Caledorn
Emperor
Good thing you did, grant. We need to consider WPC's response before we decide to move further close to their borders as they were very specific that they don't want us moving close to their borders.
Turn 1-50
- Thread starter DaveShack
- Start date
YossarianLives
Deity
This is WPC's proposal:
I'm not sure I like this, as it just seems to send a message of distrust and secrecy. There's no way our Warrior can threaten their cap, so keeping us 1 tile away from their borders is just about not letting us see what their land looks like. Not a good way to show they want to build trust. Anyways, I don't see a huge problem just accepting it. We already mostly know what their land looks like (like our land and RB's land).
OTOH, I am impressed by their speedy response, especially after what 2metra said, and the faulty email account.
WPC said:
I'm not sure I like this, as it just seems to send a message of distrust and secrecy. There's no way our Warrior can threaten their cap, so keeping us 1 tile away from their borders is just about not letting us see what their land looks like. Not a good way to show they want to build trust. Anyways, I don't see a huge problem just accepting it. We already mostly know what their land looks like (like our land and RB's land).
OTOH, I am impressed by their speedy response, especially after what 2metra said, and the faulty email account.
YossarianLives
Deity
So to bring this back to the T1-50 thread, I think we should move northwest in a way that keep us away from their border (if this means one more turn next to their border so we don't waste exploring turns, I think they have to accept that). Maybe we can fork back to the northeast in time to meet the team north of WPC, and presumably south of us.
talonschild
Drive-By NESer
That would be ideal. Involves a fair bit of guesswork, but I think our math is good enough to hit at least a rapidly expanding team.
The problem with generally heading northwest is that it requires a significant amount of back tracking. We know there's at least one tile of water (probably a small ocean) and a mountain in the way. And just south of it is open terrain. I'd feel better guessing at a generally north easterly direction, so that we at least are exploring new land, and have a chance of finding good defensive bonuses without 3 turns in the wrong direction. Do we have any way to rapidly communicate with WPC to request guidance around their land, because of their requirements?
Alternatively we could head southeast into the jungle to take advantage of the defensive bonus, and could emerge northwards again when we believe we're near the next team to the east. (our NE neighbor)
Alternatively we could head southeast into the jungle to take advantage of the defensive bonus, and could emerge northwards again when we believe we're near the next team to the east. (our NE neighbor)
2metraninja
Defender of Nabaxica
I hope yes. Will write them in about an hour.
This was my initial idea too.
YossarianLives
Deity
Sorry for the confusion, I meant head in a northeast direction, then cut back northwest once we've cleared their borders.
Southeast->Northeast sounds good, too.
Southeast->Northeast sounds good, too.
YossarianLives
Deity
I think grant's suggestions for Padma and Plotinus sound good. I'm excited to start uncovering more land to our East. For Thunderfall, 6 or 3 are probably our only options to get away from WPC borders without back-tracking. It's hard to tell which is better without a picture, so I trust grant's judgement on this one.
As for the rest of the turn, I say let's go ahead and keep Terasvin on Stonehenge. If we change our mind in the next few days, we can switch that to something else with minimal losses, but if we decide to continue with the SH plan, then we need to get it started now. I think the best way forward is going to be a combo of 2metra's and bcool's plans.
Is there anything else we need to decide before we can finish playing T47?
As for the rest of the turn, I say let's go ahead and keep Terasvin on Stonehenge. If we change our mind in the next few days, we can switch that to something else with minimal losses, but if we decide to continue with the SH plan, then we need to get it started now. I think the best way forward is going to be a combo of 2metra's and bcool's plans.
Is there anything else we need to decide before we can finish playing T47?
2metraninja
Defender of Nabaxica
I dont think so, but will go to sleep and try to play our turn in 6-7 hours from now according to any new opinions.
If I am not played the turn in 6 and a half hours from now on, I would ask some of the other turnplayers to log in and play our turn according to the last MM plan - SH in Teras, settler in Indira, teching Hunting.
Just played out the turn. Moved Thunderfall based on WPC's response. It doesn't look like they've lead us astray, I see at least two turns of defensible terrain in this direction. We may need to re-evaluate our exploration plans based on their description of their territory. I don't believe in the 3x3 grid theory any more, heading generally east would be my best bet for how to meet another civ. I'm wondering if we might be arranged in separate continents, a balanced map that isn't a 3x3 grid is hard to imagine unless civs are in groups of 3.
I switched over to Polytheism, but have otherwise left things unchanged.
Below are the beginning of turn demos:
I switched over to Polytheism, but have otherwise left things unchanged.
Below are the beginning of turn demos:
Spoiler :
Oh, also an important note. That barbarian we spotted near Terasvin 2 turns ago is back. He's now 4,4,1 from Terasvin, meaning he can threaten the shared PH mine next turn. I'd suggest moving AlanH (the new warrior) 4 into the forest this turn so that he's flexibly positioned to deal with that, defend the city, or hopefully defeat the barbarian defensively with forest and river crossing bonuses.
YossarianLives
Deity
That sucks about the Barb warrior. We can't afford to risk our own warrior, or to lose our mine. I like the idea of trying to bait him with our warrior in the forest you suggested, grant. Bowsling, do you know what the chances are of the barb going for our warrior vs. our mine?
Thunderfall 3-9 makes sense to get on that forested hill. Padma 9-9 to get to the desert hill.
The last 3 micro plans call for our next city go on the tile labeled "or Gold city?", and I definitely think it needs to go there.
Thunderfall 3-9 makes sense to get on that forested hill. Padma 9-9 to get to the desert hill.
The last 3 micro plans call for our next city go on the tile labeled "or Gold city?", and I definitely think it needs to go there.
talonschild
Drive-By NESer
Yes, there has seemed best. Incidentally, by the number of 3rd cities Skullduggery says are out there, it feels like we're slipping behind. When's the fourth settler scheduled for?
2metraninja
Defender of Nabaxica
I still believe that 3 good placed and working strong improved tiles cities can well outperform 4 "just-settled-to-be-there" cities.
To directly answer the question, we can have our fourth city planted just 2 or 3 turns after our third settler is out by whipping the capitol, but what good this makes us? We wont have improved tiles to work with this plumped fourth city.
Also, have in mind that our start is slow. SPI and FIN are not traits to shine before middle-late game.
bcool
Deity
Well if we had settled on the bananas it would have been a faster start 
Caledorn
Emperor
Well if we had settled on the bananas it would have been a faster start
Rub it in. You're allowed
Would you like some salt as well? 
Note the response from RB btw. If they're having forum problems they are also having issues discussing things. They have also asked us to please let WPC know where they are, so we actually have their blessing to tell WPC about their gold city now. Convenient for us
YossarianLives
Deity
Re: city 4, we can build the settler out of Indira after our next worker. The first chop that doesn't finish in time to go into SH can go into the settler, along with one more chop to get it out in 5 turns (T60). Alternatively, we could scrap SH after Tera grows to size 3, put the cps into a settler that would complete on T55
talonschild
Drive-By NESer
I get that Fin/Spi will be slow. But can you really tell me that Fin/Org and Fin/Phi are any quicker? And they didn't even settle on their banana equivalent.
CivFr: CreFin 3 cities
CP: FinOrg 3 cities
RB: ExpFin 3 cities
UCiv: ExpOrg 3 cities
Germans: ExpSpi 3 cities
WPC: AggFin 2 cities
Spanish Poly: AggCha 2 cities
Poly: FinPhi 3 cities
Us: FinSpi 2 cities
CivFr: CreFin 3 cities
CP: FinOrg 3 cities
RB: ExpFin 3 cities
UCiv: ExpOrg 3 cities
Germans: ExpSpi 3 cities
WPC: AggFin 2 cities
Spanish Poly: AggCha 2 cities
Poly: FinPhi 3 cities
Us: FinSpi 2 cities
2metraninja
Defender of Nabaxica
From my experience, the criteria that most matters is food and GNP. Do you make it with 1, 2,3 or more cities is not that important. We went for fast cottages, which will repay us somewhere in the road.
I'm going to play the turn soon. But I had another thought about the barbarian warrior near Terasvin that I wanted to bounce off the team.
As our worker micro stands right now, Nabaxo would be chopping the forest I suggested sending AlanH to on the turn that the barbarian would attack. The chance of losing a battle on a forest, behind a river, and with a turn of fortification seems small, but I could also shift around the order Nabaxo is chopping forests so that he's not in the line of fire, if we're successful in baiting the barbarian to attack. He can move between forests and chop in a single turn because fast workers are awesome. So I can have him put a turn of work into the forest AlanH would be defending this turn. That way he can return to the safe forest 8 from Terasvin next turn when the barbarian might attack.
As our worker micro stands right now, Nabaxo would be chopping the forest I suggested sending AlanH to on the turn that the barbarian would attack. The chance of losing a battle on a forest, behind a river, and with a turn of fortification seems small, but I could also shift around the order Nabaxo is chopping forests so that he's not in the line of fire, if we're successful in baiting the barbarian to attack. He can move between forests and chop in a single turn because fast workers are awesome. So I can have him put a turn of work into the forest AlanH would be defending this turn. That way he can return to the safe forest 8 from Terasvin next turn when the barbarian might attack.
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