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Unique Buildings Elimination Thread

Discussion in 'Civ5 - General Discussions' started by Mesix, Sep 12, 2012.

  1. Carl5872

    Carl5872 Prince

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2008
    Messages:
    774
    Location:
    Mentor, Ohio
    Burial Tomb 16
    Floating Gardens 20 (+1)
    Paper Maker 29
    Pyramid 40
    Satrap's Court 12 (-2)
    Stele 29
    Wat 23

    I think last poster forgot to delete the bazaar, so Im doing it.

    I actually voted down the floating gardens earlier because I didnt see that the 15% bonus to growth is regardless of if you have a lake. You can build these things on rivers. That's pretty good.

    Satrap's court isn't a bad building, its just that banks are much more 'spensive than whats left here, so it doesnt make as much sense to put them in all your cities.
     
  2. Gucumatz

    Gucumatz JS, secretly Rod Serling

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2011
    Messages:
    6,181
    Bazaar 6
    Burial Tomb 16
    Floating Gardens 20 (+1) 1/2 of my Aztec games I start nearby a lake system. In the other half I seem to land in jungle. Either way - the start bias helps the Aztecs a lot. Floating gardens adds extra food from your jungles to grow tall cities. The Jaguar being super cheap to build/defend with can hold off nearly everything in the jungle. Floating Gardens allows for a powerful tall strategy. Going with a 4-5 tall city strat and just see the wonders worked. The extra food allows me to get more hammers/larger pop in correlation. Which translates to faster units/buildings/wonders.
    Paper Maker 29
    Pyramid 40
    Satrap's Court 14
    Stele 29
    Wat 21 (-2) I really can't explain why but... I just don't like the building. The 2 culture is nice and makes it a decent trait for a wide empire but... I just can't like the synergy of it with Siam as a whole. Plus I am not a fan of the legalism trick
     
  3. duhu

    duhu Chieftain

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2011
    Messages:
    91
    Burial Tomb 14
    Floating Gardens 21
    Paper Maker 30
    Pyramid 41
    Satrap's Court 12
    Stele 31

    Wat 21
     
  4. Seabastian Civ

    Seabastian Civ King

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2012
    Messages:
    608
    Regarding the Wat/legalism trick.

    If I understand correctly, you take the +4 free culture buildings policy after getting Wat, getting 4 free ones in your first 4 cities. Okay. So do people go Liberty first with Siam, then swing back and pick up tradition 2nd? Surely people don't pop tradition first and then go into liberty.

    And is this really such a powerful trick that its worth voting up the UB? I really like the tradition finisher and go for it ASAP.
     
  5. SammyKhalifa

    SammyKhalifa Deity

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2003
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    5,500
    And how many buildings do you need to get to have it work? Still an interesting UB, but seems like for all of that effort you could just save up and buy Universities when they're available.
     
  6. Mesix

    Mesix One of Porg

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2006
    Messages:
    4,359
    Location:
    Ahch-To
    Burial Tomb 14
    Floating Gardens 19
    Paper Maker 30
    Pyramid 41
    Satrap's Court 12
    Stele 31
    Wat 21

    Corrected Floating Gardens. They were at 17 in post #199 and have since been voted up 2 times to 19.

    Please make sure you are copying the latest post when voting. This avoids confusion and the time to correct the tally.
     
  7. Algeroth

    Algeroth 8 and 1/2

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2006
    Messages:
    1,466
    Location:
    Прага
    Burial Tomb 14
    Floating Gardens 20
    Paper Maker 30
    Pyramid 41
    Satrap's Court 12
    Stele 31
    Wat 19

    It's not true that FG gives less food than Watermill. and they are not dependent on lakes. the + 15% :civVfood: is massive when going tall.

    I could be biased aganist wat from the time when it didn't have the science bonus from jungles like regular university, but still i feel that its hyped only because of the combo with current Legalism. Should it change again in future patch, it will be very medicore UB. I prefer such combos in MtG, not in Civ .

    Edited as Mesix last post.
     
  8. Dogmouth

    Dogmouth King

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    Mar 19, 2012
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    613
  9. Mesix

    Mesix One of Porg

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    I wouldn't say it is the only reason. Getting +3 :c5culture: on a building that I want to build in all my cities anyway is a pretty good reason too.
     
  10. Algeroth

    Algeroth 8 and 1/2

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    It's not bad, but nothing to be much excited about. Just with the additional culture, I would rank it somewhere little above the mud pyramid mosque.
     
  11. Mesix

    Mesix One of Porg

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    At an early stage in the game, you might have a Monument providing +2 :c5culture: and an Amphitheater providing +3 :c5culture: for a total of +5 :c5culture:. Building a Wat (replaces University which you are likely to build anyway) increases this from +5 to +8 :c5culture: (a 60% increase) for your city. Alternately, if you are not going for a cultural victory, you might not even have the Amphitheater so you have just gone from +2 to +5 :c5culture: (a 150% increase) per turn from each city which can have a big impact on generating new social policies. For a cultural victory, any UB which provides a :c5culture: bonus will help you reach the Utopia Project that much faster. For any other victory type, having more social policies always helps.

    Oh yeah...and the Legalism trick is pretty nice too :D
     
  12. Algeroth

    Algeroth 8 and 1/2

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    So what?

    Do you see what I did there?
     
  13. Seabastian Civ

    Seabastian Civ King

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    lol Perhaps the key phrase is the one you left out, " . . . replaces University which you are likely to build anyway . . . "
     
  14. Algeroth

    Algeroth 8 and 1/2

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    Yes, that's the reason why I rank Wat without the legalism above MPM. OTOH MPM is cheaper, comes earlier so it can provide culture longer through gameplay and have no maintance. I just couldn't elegantly crammed it in.
     
  15. Dogmouth

    Dogmouth King

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    That's all true. It's a good building either way (it was my first upvote in this thread). But without the legalism trick, I wouldn't put it over Floating Gardens or Burial Tomb. With the legalism trick, it's still a close call with Floating Gardens, but it's easily better than Burial Tomb (particularly now that happiness is easier to come by).
     
  16. Algeroth

    Algeroth 8 and 1/2

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    Speaking of burial tomb, could someone explain me why it lasted longer than mud pyramid? I admit that I haven't play Egypt for a long time, but i would expect that the extra culture is worth more than bonus happiness in G&K.
     
  17. Tabarnak

    Tabarnak R.I.P.

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    Location:
    Québec
    Burial Tomb 11
    Floating Gardens 20
    Paper Maker 30
    Pyramid 41
    Satrap's Court 12
    Stele 32
    Wat 19

    Stele : Same reason...must stay 2nd.

    Burial Tomb : Happiness buildings aren't that strong anyomre.

    Both Satrap and Tomb shuold disappear very fast. Then it will be a ferocious battle between FG, PM and Wat for the 3rd, 4th and 5th spot.
     
  18. Cromagnus

    Cromagnus Deity

    Joined:
    Sep 11, 2012
    Messages:
    2,272
    Burial Tomb 12 (+1)
    Floating Gardens 20
    Paper Maker 30
    Pyramid 41
    Satrap's Court 10 (-2)
    Stele 32
    Wat 19

    There is only one left on this list I don't love, so it has to go.

    + to BT: I know, it's not great, but it's better than Satrap's Court. I hate temples because of the maintenance cost. The happiness helps a lot for sprawling empires, and it makes it easy to justify an otherwise questionable purchase for your outlying cities. Zero maintenance happiness = awesome. It's a significant upgrade over the the temple.

    - to SC: Banks are expensive to build. (Twice as expensive as a temple) Furthermore the bonus only helps in high gold output cities. So you wouldn't want to build one in every city, and therefore that +2 happiness just ain't such a big deal. When compared to the the Burial Tomb, which I would build (eventually) in every city, it's a no brainer.

    PS I know I'm coming in far too late on this, but since it was the first to go, I'd just like to say that the Krepost has come in handy for me before. I've had starts with my first city where I needed to get out to the 3rd tier ASAP and for some bizarre reason the growth AI was avoiding a resource tile. A monument just wasn't getting the job done. The Krepost helps in those situations. This can be true with cities that you place late in the game too, which need to catch up, expansion-wise. Plus, it's a relatively cheap building. I don't think it deserved to be the first to go. Certainly doesn't deserve to make the top 5, but damn people hated on it. lol

    However, it is very situational, as opposed to some of the other buildings, like the paper maker, which are just always good. To make the Krepost more balanced, I'd boost the tile growth rate by 30% or maybe even 40% or take away the maintenance cost. Something to make me say "I want one of these in most cities"... it's too situational now.

    Of course, sometimes buildings are weak because the civ's other benefits are so strong. Catherine isn't exactly hurting with all her production bonuses. And Barracks have good synergy with that extra production. I agree it's not a game breaker, but I'll place Kreposts in places I wouldn't bother to put Barracks, just to get access to a resource faster/cheaper.

    Certainly better than the Mughai Fort imho, unless you're building tall, in which case you're probably building a castle anyway for defense. I can't believe that one lasted longer.

    PPS I agree, the mud pyramid is better than the Burial Tomb. I think some people +1'd it because they like capturing Egyptian cities. :p
     
  19. pensivepeppers

    pensivepeppers Chieftain

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2012
    Messages:
    66
    Burial Tomb 10 (-2)
    Floating Gardens 20
    Paper Maker 30
    Pyramid 41
    Satrap's Court 11 (+1)
    Stele 32
    Wat 19

    Burial Tomb is so very ew. Actually giving my enemies a present when they come capture a city? Yeah, no.

    Satrap's Court gets an upvote because it doesn't have the stupid repercussion, and should at least finish after Burial Tomb.
     
  20. killmeplease

    killmeplease Mk Z on Steam

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2007
    Messages:
    2,794
    Location:
    Samara
    Burial Tomb 11 (+1)
    Floating Gardens 20
    Paper Maker 30
    Pyramid 41
    Satrap's Court 9 (-2)
    Stele 32
    Wat 19

    satrap's court comes too late, and you wont build it in every city.
    burial tomb is better in any way. 2x pillage 'bonus' is irrelevant as normally you are not supposed to lose cities.
     

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