UnOfficial Expansion: Rise and Fall of Empires, Alpha Release Soon

Discussion in 'Civ5 - Creation & Customization' started by Genghis.Khan, Nov 26, 2012.

  1. lp_04

    lp_04 Prince

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    By the way, try not to put the mod too much like civ IV. I know it is tempting but it is a different game, should explore different ways of playing and improve that ways isntead of insisting in the older ones.
     
  2. Acoustic

    Acoustic Warlord

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    This man makes good points. RFC inspired is the way to go, i think.

    Hopefully I can come back to CiV when this is released :p
     
  3. Genghis.Khan

    Genghis.Khan Person

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    1. I'm portuguese too :) That is one of the main reasons I have chosen the "School of Sagres" wonder, which mostly represents Portuguese Cartography. Tower of Belém is also a good pick, but in historical terms I would prefer the School of Sagres, for the reason I stated above, even if there it is not clear that it existed (and it is probable it didn't).

    2. Agreed, I should use real buildings over specific entities.

    3. The Modern Era boost (probably with a Technology) is something I will make.

    4. I will add more policie branches and possibily rework policies (but I'll leave that to BETA)

    5. Completely agreed. Historical accuracy. More diverse gamplay. One of the worst things in [civ4] was the 1 UU and 1 UB per civ rule. Some civilizations were dedicated to building some to mlitary,

    6. Adding resources is a good idea. There are some Mods that add resources and I might include.

    --- Now the Complex Ideas

    1. That is one of the main goals but I think that should be left to Rhye, or someone who has some programming experience in C++ and Lua. I have a very limited experience in programming, and I am sorry but I can't do it.

    2. Corporations would require too much C++. And copying in C++ is a lot harder than it seems.

    3. Make them outside of the map isn't that complex. Just create it as a spy. But making them do something is harder.

    4. Help is always welcome.

    5. Let me say again that most of the concepts are not created by me, nor any other member part of the team, but just adapted to make compatibility. The purpose of this Mod is having a single one, with several new concepts, that can be played at the same time.


    @ Acoustic. Yes they are. But a version will be released so people can play just that part of the Mod

    @ lp_04 (Again- Btw is lp - Língua Portuguesa?) I'll not make a copy of [civ4]. I promise.
     
  4. Genghis.Khan

    Genghis.Khan Person

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    More Uniques Final Design (Suggestions are Welcome, Nowadays)

    Non-Bolded Uniques are still Undecided.
    Only Siam has no Unique.

    Existing Civilizations

    More Uniques
    Civilization Unique Component
    America Navy SEAL (Marine)
    Arabia Madrassa (University)
    Austria Lanwehr (Great War Infantary)
    Aztecs Eagle Warrior
    Babylon (DLC) Sappers (Axeman)
    Byzantium Hilsside Monastery
    Carthage Numidian Mercenary (Horse Archer)
    Celts Gaellic Warrior (Warrior), Iceni Chariots (Chariot)
    China Junker (Caravel)
    Denmark Drakkar (Galleass), Housecarl (Axeman) - Replacing Norwegian Ski Infantary
    Egypt Obelisk (Building Avaible at Mansory)
    England Redcoat (Musketman)
    Ethiopia Oromo Warrior (Warrior)
    France Salon (Avaible at Architecture)
    Germany U Boat (Submarine)
    Greece Agora (Market)
    Huns Yurt (Palace)
    Inca Quechua Warrior (Warrior)
    India Sepoy (Musketman)
    Iroquois Mohawahk Prowler (Axeman)
    Japan Dojo (Barracks)
    Korea Seowon (University)
    Maya Holkan (Spearmen)
    Mongolia Ger (Stable) or Laminate Bowman (Composite Bowman)
    Netherlands Scheepswerf (Seaport)
    Persia Mahout
    Polynesia (DLC) Double Headed Canoe (Galley)
    Ottomans Hamam (Public Baths) or Caravansarais (Engineering)
    Rome Thermae (Public Baths)
    Russia Hind (Helicopter Gunship)
    Siam Seri Thai
    Songhai Sofa (Pikeman)
    Spain Three Decker (Galleon)
    Sweden Bollhuset (Theatre)
     
  5. lp_04

    lp_04 Prince

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    Those were just ideas.

    First of all, and to close this point [if you do not want it], Rhye made a board game version based on CIV IV, but he added not many components. It is still civilization but with the flavour of RFC, and the board game I like the most in my collection :) That was the reason for this idea. It will help the players of CIV to bring the game to a "family/friends-style" and it would be free! And if you relate it to this Unofficial Expansion, your project would become a little bit more famous and useful (I think). But it is up to you man :)

    I will help you as I can and if you want. I made some design in the past summer but nobody asked for my ideas. I can give them to you.

    Here are some other ideas I had over this night. Feel free to use anything I post, that is the main point:

    1-» Make the Unique for Denmark the Strave Church. it is really related to denmark/Norway and a big cultural mark in those places. Also you should put the longship. Perhaps change it by the Norwegian Ski Infantry (I never understood this unit).

    2-» I don't like the new french UB. Saloon or Chateau would be better, in my oppinion.

    3-» PORTUGUESE EMPIRE:
    [UU] Nau (or carrack, it's the same) - replaces galleon (NOT THE CARAVEL!!!) and is able first, is faster, cheaper but less powerfull.
    [UU] Bandeirante (some say they are brasilian but they belong to the portuguese culture. In the XIX century there was little difference between portugal and brasil) - recon unit (if you have some to replace) or can replace the musketman, being more expensive to build and with less strenght but faster (3 or 4 movement points with no terr. mov. cost) and gives a gold boost for every resource discovered, for instance. Also can found colonies.
    [UB] Casa de Fados (mid/late game) - replaces opera house, requires acess to wine. Provides +1 gold for each wine resource, culture boost, gold boost great artists or something like that. I like this one.
    [UB] Feitoria (always the same...) - replaces harbour or seaport (with no requirement of harbour, perhaps) - more gold from coastal resources, naval units are cheaper, no maintenance.
    [LEADER] João II, Afonso Henriques, D.Dinis, Manuel I, ...
    [ABILITY] Sonething like "Alma Lusa" "Seas never sailed before" "Merchants of the seven seas" "merchants of belém"... - cheaper naval units, gold bonus for something...
    (if you want me to work in this idea and give it to you it would be a pleasure).

    By the way, I understand the School of Sagres. It would be awsom to see some Monastery of Batalha or Monastery of Alcobaça but they are too "inside portugal" and outside the world :(

    -» You can create an internal management panel to improve the gold spendings:

    Taxes: you can choose between 4 types of taxes:
    ----No taxes
    ----Low taxes (+x% unhapiness, +y% gold)
    ----Mid Taxes
    ----High Taxes

    Expenses: chose better where to expend your money:
    Science ---- turn gold into science, science into gold or nothing.
    Culture ---- turn culture into gold, gold into culture or ...
    Religion ---- turn faith into gold or gold into faith ...
    Army ---- units cheaper and less gold; units more expensive but more gold, ...
    Infrastructures ---- Building cheaper, less gold; buildings more expensive but more gold; ...
    Social Welfare ---- Settlers cheaper, workers build improvments faster and cities grow faster (lless gold); the oppopsite (recieve more gold), ...

    It is not that hard (I guess) and improves the game in a positive way, in my oppinion...



    -» Add a prehistorical (or neolithic) era (-10000 to -4000) with just a few turns, something like +7 or 8 techs, + 5 or 6 units, +4 or 5 buildings, move some wonders (stonehenge). [I can design it if wou wish, I am now studying the evolution of man for a presentation.] If you add this, make the ancient era the default era and this era as an option.

    -» About the historical scenario that spawns the entire history... I don't think an expansion (even an unofficial) should come without a new mind-blowing scenario. So, if it is difficult to create the rise and fall of RFC, you could create one of the following options:

    1) Two or three scenarios like one beginning in the acient era, one in the medieval and the other in the neolithic (if you add this). In each scenario the civilizations are different (some main ones like china, america, england, etc, are always there). And the civilizations begin in specific years (if it is possible to create)

    2) One scenario for each era with different civs all beginning at the same time but in different places and with different starting components.

    I can help you with this if yow want.


    Well, these are my new ideas. If you need something, just contact me: lp_04@hotmail.com

    PS: Nunca encontrei um português tão interessado em Civilization :) lp é para Luis Paulo [sorry for speaking in portuguese]
     
  6. Genghis.Khan

    Genghis.Khan Person

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    I read it, and it is a idea. It is a very different concept, and I can send you some rules I've been working for another board game. But it should mostly work for a specific time and not for all history as [civ]

    As I said, help is always welcome :)

    1- I am not sure about wheter I should choose (One Unique and One Norwegian Infantary Replacement) : Housecarl/Longship; Housecarl/Stave Church or Stave Church/Longship. All represent Danish culture, so it's hard to pick two.

    2- It isn't as ridiculous as it seems. Patisseries did help to diffuse French culture in Europe. Remember the number of Croissanteries that existed in Portugal (Lisbon)? Neither I, but there were lots of them. But it seems ridiculous, so, I might choose something as the Salon

    3- Portugal

    Taxes are something complex to implement. I am not sure if it is possible without C++... But I'll check it.

    Expenses will be hard to. But if you create a button (speculation - I don't now Lua) and make it do something... I think I'll ask somebody. If it is possible, maybe I'll learn Lua.

    Prehistorical Era is something not that hard to create, but it wasn't on my plans. If you don't mind designing it, I'll code it, as I plan to update Technologies. There are plenty of Prehistorical Mods, see them.

    2) is possible but, I just had an Idea. If the Korean Scenario gives a "dead" civ, they why can't a civ just have some settlers when turn x reaches?

    About your PS, mrc2022 is portuguese too, and he's helping the delevopment of this Mod. Btw I assume that you /as me and him/ go to school, so we're probably all ~the same age.
     
  7. Genghis.Khan

    Genghis.Khan Person

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  8. lp_04

    lp_04 Prince

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    Ok then. I will work on this stuff for you:

    -» RISE AND FALL OF EMPIRES: The Board Game - a board game based on civilization development BUT NOT a civilization board game.

    -» Neolithic Era - the first era, option to use it or not (ancient era set as default).

    If you discover if it is possible to make a civ begin at turn x with x units, please tell me and I will design you the scenario (make an interesting name if you want). If not, I can make many maps of different ages with different civs...

    [[Tenho 17 e vivo em Leiria. E estou pelos cabelos com o teste intermédio de matemática.]]

    Anything you want me to do, beside this, or any idea to the era/game, just contact me.

    I would ask you to send me an e-mail with you BG idea if you want, so I can develop it and add some interesting ideas. If the boardgame is done, you could put it and announce it on your web-site and forums, etc. The project will increase a lot (with this BG and NEW ERA) in good directions, I think :) (it is already a brilliant project!)
     
  9. Acoustic

    Acoustic Warlord

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    So no historical scenario?

    Question, could a scenario be made to where there's only certain realistic civikzations in certain areas (ie, china in Asia, India in India, Egypt in Africa, ect ect) and with the new revolution mod added, parts of them can revolt into other historic nations in that area?

    I see lots of concepts that say they are "implemented" yet I don't see them in either of your mod mods. Did u just forget to list them?
     
  10. Genghis.Khan

    Genghis.Khan Person

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  11. Acoustic

    Acoustic Warlord

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    So I just download from them?
     
  12. Genghis.Khan

    Genghis.Khan Person

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  13. Genghis.Khan

    Genghis.Khan Person

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    Civilizations Updated


    Israel adapted from Rob Riley's (Not Tested)
    Sumer adapted from Irkalla's and Tomaketh's
    Portugal by Genghis.Khan, mrc2022, lp_04
    The Zulu by Genghis.Khan
    Assyria by Genghis.Khan
    Poland by Irkalla
    Phoenica adapted from Rob Riley's

    Reserve:

    1. Kongo by Cyon, Iamaplayer, Tomaketh and T.Sentome (Implemented)
    2. Magyar by Genghis.Khan
    3. Hittites adapted from Rob Riley's and Tomaketh's
    4. Armenia adapted from Rob Riley's
    5. Dacia adapted from Rob Riley's
    6. Schytia adapted from Rob Riley's
    7. Gran Colombia adapted from Irkalla's
     
  14. Acoustic

    Acoustic Warlord

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    If this mod is suppose to be like an expansion, there any chance you might include all of those mods together? Versus us having to dl them separately and find out if they work together or not.
     
  15. lp_04

    lp_04 Prince

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    I think they will...

    @ Genghis, the civs are really well chosen. I think you should not put more than 10 civs. It's just an oppinion to make it acessible to everyone. More is not always better.

    Add Kongo and Sioux to the first ones you named, and perhaps hungary (magiares), brazil or columbia (a south america modern civ) and the diversity will be great!



    By the way, I am designing the Neolithic Era, if you still want it, but there is a problem: you are going to add many techs... Am I supposed to fit all the techs in 2 columns or can I have more? And can I borrow techs from the ancient era? Agriculture was discovered at 10 000 bC, pottery is much older than the 3500 bC (date where it is reached in the game).

    I was searching and found the following techs to add (mine ideas, from 2012 summer):
    - Stone Tools
    - Aesthetics
    - Irrigation
    - paper
    - Geology
    - Anthropology
    - Theory of Evolution
    - Urbanization
    - Political Science
    - Industrial Steel
    - Psychology
    - Modern Medicine (you have medicine, it's the same)
    - Biotechnology
    - Theory of everything




    Beside all this, I would like to ask you if there is any way to create a social policy tree based on naturalistic/ tribal/ pre-historic concepts.
     
  16. Genghis.Khan

    Genghis.Khan Person

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    Exactly what I was trying to explain 2,000 times before

    1. Magyar is probably a Civ I'll look foward to over the Hittites. Kongo is already picked. About the other ones, I'll think about it.

    2. Send me an /esquema, tipo em excel ou em imagem/ and I'll make it work.

    About the Technologies:

    I would avoid:

    Aesthethics
    Urbanization
    Political Science
    Paper (Alphabet)
    Modern Medicine (Medicine already exists)
    Theory of Evoution (Biology)
    Industrial Steel (Not that Relevant)

    I would change:

    Psychology -> Psicanalism

    But maybe add some others:

    Urbanism (Classical Era)

    3. Policy Branch: Tribalism?
     
  17. Genghis.Khan

    Genghis.Khan Person

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  18. lp_04

    lp_04 Prince

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    Is this the design?

    Good work, too complex, must spend some hours reading that.

    First look:
    - Pré-historic era covers many years (like a million or more), historically speaking. I have reduced the design I made only to the neolithic period. It is not too complex nor extensive and can easily be changed.
     
  19. lp_04

    lp_04 Prince

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    I also thought of another idea: art movements (relism, barroque, clacissism, classical art, modernism, ...) to boost your civ. Can be placed on the tech tree, policy trees or in a separate "artistic tree". Maby it makes the game more complex, it is just an idea. I don't think they fit the tech tree nor the policy tree as they are different from social organization and scientific/technological advancements.

    You choose :)

    Want me to send you the final design of a neolithic era? It's quite simple and acessible. Adds some pre ancient units (like stone spearman or other name), new wonder: Çatal Höyük (big ancient city in southern turkey), some buildings (longhouse, befor the palace, with less gold/science/culture boost; cromelecs - small boost of fsith and culture) moves stonehenge, reveals all the bonus and luxury resources. basically, makes the first eras more playable and diverse without making them too complex.
     
  20. Acoustic

    Acoustic Warlord

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    I apologize for the ignorance on my part, I just can't seem to grasp what you are doing lol.

    Are you working on including these all together for the release?
     

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