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UHV Turkey

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Rhye's and Fall of Civilization' started by SadoMacho, Jan 29, 2007.

  1. SadoMacho

    SadoMacho spanker of civilizations

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  2. Talkie_Toaster

    Talkie_Toaster I toast, therefore I am

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    I agree =]
     
  3. Rhye

    Rhye 's and Fall creator

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    Yes, Rome could go. Replaced by who? Egypt, Babylonia or Arabia? (Probably Babylonia is better)
    As for Germany, I'm not sure. They sieged Vienna, they could have taken it.
     
  4. kairob

    kairob Biohazard

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    How about "control the east med", so they would need all the coastline meaning Greece, northern Egypt and that bit west of Babylonia?

    Also is the a chance to change the leader from Mehmed II to either Suleiman or Osman, as Suleiman was IMHO a better leader and represented the height of their power and Osman is the one who took the Turkic people and made them capable of successfully running a large empire, and after who the most famous and influential dynasties of the Turks (the Ottomans) were named?

    P.s. sprry for the threadjacking and if its a "no" I wont argue as its not my thread... sorry again
     
  5. LuKo

    LuKo The Royal Guard

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    But they didn't win in Battle of Vienna (because of Poland ;P ):D As far as I know they were enemy of Russia...
     
  6. garrinchaya

    garrinchaya Chieftain

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    They were enemy of Russia, as people from Moscow and Kiev did want to have an access to a hot sea. They had indeed the control of the baltic sea (after several wars lead against Sweden), but the med and an access to Arabian, Venician and Spaniard was far much better for the commerce.
    Turkey didn't want to lose its monopoly and used all its weight to keep Russia in the black sea.

    If we had a Minor Unique Victories System, we could had the goal to prevent any Russian boat to go trough Istambul. As the caravel doesn't need any open borders agreement to go across your territory, that could give us some naval battles.

    But we have no Minor Unique Victories, let's go then with something like control Greece, Egyptia, Germany and maybe Russia, as they were the bittest enemy at the Renaissance's time.
     
  7. SadoMacho

    SadoMacho spanker of civilizations

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    I would go with
    "control the Balkan and the middle east."
    the empire they had in 1520.

    I would leave Germany out, maybe make the Turks want to control the Vienna erea, but not in the UHV.
     
  8. SkippyT

    SkippyT Who?

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    Ditto :crazyeye: :crazyeye:
     
  9. McA123

    McA123 Prince

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    Caravels can't cross through cities without open borders.
     
  10. garrinchaya

    garrinchaya Chieftain

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    True, McA123, there is no point anymore.
     
  11. Mercenary82

    Mercenary82 King

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    I think controling Carthage, Greece, and Babylon, and Arabia would be pretty accurate.
     
  12. Tom Veil

    Tom Veil Warlord

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    Agreed. I would, however, like to keep one of the UHVs as requiring them to hold the square on which Vienna sits. The third UHV is always about the real-life civ's unfulfilled ambition, and for the Ottomans that most definitely was to capture Vienna and thereby become the greatest power in Central Europe.
     
  13. kairob

    kairob Biohazard

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    Yeah, capturing Vienna sounds like a good one, but which ones would this replace? I am guessing the Carthage, Greece, Babylon and Arabia one will replace Rome, Greece and Germany...
     
  14. knigh+

    knigh+ .

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    I think Mehmed II is the best choice, with Suleyman a very close second.
    actually...
    My top five Ottoman sultans would be:
    1- Mehmed (II) the Conqueror
    2- Suleyman the Lawmaker
    3- Beyazid (I) the Thunderbolt
    4- Osman (I) Gazi Khan
    5- Murad II

    and here is my favorite instance of Mehmed II

    "If you are the sultan, you have to lead your country in this unfortunate situation. Please, come in front of your army. If I am the sultan, I remind you to obey my commands and I command: Come in front of your army."

    12 year-old Mehmed II, to his retired father, upon recieving word that enemies gathered in a new crusade and are marching towards his territory.

    -----------

    Regarding the UHV,

    Carthage had nothing to do with Ottomans except being controlled by them for some while. It was taken by the navy to connect Algeria to the empire. (Algeria was conquered much earlier by the legendary privateer Barbarossa, who then offered it to the empire with the condition that he was named the grand admiral of all Ottoman navy, to which the sultan agreed)

    I think the UHV should be:
    - control Peninsulas of Balkan and Anatolia (obviously)
    - control Holy cities (Mecca, Medina, Jerusalem)
    - have conquered Cairo at some point (transfer of the Caliphate)
    - control Crimea (for kinship to Crimean tatars, who were more turkic than mongolian in origin; as well as beating Russia)
    - control/destroy Vienna (and perhaps control Germany, as the main incentive of sieging Vienna was to make way for the conquest of Germany)
    - control Rome (especially if the leader is Mehmed; Rome was openly his goal, he proclaimed himself as the Eastern Roman Emperor upon the conquest of Constantinople, and he wanted to claim the Western Empire as well - making him the absolute emperor of everywhere that mattered to him. He even amphibiously conquered the "heel" of Italy, but he died before pursueing this dream. But this was uniquely Mehmed's goal.)
    - no European presence in India (They had significant naval struggle with Portugal for naval trade routes of India)
     
  15. Mercenary82

    Mercenary82 King

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    I meant by controlling Carthage, the broader Carthage territory as a whole (Tunisa, Tripoli, and Algeria).
     
  16. knigh+

    knigh+ .

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    and my comment is valid for both Tunisia, Algeria.
     
  17. SadoMacho

    SadoMacho spanker of civilizations

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    control Peninsulas of Balkan, Iraq, Israel
     
  18. kairob

    kairob Biohazard

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    Thier not peninsulas mate...
     
  19. Mercenary82

    Mercenary82 King

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    Well the Ottomans ruled in Tunisia, and Algeria, Libya on and off after the
    1500's, and the privateer Barbarossa himself was also a Turk. So controlling this area is historical for them.
     
  20. kairob

    kairob Biohazard

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    True, however their conquest of North africa was massivly helped by barbarossa...
     

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