncos Warlord

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    So i am playing with Inca and went with elder of councils and I am a religious powerhouse. In early medieval I am getting nearly 700 production and science when I convert city. I have converted about 40 cities but still I think that is way too much. I got Alhambra in one turn because of this. I am playing on epic speed and on a huge map by the way.
     
  16. ElliotS

    ElliotS Warmonger

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    That sounds like it's fine. Converting 40 cities is insane, even on huge.

    I suppose we could discuss an inverse scaling based on mapsize for most of these, as Elder of Councils is obviously much better on huge than small for example.
     
    Owlbebach likes this.
  17. Horvath Broncos

    Horvath Broncos Warlord

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    I suppose I was very lucky that I was only one that founded on my "continent" which had about 8 civs on it. Also I play on a huge map with 22 civs so that makes the scaling even crazier. Though some kinda scaling with map size would be great.
     
  18. ElliotS

    ElliotS Warmonger

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    Extreme settings get extreme results, and you're obviously a corner case even then. (Being the only one to found on such a continent.)
     
  19. Gazebo

    Gazebo Lord of the Community Patch Supporter

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    That already exists - # of religions.

    G
     
  20. CrazyG

    CrazyG Deity

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    Many of the founder beliefs get pretty crazy with enough cities following. I recently had ceremonial burial at 130 faith/culture scaling with era. And that was just for myself, 1 neighbor and a few city states.
     

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