UK politics - continuing into 2021

Status
Not open for further replies.
Given the total mess inflicted by the dual curse of Covid and Brexit, I could hardly blame anyone for fleeing Westminister's control if they can.
 
Anti HS2 protesters at Euston Square Gardens has set up a camp to obstruct development

Enforcement agents have moved in on a protest camp near Euston Station, where HS2 activists have spent months secretly digging a 100 ft tunnel in a bid to stop them being evicted. Reports differ on if it is called Calvin or Kelvin.
Since August, HS2 Rebellion members have been living in tree houses and tents at a camp nearby.
A HS2 spokeswoman said the protesters were "trespassing" on land owned by the company.
There is word that Swampy is back

I am not anti HS2. It is a very expensive project, but it totally the sort of thing we should be doing. Compared to the heathrow expansion or more roads putting in modern public transport has to be a good thing. It does sound like they are destroying Euston Square Gardens for a temporary taxi rank, which seems a bit pointless.

HS2 is a new high speed rail line proposed between london and the midlands / north. It is expected to cost over 50 billion, and could be much more.


Spoiler More pics :

HS2 protester Dr Larch Maxey said the tunnel was "warm and quiet"


One activist used to a rope to tie himself between trees at the camp


 
Last edited:
Given the total mess inflicted by the dual curse of Covid and Brexit, I could hardly blame anyone for fleeing Westminister's control if they can.

As the decision making on health, quarantine and lockdown measures is fully devolved to
Northern Ireland, Scotland and Wales; the handling of Covid there is hardly Westminster's fault.
 
Shame about England, eh?
 
I am not anti HS2. It is a very expensive project, but it totally the sort of thing we should be doing. Compared to the heathrow expansion or more roads putting in modern public transport has to be a good thing. It does sound like they are destroying Euston Square Gardens for a temporary taxi rank, which seems a bit pointless.
I go back-and-forth on HS2, but at the moment believe it is outright wasting money (costs are ballooning way past projections) and also won't actually benefit infrastructure outside of London much - especially in the first phase. Birmingham to London is well-covered - this money would be better-spent modernising our aging infrastructure outside of this existing well-travelled route.
 
Yeah, I'm not convinced by HS2. Investing in public transport is a good thing, but it doesn't seem to be the best way to be spending the money, particularly considering how much is being spent.
 
Apparently, e-commerce is wrecked. From 1st Jan, UK buyers have had to pay taxes and exorbitant fees (courtesy of shipping companies) on online purchases. Lots of whine from UK buyers and, inevitably, they get asked: "Did you vote for Brexit?"

Wonder how many of them did.
 
Apparently, e-commerce is wrecked. From 1st Jan, UK buyers have had to pay taxes and exorbitant fees (courtesy of shipping companies) on online purchases. Lots of whine from UK buyers and, inevitably, they get asked: "Did you vote for Brexit?"

Wonder how many of them did.
Yeah, for some reason the UK exchequer decided on the most awkward way of handling tax, that no other country uses. I cannot quite understand why, I do not see anyone being helped by this.
 
There are a lot of low lying railway lines that will need to be moved or raised as global
warming raises sea levels. The billions spent on HS2 would be better spent on that.

From 1st Jan, UK buyers have had to pay
taxes and exorbitant fees (courtesy of shipping companies) on online purchases.

That is nothing at all new. I had to pay fees and taxes when I imported a Civilisation Game from the USA.

Yeah, for some reason the UK exchequer decided on the most awkward way of handling tax, that no other country uses. I cannot quite understand why, I do not see anyone being helped by this.

UK has a trading deficit. If Chancellor makes it more expensive to import stuff, deficit declines.
 
UK has a trading deficit. If Chancellor makes it more expensive to import stuff, deficit declines.
That really depends on how (in) elastic demand for such ‘stuff’ is.
 
Protectionism is supposed to help domestic industries grow, but that usually also requires other policies to support the effort. What are the chances the Tories are gonna implement those? Who does deregulation help most?
 
Protectionism is supposed to help domestic industries grow, but that usually also requires other policies to support the effort. What are the chances the Tories are gonna implement those? Who does deregulation help most?

I think it is not as simple as: "more deregulation helps business" !
When leftish people start singing that tune without specifying and discriminating sectors and kinds of regulations, they in fact sing in the UK a Tory tune.
For example, with enough domestic trade protection higher labor protection drives higher labor productivity, enabling shorter working weeks, earlier retirement or more prosperity.
The worst thing that can happen is that a country stops investing enough in human skills and machinery because labor is cheaper anyway (from reduced labor protection and low wages).
 
Last edited:

yeah
Whereby we have in reality two main kinds of taxes
The one of the public state and the one from over-profitable companies or wealthy people.
Both having such a Laugher curve and competing with each other.
 
I think it is not as simple as: "more deregulation helps business" !
When leftish people start singing that tune without specifying and discriminating sectors and kinds of regulations, they in fact sing in the UK a Tory tune.
For example, with enough domestic trade protection higher labor protection drives higher labor productivity, enabling shorter working weeks, earlier retirement or more prosperity.
The worst thing that can happen is that a country stops investing enough in human skills and machinery because labor is cheaper anyway (from reduced labor protection and low wages).

Uh, no. That's not what I was driving at. Deregulation helps certain businesses most (hint: they're traditionally located at Bank), and likely not the industries you're supposed to help.

You can impose tariffs as a populist measure and also deregulate to help your cronies. That's the way the populist right is headed these days (harking back to the old fascist days?).
 
Uh, no. That's not what I was driving at. Deregulation helps certain business most (hint: they're traditionally located at Bank), and likely not the industries you're supposed to help.

You can impose tariffs as a populist measure and also deregulate to help your cronies. That's the way the populist right is headed these days (harking back to the old fascist days?).

yes
It is about what you, as government, regulate or deregulate.
With banks you get on top the perverse effect that when banks regulate too much lending money to SME and especially very small companies... they shift (wage) income from SME to surplus profit of big companies. IF you really want to prevent that as public state, you need to break that kartel by a people's bank for small businesses. In fact this happens with development aid to third world countries by the micro loans program.
Another perverse effect is of big companies regulating their purchase rules which in fact causes that big companies buy almost only from other big companies (unless it is about the lunches etc). The no maverick purchasing guy doctrine driven by risk management clerks of the beancounter departments.
Big companies are world champions in generating their company red tape and regulations when it suits their own objectives, all the time whining about red tape of governments, their prime competitor unless under control by lobby groups or other means.
 
Oh yeah, that's for stuff from the EU, for which UK buyers are used to enjoying good prices.

We got better prices buying from China and SE Asia despite the import tariffs and overheads.


That really depends on how (in) elastic demand for such ‘stuff’ is.

Very true.

Protectionism is supposed to help domestic industries grow, but that usually also requires other policies to support the effort.

Very true.

What are the chances the Tories are gonna implement those?

What was it Winston Churchill said about the Americans.
The Tories will implement them when they have exhausted the alternatives.

For example, with enough domestic trade protection higher labor protection drives higher
labor productivity, enabling shorter working weeks, earlier retirement or more prosperity.

To a certain extent, yes; but there is a problem when people expect all of the latter three benefits.

The worst thing that can happen is that a country stops investing enough in human skills and machinery
because labor is cheaper anyway (from reduced labor protection and low wages).

A large part of the UK economy opted out of such investment years ago, choosing instead
to employ Poles, Portuguese, Romanians, Bulgarians; and migrants from the third world.
 
A large part of the UK economy opted out of such investment years ago, choosing instead
to employ Poles, Portuguese, Romanians, Bulgarians; and migrants from the third world.

We did here in NL the same in the 60ies because business decreased its level of investing in first only some sectors and then more and more sectors.
It left us badly prepared for the 1973 crisis and the fast growing cost strenght of the Japanese (who did invest generously).
The last two decades were in that respect not really great as well in NL. Not enough investments because labor too cheap. For our next general elections in March increasing the minimum wage substantially is one of the main topics incl rooting out abusive tricks to lower cost from seasonal migrants by small temp labor agencies..
 
Last edited:
On that increasing the minimum wage in NL:
We are at 10 Euro per hour, the target is 14 Euro per hour (70% of the population supporting that) and the compromise will ofc be in between.
The hot potatoe is that the state pension, unemployment money and other social insurances-benefits, are all directly coupled as percentages to that minimum wage.

From November 2020, during Covid:
About "Before 14" FNV [the big trade union] is campaigning nationwide to increase the legal minimum hourly wage from 10 to 14 euros. By increasing the minimum wage, benefits, state pension and social assistance benefits will automatically increase. After all, these are linked to the minimum wage. The campaign is now being conducted in 60 cities and several organizations, including De Goede Zaak, have joined the campaign. More and more national politicians and parties are also advocating an increase in the minimum wage. Recent independent research by I&O Research commissioned by the FNV also showed that more than 70% of all Dutch people, despite the current crisis, are in favor of increasing the minimum wage to € 14 per hour.
https://www.salarisnet.nl/loonzaken...5.2058412361.1611771223-1952131375.1611771223
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Bottom