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Two years later, I FINALLY touched this again... Help plz.

Discussion in 'Civ3 - Strategy & Tips' started by Illusion13, Dec 8, 2007.

  1. Illusion13

    Illusion13 Chieftain

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  2. vmxa

    vmxa Chieftain

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    Wow did not expect to hear anything on this again. What is it that you are concerned with?
     
  3. Illusion13

    Illusion13 Chieftain

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    XD I've always wanted to finish this or something...

    I emptied out my northern cities that were taken previously from carthage cause it had something like 10 cavs that I could use... And now one has flipped back to Carthage >=(

    And all my weak sides are getting hit now cause of Greece... Stupid Greece... >.< Yeah, need help about Greece...
     
  4. vmxa

    vmxa Chieftain

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    Illusion13, this is a large empire, so I will not be able to give it good look until Thursday as I have that day off. Since it has been so long, I suppose there is no real rush.

    Are you playing with and special rules? IOW are you allowed to make peace or declare war? I am not a big fan of Communism, it has a place, but it is a rare one.

    I wold look strongly at being in Republic, if I am allowed to make peace. Dropping lots of those obsolete units, would bring you support cost down and you would have more research.

    What type of win are you shooting for, I see all are available.

    I am a big fan of eliminating any civ that is on the ropes. I would not give peace with them being down to 3 or 4 towns, it lights out.

    One of the problems with governments that have MP's, is you use it as a crutch and keep units in towns to keep pop happy.

    Now those units cannot defend the borders or attack your enemies. I would not have gone to Communism in the first place. You probably switched twice or worse stay in despotism all this time.

    Those are critical errors for a non religious civ. Go to Republic and stay there or Monarchy, if war is the path.

    Now you have to get those troops where they can do some good. Try to get the celts to join the fight. I have not check to see if you have tech to offer or not.
     
  5. Illusion13

    Illusion13 Chieftain

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    Hm... I did switch like twice since Communism is supposed to be a good warring Gov O.o

    I think I am allowed to make peace O.o I mean, its not fascism...

    I think I let Carthage live cause I was under Republic and I just couldnt keep up with the war unhapppiness...

    Yeah its been so long its no rush, I cant play much until Friday at least anyways because I have final exams....

    well I am not aiming for much anything as I am just aiming to take more land right now... As in I want to get some scores..

    Someone (was it you?) suggested playing a smaller map... The thing is, I would have to give up quite a bit of scoring in those maps >.>

    Either way, since I am in war now I dont think it'll be good to switch gov again O.o Besides, they sorta can keep themselves happy cause I have all 8 Luxuries... If that help...

    Since I am fighting this war now I cannot afford to allocate units to killing Carthage :(
     
  6. vmxa

    vmxa Chieftain

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    By making peace, I meant do ou have any self impossed rules on it, looks like not. Communism is fine for war, as long as you have the rightsized empire.

    I would not switch to it if I was not committed to never making peace. The problem with it is if you are too small, it is not going to help with corruption much and if you are too large, it will corrupt cities that are doing fine.

    This is because it spread the cooruption all around and I do not want to add to corruption in the core and I do not care about it in the other places, just going to farm there anyway.

    I always suggest mastering standard size maps first as large and huge hide problem. They give too much help to the human. The score does not matter, I do not even pay attention to it.

    You increase your score by winning faster and large map do not aid in that. You gain by having more land and pop, but it is a trade off. Win by domination on a std map and you will get a decent score.

    Yes it is not the time to finish off Carthage, but at the time a couple more turns would have been worth it.
     
  7. Illusion13

    Illusion13 Chieftain

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    hm... I just realized I need an embassy to sign MAs... Silly me... Omg noob mistake >=(

    Where exactly are the Celts? O.o

    I have decided to go back to my 1555 save and try to do it again... I will play one turn before going into war... I think that if I get both Germany and Hitties into the war then I dont have to worry about Greece coming in from the bottom and attacking me. Will post updated save someday...
     
  8. vmxa

    vmxa Chieftain

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    I did not check the civ, I went by the color, so it may not be the Celts. The ones just above Smoke.
     
  9. Illusion13

    Illusion13 Chieftain

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    Smoke has an insane high number of Knights up where Scandanavia used to be... Something like 30-40 of them... I cant fight those off without using my main forces which I need them to go hit hit and hit... >.<

    Seems like my plan to sneak 20 Cavs behind to raze Chitzen Itza isnt that easy after all >=(
     
  10. Illusion13

    Illusion13 Chieftain

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    hm... I may go from 1555 again since some of the changes you suggested seem to be very very good.

    But problem persists that there are about 40 Knights ready to claim my ass from where Scandinavia used to be... Or was it Arabia... I dont even remember where >.> But its where Maya has a few cities...

    I cant afford to take out all those Knights with my main force but what else can I do? O.o I can move those 5 Ghalleons full of Cavs to there instead then... Cause it seems I am not going to be able to take Chitzen Itza with only 20 Cavs...
     
  11. vmxa

    vmxa Chieftain

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    I hope to load this up as early as tomorrow, IF I can get off early.
     
  12. Illusion13

    Illusion13 Chieftain

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    I'll upload new game then... but I might redo everything from the beginning

    Dont expect any playing until Friday so take your time... I have final exams to deal with now T_T
     
  13. vmxa

    vmxa Chieftain

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    Sounds good. Exams are more important.
     
  14. vmxa

    vmxa Chieftain

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    Pre: (1555AD save)
    Name and fill armies to 4 units.
    Locate MA, note it should not be here as this is not a very high shield city and will not build armies very quick.
    Switch Farund to LB to get something out of it before gifting or abandoning. Prefer to gift to get units back with no hassles.
    Switch builds to get things of value, such as workers. Need a rail system asap.

    In that vain, I would have planned a bit prior to Steam. I would have migrated most of my workers towards the core to start rails. If it was too long of a trip, then gather them some place to focus them on making rails. From the center to the borders, is my normal mode.

    Wars and such can alter that plan at times. The most important thing to have in a large map, is to get a rail system to the front. Now you can bring those cats/trebs/cannons to bear in battles and hurt any invaders on the cheap.

    Right now they are spread out and will not be able to be used to any great effect. 65 workers is no where near enough for over 100 towns on so much land, much of it not even with roads.

    I would want more like 200 or more and then I could make some progress. Now I have not gotten my bearings on the research status, but I would have gone for RP ahead even the race to ToE.

    Infantry and arties will be game breakers and savers here and the 50% faster workers, turns 200 into 300 or 65 in about 100.

    You do not have to be first to SciMeth to get the ToE. Just get a prebuild going and get the tech in time to switch. At this level, that should be doable.

    Pulling together all the far flung workers and going through all the builds will take hours.

    This is what makes helping players with huge maps a hard job.

    Update, ok I have corralled all the workers. I mean they have been allowed to finish current task or been stop and given better jobs.

    Switch a cav to a settler to get the land open by Leptis under the border. You really cannot play on such a large map and not have some settlers on hand to fill openings that come up.

    Next job will be to fill the 5th army and then grab all the units and get them where they can be of use. I did off load the galleon. I stopped all galleon builds and did switch one to a frigate, probably a bad idea. I will use galleons in hand to rush something.

    No need for ships at this point you have not take over the land on this mass yet. The two islands I see will never come into play, ignore them.

    The whole point of the last time I went through all the towns with a change log was to point out the concepts. You really do not want to get to the Industrial age with so much land not improved.

    If you had the proper number of workers and used them well, most of the land should have roads, all the core towns would have irrigation or mines on all worked tiles.

    This is the way to be strong and get the production and research to stomp the AI. Of course I wold not have research communism and not switch to it.

    This would have given you at least two more techs and more structure/units from the shields and gold lost switching, not to mention the better income from being a republic.

    As I have mentioned before you just do not want to make more than one switch, unless religious. This mean no commie. The games that it would be useful are too few, just forget it.

    The poor aspect of going commie it it comes in the IA, where you should be doing quite well and having a large production base. That will be lost for many turns of anarchy.
     
  15. Illusion13

    Illusion13 Chieftain

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    x.x I see that going commie could've been a bad choice... But I dont have any prior saves... T_T

    The biggest problem for me I guess would've been the sudden leap from Warlord to Monarch... Also I was never too much of a warmonger and dont really know how to fight wars well...

    That said, its still strange how I managed to kill off almost 3 civs before coming to this standstill... Also, I think Inca was quite a bad choice of Civ since there's basically no UU to exploit..... And my golden age came WAY too early...

    Either way, would you go back to 1555 and not fight the war until network of rails are made? And also... I thought 60-70 worker was more than enough >.> No?

    Main concerns:

    What to do with the Cavs already shipped out?
    What to do about the small settle of Maya near my North-West that have WAY too many knights?
    Instead of warring Maya, maybe... Wipe out brown first?

    And still no playing as I have exams...
     
  16. vmxa

    vmxa Chieftain

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    Well these are the issues I will be looking at tonight and tomorrow. Since you are in Commie, so big deal I would just stay there.

    You want about 1.5 workers per town, till Steam. There it is good to have 2 or more workers per town. Once you have the key areas railroaded, you can merge some workers into cities to lower the support cost, IF need it.

    I expect I will try to avoid a war with any, but the weakess civs, until I can at least get the workers out of the way and move some units to more strategic locations.

    This may not be possible, but we shall see.

    I have only noticed the one galleon load so far, will be looking closer now. I see no reason to ship uints off or to even have ships on a map like this one. Ok, a few fog busters early, but I would disband them likely after they did the job.

    Now understand, all I say is only one mans opinion. Note gospel.
     
  17. Illusion13

    Illusion13 Chieftain

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    lol yes... But I am one noob >.>

    There are 5 Galleons near Chitzen Itza loaded with Cavs... I had the weird ambition to strike Chitzen Itza and raze it >.>
     
  18. vmxa

    vmxa Chieftain

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    I located all the ships and have sent them back. You probably had no chance to strike the capitol with those units, unless you had sent an army to cover them.

    They would have attack the stack relentlessly. The mountains that I mentioned have been settled by Greece. This is why I do not have open spaces in my land.

    Now the Greeks have sent out cavs and I do not know if that is an attack or they just want to see the land. So I had to threathen them and hope they with draw.

    I want to have at least 10 turns with no wars, if I can, while troops move into positions and I get some rails up to all me to defend.

    Smoke has started a number of units moving as well, but I think they are just going home. I have left army number 5 empty for now as I am not sure if I want attackers or defenders in it.

    If I can draw attackers to one town, I want infantry in the army to kill lots of attacking cavs. Not sure if I can get to that point before things explode.

    I am a huge believer in consolidating my holdings. That is to say, I will always try to expand in a manner that lets me defend my land. This means roads and culture borders. That and preparing for Steam.

    Ironically it also means few defensive units for most of the game, unless it is an AW game. The defenders I will have will not be in the core, but will be on the borders, where they can be used.

    Anyway after I get back from the docs I shall sally forth and see what can be done. The good news is that the AI will not be able to do much more than bloody your nose, before you can gain the upper hand.

    I just wish the MA was in the strongest city so it could have made some armies. I doubt any will be build for the city it is in now.
     
  19. Optional

    Optional Chieftain

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    I had a wee look as well, mainly at the 1555 save (or was it 1550?). At the 1570 save you were at war, I was a bit disappointed to see that, as you didn't seem quite ready for that, at least not with Smoke.

    What I noticed in the 1555 save was that you had your lux slider at 30%. I was able to put it back to 10% without having to make any adjustments to cities. You can even turn it to zero% without a city going into disorder if you turn a citizen into a specialist in Alesia and Burdigala (those were big cities that didn't have a marketplace yet).
    With the lux slider at 30% you were making 147 gold per turn.
    With the lux slider at 0% you would be making 444 gold per turn...big difference. You can use that money to upgrade units - I still saw some spear- and swordsmen around; it's better to upgrade or disband - or you can use it for sience.
    And yes, it was visible on that 1555 save - on the foreign advisor screen - that Smoke had an MPP (and also ROP) with Greece. That's why you couldn't get Greece in on your war against Smoke. It's advisable, definitely at this stage of the game, to check your foreign advisor screen regularly, so that you know who's friends with whom, and you don't get nasty surprises, like only finding out about an MPP after already having attacked someone.

    VMXA already gave very good advice. This is a big map, and it's the industrial age - it's not so easy for an outsider to get a comprehensive grasp of all the ins and outs there. Even when it's my own game I find the industrial age overwhelming. I wouldn't have had the patience to look at every town, like VMXA did, so hats off for that.
     
  20. Illusion13

    Illusion13 Chieftain

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    =O Lux isnt needed at 30%? =O

    I was actually quite surprised at what I was able to do already as I've been saying... Its just like, now I am at the end of my abilities to play this game or something...

    Well VXMA it seems like you have been playing a bit... Post the save when you're done making the changes so I can play that file instead =)

    Still exams... One more T_T
     

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