1. We have added a Gift Upgrades feature that allows you to gift an account upgrade to another member, just in time for the holiday season. You can see the gift option when going to the Account Upgrades screen, or on any user profile screen.
    Dismiss Notice

Virote's Ancient Greek Scenario - Public Alpha

Discussion in 'Civ3 - Creation & Customization' started by Virote_Considon, Dec 24, 2007.

  1. CivChris

    CivChris Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2007
    Messages:
    63
    Location:
    Germany
    I´m at 9-10 mins now wich really... :mad:
    i think this should really be one of the important tasks to handle ...
    for i fear no one will really play it when this does not change :sad:

    hm only with corruption i think it won`t do, i don`t know exactly how it works, since there`s the distance to palace corruption, wich would stab all far of colonies to death.
    and that other corruption is something with optimal number of cities :confused: don`t know how that works out in the end?

    for sure the far off colonies still need to be operable...

    maybe delaying the agora to the classical techs would do?

    :eek: honestly i din`t know the ai would be so clever when it`s most of the time so dumb :D

    i did attack all galleys that crossed my fleets path but it was not satisfactionary... my war ships sunk their ships one by one without any counter attack...


    hrhr i hate corruption as well, always cripling my will to build more and more :rolleyes:

    but since even neapolis suffers only 1/3 of corruption, it might really be set to low under oligarchie...
    hm random game... gee can`t remember when last played one of those, but that small worldmap thing might be the case.


     
  2. Virote_Considon

    Virote_Considon The Great Dictator

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2004
    Messages:
    9,348
    Location:
    Skaville UK Reputation: 1
     
  3. CivChris

    CivChris Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2007
    Messages:
    63
    Location:
    Germany
    hm i didn`t get far...

    got another crash bug for a missing entry on the pediaicons.txt
    ANIMNAME_PRTO_P_Citizen_Hoplite2

    i can solve problems regarding buildings in the txt files :)
    but actiually i have no idea what to to with all those units files :blush:

    and since, i already upgraded some units to citizen hoplites, and they worked fine, i don`t know whats really missing here...
    it seems the crash comes when i build that unit myself, or the production switchs to it after finishing something else, never had anything like this before :confused:

    hope you can help there, cause persia just declared war on lydia and i embarked my fleet (along with amazaons and heroics) to fight for those brother greeks :D


    2 more minot things i observed but don`t know if they are intended:

    - corinth can build both heavy transport and corinthan galley at the same time, since the heavy transport does not upgrade to anything..
    i think you missed out upgrading the heavy transport to corinthan galley? wich then upgrades to the italian trireme (if you have italians that is).

    - i have artemis orthia finished and now can build army, but i can build both an army (no HP bonus) and an peleponesian army (2 HP bonus), so the normal army unit should imrpove to the better so it`s taken from the buildable list, or has it some other purpouse?
     
  4. Virote_Considon

    Virote_Considon The Great Dictator

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2004
    Messages:
    9,348
    Location:
    Skaville UK Reputation: 1
    Thanks for finding that one. It also affected another unit. Download the pediaicons again from the first post. You should still be able to continue your game :)

    It's pretty simple. You just specify the unit folder for the unit(it knows to search in art\units\). Inside the Unit folder, the .ini file should also have the same name. For the bare basics (i.e., not needing to know how to change the graphics on an Era/Captured basis), that's all there is to know :)

    This is because there are 2 different versions of the unit, because the later version can enslave. Graphically, they are the same unit, but physically, they are different. I just forgot to put in the #animname entries for the upgrades!


    I hope you do well!


    No, there is a difference between what the units can transport; the Corinthian Galley can transport more, but only Foot Units, whereas the Heavy Transport can transport less, but also transport "heavier" units, such as catapults.

    That one really was an error on my part :)
     
  5. CivChris

    CivChris Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2007
    Messages:
    63
    Location:
    Germany
    :crazyeye: yes i`d like cup of tea :lol:
    units are just locked box to me, but on the other hand i don`t need to change that :D

    ah i was checking but didn not notice the "footunit transport" for the corinthan, thus wondered why i should build that old heavy transports :)

    wokred just fine! thx!
    now i can go for persia and finish the tech tree to check if there`s anything else giving me thoughts ;)

    i feel sad for persia... i have the tomb of leonidas placing a garrison in my citys and the seven gated wall placing a city wall... so i can go for quite a ride and won`t have to check for defences too much...

    DOH! just wanted to check for what building gives the garrisons and made a right click int eh city view :mad: :mad: :mad:
    now i have to redo the whole turn :cry:

    i really hope turntimes will get at least some better in the next version :D

    plus
     
  6. Virote_Considon

    Virote_Considon The Great Dictator

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2004
    Messages:
    9,348
    Location:
    Skaville UK Reputation: 1
    Well, there are many tutorials about and people to help out when you finally do want to add units :cool:


    Yeah. It's set up this way to make it more awkward in getting heavier units, such as catapults, siege engines and chariots, around with the rest of your army. Basically, it makes heavy equipment a logistical nightmare, as they were IRL :lol:


    Sounds like you may be able to give the Persians a good run for their money! :king:

    I wish I could do something about turn times, but unfortunatley, I know of nothing, really, apart from these new crippling strategies I'm implementing...
     
  7. CivChris

    CivChris Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2007
    Messages:
    63
    Location:
    Germany
    so here we go..
    i made me a list this time :D

    - the war against perisa had some suprises, since my direct neighbours were less developed i thought persia would not be that tough only massing plain units.

    well units of perisa that i crossed while conquering the whole of asia minor:
    -greek hoplites
    -perisan archers
    -persian chariots
    -meso archers
    -meso chariots
    -meso infantry
    - ONE indian archer :)
    - heroic warriors ( at least i think it was one)

    and Xerxes , wich i killed with an amazon princess :mischief:

    they had masses of the archers and also quite some chariots and infantrys, i made it to samosata - mytilene but had to sign peace then cause 40 more perisan units were roaming in asia minor..

    the spawned units really needed their att and defence stats on this!
    so you might think again about reducing their strenght...
    on the other hand i really din`t take any other troops with me only the spawned ones, and i could have taken many with better att/deff values...

    the diffrent nationality units

    - work fine as far as i could see, italian cites build nice italian units my only mesopotamian city could build only meso worker,meso infantry and syrian merchenary, no other units :(
    hope in connection with iron there are more to build?


    Booty
    i captured one with a pirate galley, brought it back to my capital ( as i was used to with booty) nothing happend :confused:
    so i read the instrucktions :D
    melted my booty with a heroic warrior and tokk it to the VP near corinth but
    nothing happend :( tied it on VPs outside my culture zone but no sir.. no money for me

    Mythological beasts

    i wandered the steppes a bit and on my way i visited delphi ( no not to conquer) that immobile dragon there hinders the ai totaly, they won`t move any workers around and just won`t develop.. so i fear it should be taken away, although it looks really neat :cool:

    in the northern steppes the other beasts were gone... only the immoblie remaind in their locations waiting for someone to attack them :)

    one more crash bug

    -missing entry on the animname orto p peleponesian pelastate

    i checked for all other units i could build and they seem to work fine exept of the one above.

    Unit names

    as said before the city rubbel spawnes at king periander,well
    -the woman units do the same, so i have some females pretending to be king periander.. back in those times this would`ve been no joke thing :nuke:


    - completed tech tree in 733 BC, almost all classical techs took me 1-2 turns, the scools, philosophers and alchemists took care of that.


    so that`s it from me so far :)

    i won`t play that one further cause the thrill is gone, and the turn times now 15 minutes, make me cry for those 5-6 min turn times in the beginning :cry:

    i will start a new one when your done for the next update and actually can`t wait to be restricted to low research times, lesser units and a hopefully, at least tiny bit, better turn time :goodjob:

    btw, since i had way too much time between the turns i have altered the map quite some more... well at places MUCH more....

    rearranged corsica, sardinia, some of italy, most of egypt, the "carthagian" africa coast, some changes along the black sea, added malta and pantelleria (between sicily(wich i also slightly changed) and carthage.

    i added some more citys like
    Kythera (Argos)
    Ainos (Euboa)
    Messana (Magna Graecia) cause i gave kroton (originally founded by a city near patrai) to elis.
    rhegion to Messene

    ah and only for a try, i made pontus to colchis and gave sinope (colony of milet) to ionia, so ionia can setlle the black sea as they should.

    skiped byzantion back to athens as you wanted and gave kalchedon to corinth, along the bosporoan landbride since that other thing will not work :D

    sorry if i`m proposing so many changes... it`s just i`m really into maps somehow :blush:
    and since it is your mod you decide what to change when how and where of course.
     
  8. Virote_Considon

    Virote_Considon The Great Dictator

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2004
    Messages:
    9,348
    Location:
    Skaville UK Reputation: 1
    Cool :cool:

    Had they won him against you, or did he come against one of their previous conquests (such as Babylon)?

    It looks like the Persians were a bit more advanced that you'd think ;)


    I think I will still lower them. Your invasion force should definitely be made up of "homeland" troops ;)

    I don't think there are in Mesopotamia. You should be able to build those Mesopotamian Chariots, though, with Horses and the right tech (unless the Syrian Merc. is acting as a replacement).

    However, you're not supposed to be able to build too much in Mesopotamian lands as Corinth. The idea is, as Corinth (and other civs with no connection to such lands), you can only build weak "generic" units, so if you want more firepower (which you should need if you want to hold your own against the AI in their own turf), you should have to ship units in from your homeland.


    I'm not sure what is wrong here... I did accidentally select "Capture the Unit", instead of "Reverse Capture the Unit", which means you should be able to take it to your capital for the gold (rather than to a VP location). Maybe if you capture it with the Heroic Warrior (a Land unit), and take it back to your capital, it may work?

    I know what you mean :( I'm sure there is something that I could do... Maybe if I moved it outside of the immediate city radius, it would have a better effect on the AI?

    How far along the Steppes did you go? Just until the Caspian? Because if you go further (MUCH further), you should be able to find a couple of cool Chinese Dragons, among other things. I doubt you'll be able to kill them, or even damage them, but they look cool :cool:


     
  9. Virote_Considon

    Virote_Considon The Great Dictator

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2004
    Messages:
    9,348
    Location:
    Skaville UK Reputation: 1
    Made another Pediaicons fix- DL them again from the front page!
     
  10. CivChris

    CivChris Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2007
    Messages:
    63
    Location:
    Germany
    must have gotten xerxes from babylon or either india, for they had an indian war running as well.

    sounds perfect reasonable to me :goodjob:

    - moment please I´ll load it up again :D

    yes! captured the princess, so return to the capital was it.

    won`t do :( i have stelled sardinia (where that snake thing lingers) and although it`s outside my culture zone ( 3 tiles form the city)
    my worker won`t automate ...
    seems he fears that thing might strike him dead :eek:

    so i fear they have to be placed on more remote spots.

    hell, no i just went through a bit of western europe,
    concerning the turn time, reaching asia would really be sort of a weeks journey....

    renaming?! that ain`t funny man :cry:

    i got 89 of those rubbish rabbles... :D

    hm... so all units with king flag get the same name? theres no workaround?
     
  11. Virote_Considon

    Virote_Considon The Great Dictator

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2004
    Messages:
    9,348
    Location:
    Skaville UK Reputation: 1
    Ah. How did the Indian war pan out? Who (territory-wise) "won" the war?


    In the next version, it will definitely be Victory Locations!


    That's a bummer! I guess I could reduce some of their stats, to make them a small menace early in the game, but menaces which can be easily defeated?


    A true adventure :D


    None that I know of, apart from giving them the "leader" flag (which means you'll have rabble Jasons and Women Heracles' within your cities, which is just as bad! :lol: )
     
  12. CivChris

    CivChris Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2007
    Messages:
    63
    Location:
    Germany
    hm i have not yet made contact with india, but since i traded word maps with persia, i could see them slowly advancing into gandara and bactria taking some cities there.
    but the overall impression was that persia was loosing ground, that might be due their encounter in the west with lydia and myself and the masses of troops they moved into my direction and not to india...
    though they could have even more units over there...

    hm yeah thats a problem that needs a fine solution...

    - placing mobile units won`t do as well for they just attack in the first turns and take some gold ... :(

    - placing the immobile, with weak defence would do for funsport in the first few turns, but not more :sad:

    - placing too many immobile on future settling spots may lead the ai to settle some far off lands... :(

    for now maybe stick more to the mobile units on settable islands? so anyone trying to settle further from the beast will be attacked furtheron..

    but honestly i have no solution for this either....


    hm k, so it`s set with all those kings at least for now :king:

    as for the map, i`ll redo some of the levante as well, since it`s so unnaturally streched due to the much larger greece it just doesn`t feel right for me...
    i`ll leave mesopotamia as it is though, cause changing that would make it necesarry to fit more land in all the way to asia...

    i`ve actually really started to like the map itself, although i`m more for real earth maps, with a few changes i`m actually loving that map :D

    keroko made something really fantasic with it, i`ve seldom seen a map in just the perfect sizes for cities and civs like this,
    normally all maps tend to be too small or too big...

    as soon as i come up with a suitable version of the levant i`ll post it.

    sneak peak at the changed carthagian coast, with malta pantelleria,
    i placed ruins on all colony locations i have the historic name for.

    img_003.jpg


    forgot to mention: i`ve added lots of sand dunes (no roads) because i really dislike seeing the ai or my own automated workers build roads on every tile they can walk upon...

    and as you already used it in arabia it`ll divide north from south afrika, with exeptions on some small "trade routes" that i left open for roads.
     
  13. CivChris

    CivChris Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2007
    Messages:
    63
    Location:
    Germany
    k levate is done, i checked back with the previous chnages i posted and will try to give a list of the changes, so you won`t have to loook all over :)

    - changed some coasts a lil and added overall ruins at the colony spots that i got the names for.

    - changed the hellespont by making it wider, now the lydian cities won`t block settling positions on the western coast when they get to 100 culture.

    - added the landbride at byzantion (athens) again, kalchedon (corinth) will still be of importance as garrison on the east side.

    - as a sugestion gave sinope to Ionia ( was colony of milet) to represent the ionian influence and colonization in the black sea
    and because of it renamed pontus to colchis (capital at phasis)

    - moved the "ionian" coast a row more inland and added some ocean there

    - changed tarsus to perisa ( that now hold 2 med sea ports)

    - changed antioch to babylonia

    - added berytos and sidon to phonicia ( was not sure about the phonicia tribe resource? will they need meso ressources as well?)

    - changed the levant and it`s cities to better fit the map

    - tweaked arabia so it would fit as it should be and conect the sheban empire

    - moved the iram of the pillars to western oman ( theres been recent surveys there that might identify an ancient spot as that realm

    - added panormus (sizily) to phonicia, magna graecia would settle that spot before the phonicians and since they lost some cities in the east.

    - added messana and massilia to magna graecia

    - skipt kroton to elis rule

    - reshaped the carthagian coast along corsica, sardinia and sizily

    - i added a asclepion (2nd palace to charthage) i really think thats useful so the greeks will have a tough time to race against phonicia for good settlements in the western med, bad thing is that the asclepion won`t work when the city gets over size 6... but the gerousia will only work under oligarchy... maybe another good corruption reducing building placed there from the start would serve as well

    - i thought about the same for meroe, since that would normally be a kingdom of it`s own... but i fear it would get too powerful so i skiped that idea.

    - reshaped the italian peninsula a bit and replaced the etrusan cities, volsinii is now capital for that`s the suposed place of the fanum voltumnae ( the etrusan cief sanctuary and meeting place.

    - moved mediolanum (celts) to northern italy, not sure so if it gets italian or babarian tribe ressources?

    - changed the nile a bit and replaced egyptian cities
    i have naucratis as the " nile port" and rhacotis ( thats were alexandreia was founded) west of it.
    i`d sugest to keep both cities because naucratis was very important until alexandria took that role. plus naucratis stayed the only polis in the ptolomaian empire. the human player can still decide for himself wich city he will evolve more.

    - added lots of sanddunes to restirct all players to build roads all around ...


    - some more minor changes i really can`t remeber :D

    because there are so many changes, you would have to import that map to your biq if you want to take the changes.
    i would sugest:
    you take a toughtful and close look at the changes, i made sure the "tribes" ressources are in place and copied all other resources from the original version.
    if you dislike some of the landscape/ cityplacement changes give me feedback and i`ll change them to your sugestions ;)

    heres the file
    View attachment DoricGreece2WORK.zip
     
  14. Virote_Considon

    Virote_Considon The Great Dictator

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2004
    Messages:
    9,348
    Location:
    Skaville UK Reputation: 1
    Does anyone you know have contact with India? Babylon or Sheba might?


    I think I'll weaken the ones who start in "good" positions, but keep mobile ones on islands, then. The ones roaming around in the more "barbaric" lands need not be altered, though :)



    Aye. However, should whoever owns it release their parts of the source code, I'll be able to change it :p

    Yeah, the Levante is a bit streched. That, the Sinai and Africa (which is by far the worst hit area of the map, which was a necessary change, else Laconia would find itself linking up with Cyrenacia :lol:

    That's what draws me to this map, as well. In other maps that I've seen, I've found that some areas (especially the already crowded Greece) are too small, whereas others (such as Anatolia, or Persia) are much too big for what is needed. After taking the large Greece from Varwnos' Byzantine map, and placing it on Keroro's map, everything was pretty much the perfect size!


    Brilliant! Looks like it will be dead useful!


    Sounds good to me. I'd done that with a previous version, but when I altered the map, I had no need for it. Now that I have the Arabian Workers set to unwheeled (which was necessary to link up Incense and Spices), I have reason to include it in more areas than I currently do :blush:
     
  15. CivChris

    CivChris Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2007
    Messages:
    63
    Location:
    Germany
    stupid me :rolleyes:
    could have thought about that before...

    checked it the babylonians could give me contact with the shebans

    the indian contact i could get from persia of course...
    i traded maps and india has advanced up to Margu and Ghazni but havent lost any of theri cities it seems. so india might be too powerful for poor persia...

    well i fear we all know that that aint likley... at least not in the near future :sad:
     
  16. Virote_Considon

    Virote_Considon The Great Dictator

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2004
    Messages:
    9,348
    Location:
    Skaville UK Reputation: 1
    Nice. I'll still probably look all over, though :p

    Nice, nice and nice again!


    I still dunno if I'm gonna do this, or not...

    Sounds good!

    I won't be doing this- it may give Persia a jump start when trying to take over Greece! I want them to work towards gaining access to the Med!

    I'll have to look at this one properly. On the one hand, I dunno how it will affect Phoenicia, but on the other, there is nothing immediately wrong with this that I can think of.

    They do need both; the Mesopotamian resource needs to be under the cities at least, and the Phoenician resource will allow the construction of superior boats!

    All sounds good to me!

    I was planning to, if I still had enough improvement/wonder slots when I'd finished the Colony civs tech tree.

    Meroe was in the same boat as above.

    Sounds good to me.

    Probably Italians.

    Sounds good again!

    Cool!

    I'll have both the .biq files open, so I can study them carefully.

    Nice one!

    You'll be able to see the changes which I kept when I release the next update, which should be before the end of the month! (especially since I have 1/2 term...)
     
  17. Virote_Considon

    Virote_Considon The Great Dictator

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2004
    Messages:
    9,348
    Location:
    Skaville UK Reputation: 1
    Ha! Looks like the Persians have already over-extended themselves!


    So much for optimism :p

    Anyway, ~£95 million tonight in Euromillions... I'll happily pay £1m for the winning ticket :mischief:
     
  18. CivChris

    CivChris Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2007
    Messages:
    63
    Location:
    Germany
    on colchis:
    well as said it`s up to you, it`s sort of a fame to history conflict in my eyes, since pontus is a name many players associate something with, colchis is more sort of a myth realm... but would be the historic choise.

    i also thought that it might give trouble... but i wanted to reduce phonicia to its actuall borders...
    may i sugest

    -to give kelenderis to lydia

    - leave antioch at babylonian hands,
    on the other hand... antioch was founded ~300BC so in the time the mod spans there was no city...
    BUT! you could always rename it to AL-Mina and give it to euboa, for it was a colony from there...

    - and give tarsus back to phonicia, tarsus / cilicia was more or less independent during most of the spaning time, so it would be ok to represent it as idependent phonician city, i guess

    just imporant in my eyes is to cut the phonician realm at antioch so the "true" phonicia looks right.

    hm since the month just started :cry: guess i`ll have to check for other games till then :sad:

    :eek: :eek: :eek: thats some amount of money...
     
  19. Virote_Considon

    Virote_Considon The Great Dictator

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2004
    Messages:
    9,348
    Location:
    Skaville UK Reputation: 1
    Aye. Also, I don't know what tech tree Colchis would go in, whereas Pontus fit nicely within the Hellenistic tech tree with Macedonia and Epirus.


    Sounds fun enough!

    I see what you mean.


    Well, half-term is the week after next, so we'll see how well I'm doing then :)


    Yeah. The source code holders wouldn't be able to resist it! :king:
     
  20. CivChris

    CivChris Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2007
    Messages:
    63
    Location:
    Germany
    i`ve tried a play with the redone map, i`m half way through the archaic times and it seems it works quite fine so far.

    i set research rates to min. 8 and max. 25 and it seems all ais are developing really good at times too good ( thrace got greek hoplites already :mischief: since they have no complete tech tree)

    but the "finished" ai`s like thebes, elis and sparta seem to do better, having heroic warriors, amazons and satyrs walking around.

    so it might be no bad idea to set a research limit so even the low developed countries will go for some power.

    and babylonia and india seem to conquer the persian empire :eek:

    found another missing entry:

    art/uniuts mycenean chariot/ mycenean chariot .ini

    one of the ai was building a doric chariot, wich caused the game to crash..
    i was wondering, but i think i have not build any of these back in the other game :confused:

    well it could go along greeks techs along like the bosporian kingdom cause it was well influneced through the greek colonisation and the slave trade with the greeks.


    so, did you get any of the euromillions for the source code? :D
     

Share This Page