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Vox Populi Diplomacy Feedback

Discussion in 'Community Patch Project' started by HeathcliffWarriors, Nov 25, 2019.

  1. HeathcliffWarriors

    HeathcliffWarriors King

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    If we already have a Defensive Pact with them, return false. :)...I'll correct the ambiguous wording.
     
  2. HeathcliffWarriors

    HeathcliffWarriors King

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    Upcoming changes for next version:
    Code:
    Bugfixes
    
    If you decide to extend the game after it ends, the AI's desperate aggression boost and victory dispute/block penalties will be removed
    
    AI should be substantially less likely to peace out when decisively winning and/or when they're going for a Domination Victory, unless they've captured the civ's capital
    
    When deciding which player is their most valuable potential friend or Defensive Pact, the AI will no longer count players they are at war with as potential friends/DPs (should result in more dynamic diplomacy)
    
    Fixed bugs preventing AIs that share competitors from collaborating
    
    Experimental strategic diplomacy changes by era:
    
    Ancient/Classical Era
    - Increased AI DoF willingness with distant civs
    - Decreased AI DoF willingness with civs they have border disputes with
    
    Renaissance Era
    - AI diplomacy should reflect the AI's chosen victory condition a lot more (significant weight changes to GetBestApproachTowardsMajorCiv and DoRelationshipPairing)
    - For bloodthirsty world conquerors, weight change will start in the Medieval Era instead
    
    Small improvement to target evaluation
    
    Removed dumb & unfun cooldown on DoF requests - you can now ask for Declarations of Friendship as often as you want without the button disappearing.
    
    Don't understand why Firaxis added this mechanic, I always found it stupid - the only reasons I can think of are that they
    wanted to display a different message if you asked recently and/or the AI was very dumb and exploitable. With my edit,
    the different message is still displayed if you asked recently and they say no again, so they have no excuses. :)
    
    Edit:
    Code:
    AI can now tell if your empire is very unhappy if they're spying on you or you have the worst global approval rating, in addition to when they're at war with you
    
    Humans can do this by checking the AI's city growth tooltips, checking the Demographics panel, or mousing over the AI's units, respectively
    
    AIs that are not unhappy themselves will be more likely to consider you an easy target because of this, and more likely to declare war on you.
     This includes if England is spying on you in the early game!
    
     
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2019
  3. usadefcon1

    usadefcon1 Warlord

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    What exactly is meant by different continents? Being on different land masses or something else? This carries the same weight as a denouncement which seems pretty strong.
     
  4. Rekk

    Rekk King

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    What's the difference between "forgotten after X turns" and "increments/decrements by X each turn" as per "We traded recently"? Performance?
     
  5. HeathcliffWarriors

    HeathcliffWarriors King

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    Different land masses. It's worth noting that it also decreases enemy weight and increases friendship weight; the idea is that if you're on different landmasses, coming to each other's defense is more difficult, war is more difficult, but friendship is more rewarding.

    Recent trade caps at 175 positive value, decays by 1 every turn, and the modifier is equal to the value divided by 5.

    Modifiers that decay after X turns such as siding with your protected City-State or stealing from them will reset the counter, and if applicable, add one instance of committing the offense.

    So if you steal twice within 50 turns (standard speed), you reset any progress towards the penalty for the first theft being removed, in addition to doubling the penalty.

    Also, the opinion penalty will remain the same until one instance is forgotten, rather than decreasing (and therefore improving your Opinion) before then.
     
  6. civplayer33

    civplayer33 King

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    Regarding the Transparent Diplomacy option: it states "AI leaders will never hide negative modifiers when they are Friendly"; so with that option turned off, is this referring to the AI hiding negative modifiers when they pretend to be Friendly but are really taking a deceptive stance or does the AI do this even when genuinely Friendly? IMO it only makes sense that they would hide modifiers when being deceptive, since "Friends" are supposed to be able to communicate disagreements to prevent a breakdown of the friendship due to exacerbating unvoiced grievances. So I'm just wondering whether it is as I state or, if it isn't, suggesting that this be looked at.
     
  7. Rekk

    Rekk King

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    I think a lot of penalties can be better served by a gradual increase in opinion (which can still shoot further into the negative/reset to max upona additional offense), rather than the AI having massive jumps in its opinion.
     
  8. Gazebo

    Gazebo Lord of the Community Patch Supporter

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    doesn’t matter. Opinion affects approach on a controlled scale. Big jumps still have a gradual effect.
     
  9. HeathcliffWarriors

    HeathcliffWarriors King

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    They hide modifiers when their visible approach is FRIENDLY. This is true whether their true approach is FRIENDLY, DECEPTIVE or WAR. If they only hid modifiers when they weren't really FRIENDLY, the player could always tell when the AI is secretly plotting against them. :)

    In addition to what Gazebo said, -10 is not a massive change. :)
     
    vyyt likes this.
  10. civplayer33

    civplayer33 King

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    Heh, good point :lol:
     
  11. usadefcon1

    usadefcon1 Warlord

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    I mean, SOMETHING should be possible. (11-25-2)

    Spoiler Screenshots :


    Screenshot (16).png Screenshot (17).png Screenshot (18).png Screenshot (19).png Screenshot (20).png Screenshot (21).png

     
  12. Coffee Monopoly

    Coffee Monopoly Warlord

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    Very unlikely, but it is theoretically possible he already sold all his votes. :lol:
     
  13. HeathcliffWarriors

    HeathcliffWarriors King

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    If Casimir had already traded away his votes, it'd be greyed out with a red tooltip.

    AIs tend to be reluctant to trade their votes away.
     
  14. Kim Dong Un

    Kim Dong Un The One & Unly Supporter

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    I was actually able to trade for a vote or two in my last game for the first time in ages. It was still a wee bit pricey, but certainly reasonable for the situation.

    I was also legitimately bullied for the first time that I can remember and I had no choice but to give in; Monty was ready to storm my 2nd best city while I was busy fighting on two other fronts.
    Spoiler :
    Screenshot (69).png
    I'll also bring up something I've noticed for a while, but if you're the current ally of a CS, the AI will always be in favour of your proposal for a sphere of influence over that CS, regardless of the situation surrounding that CS. Here's the landscape around La Venta: Monty has tried to take it by force all game, while the Inuit have wrestled back and forth with me on controlling it diplomatically, yet they both (as well as Venice) are cool with me becoming the permanent ally.

    Spoiler :
    Screenshot (68).png
    Spoiler :
    Screenshot (67).png
     
    cerk and Coffee Monopoly like this.
  15. Yaviel

    Yaviel Chieftain

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    I too find it too easy to permanently gain CS. A solution for this could be this:
    If the AI has friendly relations to the player
    If the CS is not near that AI
    If the AI is not the current ally of the CS
    Then the AI will be in favor and votes for it.

    If any of these 3 requirements are not met, the AI will always vote against it. I personally play that way.
     
  16. HeathcliffWarriors

    HeathcliffWarriors King

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    Voting logic is not something I'm very familiar with but that does seem like strange behavior; I'll take a look.
     
    Kim Dong Un, usadefcon1 and Yaviel like this.
  17. usadefcon1

    usadefcon1 Warlord

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    If he was planning on voting that way anyway he should be willing to get something out of it.
     
  18. Coffee Monopoly

    Coffee Monopoly Warlord

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    I'd welcome that. Imo WC voting behaviour is an area where there's still tons of room (and need) for improvement, as I've reported on other occasions.
     
  19. Rekk

    Rekk King

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    I think they should be more willing to do so. Moving diplomats around in order to trade for enough votes is incredibly key for getting anything you want done if you don't absolutely dominate the WC. Even confirming votes for a proposal you don't care about is useful in reducing the potential number of votes available for a proposal you do not want to pass.

    Yes, this should be tempered by how much they are in favour of / against other proposals, but trading votes should be a regular thing, not 1-2 votes a game (and the AI should be moving its diplomats around to secure votes it feels strongly for/against as well).
     
    Last edited: Dec 10, 2019
    Kim Dong Un likes this.
  20. HeathcliffWarriors

    HeathcliffWarriors King

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    Todo:
    - Strategic diplomacy update (experimental; aiming to finish for next version); continue to make adjustments & improvements until diplo AI is a work of art
    - Debug option to always display a leader's true approach
    - Advanced debug logging tool for approach calculation (can be enabled by user by modifying an SQL file, logs every step of the approach calculation and the weight changes throughout)
    - Examine deal AI logic to get a full understanding, look for opportunities to improve
    - Examine league (voting) AI logic to get a full understanding, look for opportunities to improve
    - Tweak league AI for sphere of influence resolution
    - Backstabbing penalties rework
    - Military aggression warning rework
    - Full sweep of all English diplomacy dialogue: correct grammar, typos, spacing; get an understanding of how diplomacy dialogue works
    - Learn how to make new dialogue messages
    - Modify dialogue logic to increase randomness/variety (currently I find the same messages tend to show up a lot in some cases; leaders will tend to always say the same thing if you DoW on them as a warmonger)
    - Special dialogue project :)

    Looks like I have my work cut out for me, haha.
     

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