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Turnset 5 Diplomatic and Espionage discussion

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Demo Game IV: Gameplay' started by blastoidstalker, Apr 22, 2008.

  1. blastoidstalker

    blastoidstalker The Geographer

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    This is a thread to discuss diplomatic and espionage issues for the next turnset.

    I hope to put up some pertinant screenshots later.


    Our current state of Affairs.

    • We have contact with two civs and know that a third exists apprears to be seperated by 1 square of ocean. The third appears to be Incan, but I may be wrong on the color.
    • We have and even modifier with each civ we are in contact with.
    • We have open borders with each civ we are in contact with
    • We have trade network connected with Lincoln. He has crabs available for trade. This means Lincoln has Sailing
    • The two other civs do not have open borders with each other, this suggests that neither has writting.
    • Lincoln is in slavery, Hatrty is not. This tells us Lincoln has bronze working while Hatty likely does not.
    • The two other civs are pleased with each other at a 0 relations
    • The two other civs met each other a few turns before the start of the last turn session.
    • It appears that neither of the two civs that we are in contact with are in contact with any other civs (from espionage point distibution)

    In terms of espionage
    current espionage expenditures are (given in point against)

    Us- Lincoln
    232-90

    Us - Hatty
    216 -114

    Haty - Lincoln
    68-65


    We are close to getting Lincolns graphs but still a good way away from viewing Hatty's tech

    Points to discuss

    Espionage point distribution

    Two best options I see
    3 on Lincoln and 1 on Hatty - goal of this is to get Lincolns graphs up and keep Hatty's present.

    4 on Hatty and 0 Lincoln - goal is go gain knbowledge of hattys research and maybe steal a tech.



    Resource trading:

    I feel that once we have 2 rice up and running we should trade one for Lincoln's crabs. This helps with health, but more importantly should improve our relations with him.


    Tech trading:

    I think we can keep in the technology thread and discuss there.
     

    Attached Files:

  2. Provolution

    Provolution Sage of Quatronia

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    Haven't we got a fish in Arete?
     
  3. blastoidstalker

    blastoidstalker The Geographer

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    you caught my mistake. We have fish, he has crabs. Look at the resource screen

    I guess he put workboats both an the crabs in his fat cross and the one just north of his fat cross. This may suggest that he put a second city in the dircection of this second crab, but we can not be sure.
     
  4. Seymoo

    Seymoo The Sexmaster General

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    A good concise summary of the diplomatic situation blastoid. I would go for the lincoln espionage strategy, I do not see hatty lasting long enough for the second strategy to be viable
     
  5. Provolution

    Provolution Sage of Quatronia

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    We got crabs soon as well, if we build NE of Arete, where there are two crabs.
     
  6. blastoidstalker

    blastoidstalker The Geographer

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    those are clams, not crabs
    I hope you are not a member of surf and turf:)
     
  7. DaveShack

    DaveShack Inventor Retired Moderator

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    Are AI espionage points increased on this level? That's the only reason I can think that they would both have way more total points than we do this early in the game.

    Should we consider going to 10%? I don't really know if it's worth the trouble to keep up this early.

    Is a spy worth the hammers, after alphabet?
     
  8. blastoidstalker

    blastoidstalker The Geographer

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    My guess is that the AI is running 10% espionage. This would give them a few extra per turn 2-3 which is what the numbers suggest. This is good for us as the computer does not use these points wisely, usualy they destroy an improvment which you just need to rebuild.

    I do not think we should invest in espionage, unless you really focus you game on it, it is usualy better to keep that commerece going into research. Later in the game when you can take cause revolts, it can be really usefull for a marine invasion.

    I think i spy is only worth it if Lincoln decides not to trade with us and we have no other trade options. even then, it is a much less certain way of doing things. They do make excellent scouts of hostile lands though.
     
  9. Lord Civius

    Lord Civius Emperor

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    Another viable option would be 4 lincoln and 0 hatty. Now that we are pretty sure Hatty doesn't have copper a Horse Archer raid seems sensible. If we plan on taking her out early then wasting points on her simply to keep her graph up seems mute.IMHO.
     
  10. NZL

    NZL Proudly Flemish

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    I agree with Linc 4, Hatty 0 for the exact same reasons as Lord Civius
     
  11. Provolution

    Provolution Sage of Quatronia

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    I back Linc 4- Hatty 0, for the same reasons as NZL and L Civius.
     
  12. AluminumKnight

    AluminumKnight Conquistador

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    Once we can get some Horse Archers in place to watch her, I'm in favor of 4 Lincoln 0 Hatty. We should keep her graph up for awhile just to keep an eye on her. Or could we change right away and still keep her graph long enough?
     
  13. Provolution

    Provolution Sage of Quatronia

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    I think we could shift 4-0 as soon as HA hits Madrid and their southern copper.
     
  14. blastoidstalker

    blastoidstalker The Geographer

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    I would guess we have about 10 more turns of seeing her graph. I think if we go 3-1 we will be able to keep it. Once we find it unnecessary we could switch to 4-0
     
  15. Provolution

    Provolution Sage of Quatronia

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    Ok, I then suggest we keep it 3-1 for about 15 turns more, then make it 4-0, since we may need the intel during the 2-3 turns of trade negotiations right after Alphabet. (techs).

    About the Third Civ being Inca. I think they may be that, due to Judaism being founded that early, knowing Inca start with Mysticism and follow that tech route, expanding culture into the water, but I may be wrong. I still think we need sailing pretty quick.
     
  16. DaveShack

    DaveShack Inventor Retired Moderator

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    On the brown borders, I wonder if their borders will pop again? If they do, I think all we need is a unit on the shore to make contact.

    What civs have brown and yellow for their color? I think I usually see Inca with a shade of yellow. This could mean the brown is Mongols, or that another yellow civ is in the game.
     
  17. Provolution

    Provolution Sage of Quatronia

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    Yeah, hard to tell. I just thought the originator of Judaism could be on the other side of the water, culture crawling across water and so on.
     
  18. AluminumKnight

    AluminumKnight Conquistador

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    My guess would be Mali, Mongols, or Inca off the top of my head. There's gotta be more brownish-border civs. Maybe I'll slog through some screenshots later and compare.
     
  19. Provolution

    Provolution Sage of Quatronia

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    Do anyone feel for polling any of this? It seems its broad consensus to me.
     
  20. DaveShack

    DaveShack Inventor Retired Moderator

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    Any thoughts on what we would do if there were requests or demands?
     

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