US Capitol Breached

[caketastydelish]

If the BLM people (or anyone else) stormed the capital and did the same thing for any terrorist motive, my position (kill them all ASAP) would be the same regardless because I'm consistent in my loyalty to this country.

With Bezerker, it depends on whether or not he agrees with the motive. As far as what happened on Jan 6, the terrorists by and large both looked like him and agree with him, hence why he would have defended them.

 

[Farm Boy]

I'm consistent

Change that, or you've missed the entire ****** premise.

 

[caketastydelish]

I don't understand how I'm not.

 

[Farm Boy]

Consistency on CFC isn't the problem. It's a matter of brute application.

 

[amadeus]

What’s the matter with his application? I’m on the side of the skull-crackers for insurrectionaries.

Especially for ones who don’t wear masks.

 

[Farm Boy]

Everyone has their sacreds they can't stand "defiled." Skull-crackers after the issue has been resolved, without mass slaughter, are just jonesing to whack off to pain.

I do it sometimes. So don't think it's a blanket condemnation. Not me in a better moment, though.

 

[Lexicus]

I was going to leave this alone but...

Most of you guys are acting crazy! You have pissed off and vindictive people in your congress, it's not just the outgoing president. And are voicing your support for the to vent their anger by trampling whatever scraps of constitution and civil rights you still have remaining.

Statehood for DC: it's unconstitutional, you would simply ignore the constitution. Always nice to have another precedent for that huh?
Talking of treason: you'll have ever more draconian and arbitrary laws.

It's crazy. Your country is sunk into a load of trouble already and you think you can solve it by handing even more power to the same people who have been digging the hole? You're basically calling for an Enabling Act - persecute "traitors" and break the constitution - and enabling act for... whom? Have you stopped to think? Is there even anyone good ready to take advantage of it, in whom you trust?

You're bloody lucky that this apparently wasn't planned and nobody had legislation ready to seize the heat of the moment and ride it. Perhaps. Yet to see in the next few days. Else under cover of responding to an alleged coup you'd end up with another, and some day whatever enabling act got passed now would be used against you.

Statehood for the parts of DC where people actually live wouldn't be unconstitutional. "DC" would just be the federal buildings in downtown, with the rest of the current District becoming a state. As for the rest, leaving aside that no one is calling for anything remotely like an Enabling Act, what do you think is the appropriate response when the head of the executive whips up a mob and attacks the legislature while they are certifying the victory of his opponent in an election? I just ask because I'm curious.

 

[caketastydelish]

There are two reasons why they didn't wear masks both related to the person who lead them to do it.

First, the person who lead them to do it has told them to reject science and to take COVID as a joke.

Second, the person who has lead them to do this lead them to believe that the law would be on their side, and they wouldn't face legal repercussions, hence why they didn't feel the need to cover themselves up for that reason either. Had the coup been successful, he would have been correct.


And as far as "Consistency on CFC" I am consistent with this and most everything else everywhere, online and offline. This isn't a unique point of view that I would only voice on CFC.

edit: @amadeus

 

[Farm Boy]

I am consistent with this and most everything else everywhere, online and offline. This isn't a unique point of view that I would only voice on CFC.

That's not better. <shrug>

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

I didn't defend Trump, I accused the Dems. Lying to a Fisa court to spy on Trump and impeaching him for investigating corrupt Democrats was the real coup.

https://www.acslaw.org/projects/the...resources/key-findings-of-the-mueller-report/

https://www.forbes.com/sites/sethco...he-leadership-of-distraction/?sh=5c7e2bc328bd

The conspiracy theorists would also have you conveniently disregard the fact that in December 2017 Flynn, as part of Special Counsel Robert Mueller's Russia investigation, pleaded guilty to lying to FBI investigators about his contacts with the Russians.

 

[Lexicus]

News reports are being blocked here. But as closely as I can recall, Trump said something like "We will march down Pennsylvania Avenue to the Congress. I will lead you. Let's have trial by combat."

'Twas Rudy G who mentioned trial by combat, actually. Shouted it quite loudly and shrilly.

 

[caketastydelish]

Anyone who thinks the event was nothing more than a dumb joke than any genuine coup attempt needs to watch this video in its entirety.

 

[amadeus]

Everyone has their sacreds they can't stand "defiled." Skull-crackers after the issue has been resolved, without mass slaughter, are just jonesing to whack off to pain.

And you know what? They have it coming. I’ve been good for the last ten months, and these people are out there making everything worse.

Would Eisenhower have let this crap pass? Goat boy would be on the business end of a rifle butt, and I’d be waving the flag for the boys that did it. Law and order!

 

[Farm Boy]

Sure. I wouldn't be mourning goat boy getting the back end of a rifle intimate with his face. But they, the cops, did better than I would have hoped for the most part. Retroactively wishing for it to be worse is something different. Being irritated they didn't get shot instead of rifle-butted is something different again. Probably sick in the head in a way most of us are at least a little.

 

[caketastydelish]

Lethal force is imperative here especially because of the implications of the attitudes of the terrorists. Many of them, knowingly on camera, identified themselves as well as where they live.

They didn't even think what they were doing was wrong. That needs to change. Drastically. Lethal force would have done it for anyone else in the indefinite future that could have had similar ideas, regardless of their political motives. Which is exactly what I want.

 

[Traitorfish]

It was an attempted coup, let's not try and normalize this. If the congressmen had not been able to evacuate in time they would have been taken hostage or killed.

A coup is an organised attempt to depose one regime and install another in its place. No such thing was evident in Wednesday's events.

The participants had a vague nation that by, obstructing the senate's ratification of the electoral college, they could buy time for their big beautiful president to play whatever last ace he had up his sleeve. This does not represent an attempt to depose the current regime, or to install a new regime in its place. Perhaps they would have supported such an attempt, if it occurred; but it did not. Many of the participants in last summer's demonstrations would probably have supported a revolution, had it occurred; but it did not, and it would be frivolous to claim that it was a failed revolution on such a basis.

This was not a coup. The reason that some claim it was a coup, the only reason, is that they have spent the last twelve months expecting a coup, had convinced themselves that such an event was inevitable, so when some sort of civil unrest occurred, it must have been the coup they had predicted. The alternative would be conceding that the elaborate story they had built for themselves, a story so-far fetched as to cast geriatric segregationist Joseph Biden as the saviour of American democracy, was hysterical nonsense, and nobody is quite prepared to let go of that just yet.

 

[AmazonQueen]

And you know what? They have it coming. I’ve been good for the last ten months, and these people are out there making everything worse.

Would Eisenhower have let this crap pass? Goat boy would be on the business end of a rifle butt, and I’d be waving the flag for the boys that did it. Law and order!

Those who attacked police officers or committed criminal damage should be prosecuted in the normal manner, same as those who committed criminal acts under the cover of the BLM protests are being prosecuted.

Still these fools aren't the real villains. They were duped by the conman in the WH and the snakeoil salesmen of the internet.
Thats why I think its important that the house should impeach Trump.
No doubt the Senate would prefer to let him walk away without penalty but it should go on record that some at least recognised him as being responsible for inciting a riot that caused the death of 5 people.

 

[Verbose]

Lethal force is imperative here especially because of the implications of the attitudes of the terrorists. Many of them, knowingly on camera, identified themselves as well as where they live.

They didn't even think what they were doing was wrong. That needs to change. Drastically. Lethal force would have done it for anyone else in the indefinite future that could have e similar ideas, regardless of their political motives. Which is exactly what I want.

Except that IS how actual revolutions get started...

 

[Verbose]

A coup is an organised attempt to depose one regime and install another in its place. No such thing was evident in Wednesday's events.

Latin America is our friend in this conceptual morass.

As someone already pointed out in this thread, it was a clear case of an attempted "autogolpe", an attempt at a "self-coup", as has been witnessed down south of the US on a number of occasions when a government eyes defeat and removal from power.
https://www.timesunion.com/opinion/article/Letter-Trump-s-Autogolpe-15784770.php

It is just fortunate that the actual depths of Trump's laziness and incompetence still remains to be definitely probed.

 

[Kyriakos]

Debatable. While the Constitution grants Congress authority over governing the Federal District, what it doesn't do is define the Federal District (or set a minimum size for it - only a maximum). That has always been up to Congress to define.



We have them and I've marched in them. The idea that somehow a capital being under provincial or state authority would prevent people from political protests is downright laughable.

The same federal constitutional rights that protect people's right to protest (freedom of assembly and freedom of speech) - non-violently - would apply exactly the same in a state or province as they do in a federal district. That's what let people protest freely, not some ridiculously daft notion that the federal government has to let people protest...somehow but a state governnment wouldn't need to. That's a wild flight of fancy of Kyriakos, unrelated to any of the reasons the actual writers of the Constitution gave to justify a federal district.

While I realize the rest of the people here are fully aware of the US constitution, I still remain unsure as to whether they also have studied the changes since that document - including a minor civil war - and the rise of state rights in the modern setting in the US. For my part, I'd have an issue only if a "state" of DC had the right to unilaterally prevent marches and protests to the government buildings and seat of power.
Clearly people can march to Athens if they feel like it - tear gas by the riot police is the only obstacle. But if the entire state had powers to ban such travel, it'd be a different issue.

Then again, I feel like stating once more that - unlike what might seem to be the case going by some posts - I actually am not able to force any rules to the US, so perhaps the issue is elsewhere.