Two Thousand Years Old Hope? Modern Jewish Identity and Historical Continuation

IceBlaZe

Atheist Proselytizer
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This is a part from the book "Israel and the family of nations".
My translation (original in Hebrew).



As we saw, in the UN 1947 Assembly discussions the representatives of Arab states and Arab Palestinians repeatedly claimed that there is no real continuing connection between Jews - Bnei Israel - the ancient, of the land of Judah, to the Modern Jews that sought to establish in this land their natinoal home in the 20th century.
In this manner they tried to establish their claim that Modern Jews are nothing but a religious denomination, whos faithful include people from all sorts of ethnic descents.
Only few Modern Jews, they claim, can be considered the descendants of ancient sons of Israel; In that context they raised the theory about the Khazari provenance of European Jews.
These claims, dubious as for themselves, express, to which extent they can be taken seriously, a racist simplistic perception of Nationality. It is eminent that a communal ethnic descent is not a necessary component of a national identity. To the opposite, a tradition regarding a common descent, a communal myth relating to the ancient past - these are important components of many national cultures.
Even the modern French nationality, which is considered an unmistakable example of civil nationality and not an ethnical one, is not free of that element. Generations of students educated in the French republic upon the expression "Our Gaelic Fathers" - an expression which, in a biological point of view, is untrue for many o them;
Nevertheless this image became part of the French national identity. In those kind of traditions there is, usually, only a grain of Historical truth, although the size of this grain is different from case to case, and this question has no special importance.
The attempt to deny the palpability of modern Jewish nationality under biological and "anthropological" rationales, as the representative of Uruguay phrased it in his General Assembly speech, is a false attempt.
The authors of the UNSCOP report do not refer to these claims at all, just like they do not bother to invent any "scientific" proof whatsoever that indicate the existence of the Jewish People.
 
What is your definition of Jew.

All definition that i have found so far are religion related and talk about very old bible tale.

Some religious group were living under the roman empire, are they a Roman religious sect ?

So which were their country if they had one, and when ? Why do they loose it ? Why do they quit ?

I know th answer, i want yours.
 
What is your definition of Jew.

"My" definition is immaterial, just like yours is, to the topic.

Some religious group were living under the roman empire, are they a Roman religious sect ?

"Beni Israel", the Jewish People, existed as a communal group before the Roman empire controlled the land, so saying they are a religious sector of rome is foolish. They were not a religious group, and they did not come from Rome.

So which were their country if they had one, and when ?

They had Judah, and it was destroyed by the Romans.

Why do they loose it ? Why do they quit ?

No one quit, it was destroyed.
 
the answer is simple- Judaism is a religion, nothing more, but, that religion, and its adherents still have a cliam to the land of Palestine, as it is the birth place of that religion, and its ancestrial homeland- no geneological link is required
 
Originally posted by Xen
the answer is simple- Judaism is a religion, nothing more, but, that religion, and its adherents still have a cliam to the land of Palestine, as it is the birth place of that religion, and its ancestrial homeland- no geneological link is required

But if it's nothing more than a religioun how do you explain the fact that most jews in Israel aren't religious? Or that most American jews aren't religious, yet they consider themselves jewish?
 
Originally posted by Xen
the answer is simple- Judaism is a religion, nothing more, but, that religion, and its adherents still have a cliam to the land of Palestine, as it is the birth place of that religion, and its ancestrial homeland- no geneological link is required

The answer is simple if you ignore all facts, literature and reports on the issue, like you did.
Unless you can explain your answer, write/copy an article, a chapter from a book, or anything of that sort - your post is far from being an answer, it is merely an unbased opinion.
 
no articles here, it is an opinion from a former adhernt, and person born into the Hebrew faith (note that I am now a Roman Polytheist)
 
Originally posted by IceBlaZe


"My" definition is immaterial, just like yours is, to the topic.


They had Judah, and it was destroyed by the Romans.


1.- :lol: you dont want to fall in quicksand. From your post.

In this manner they tried to establish their claim that Modern Jews are nothing but a religious denomination, whos faithful include people from all sorts of ethnic descents.


2.- When it was destroyed ?
 
Originally posted by G-Man


But if it's nothing more than a religioun how do you explain the fact that most jews in Israel aren't religious? Or that most American jews aren't religious, yet they consider themselves jewish?

They are heretic jew:lol: and should be excomunated from jew community.
 
the state of Judea was conqoured by the Romans, but after 3 rebellions, all of which could have been avoided by a better Roman diplomacy in the province (it was conciderd a backwater, and a career dead-end mind you) people of the Jewish faith were exiled from the city of jerusalem for quite a while (though, interestinglly enough, Rome is the largest, and oldest continuos center of Judaism out side of the middle east)
 
Point 1 makes no sense.
Point 2: I think about 70AD.
 
Originally posted by Tassadar


They are heretic jew:lol: and should be excomunated from jew community.

You don't know what you are talking about and that's pretty pathetic.
 
Originally posted by Tassadar


They are heretic jew:lol: and should be excomunated from jew community.

IIRC, Judaism is enlightend more then enough to not have any sort of excomunication
 
Originally posted by Xen
people of the Jewish faith were exiled from the city of jerusalem for quite a while

So it was related to faith , not nationality. And if my definition of faith is right, it is related to religion ? right ?
 
You are taking someone who shares your OPINION and use his OPINION to base your OPINION.
Your posts make you look much younger than what your profile stated, which is sad.
 
faith is religion, but what point are you trying to make?
 
Originally posted by IceBlaZe
You are taking someone who shares your OPINION and use his OPINION to base your OPINION.
Your posts make you look much younger than what your profile states, which is sad.

me? I odnt think i share his opinio at all, honestlly, hes rubbing off as anti semetic smacktard, at least he is seeming that way to me in this thread
 
Originally posted by Xen


IIRC, Judaism is enlightend more then enough to not have any sort of excomunication

Oh i mix it up with the catholic, so non-religious jew are like me, a none practisising catholic. they dont excominicate no more, as they will have no more member:lol:
 
Tassadar and you have the same opinion. Judaism is only a religion.
 
Originally posted by Tassadar


Oh i mix it up with the catholic, so non-religious jew are like me, a none practisising catholic. they dont excominicate no more, as they will have no more member:lol:

dont be a jackass, excomunication is somthing unique to the later monotheistic religions, as for non-religious jews? the ENTIRE religion is enlightend enough not to do such a thing, as its rather stupid, and would directlly contradict the religion (which christian, and islamic religions, and off braches of those religons do all the time, that is to say, contradict themselves)
 
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