Cosmichail said:
It seems both team A and B are aiming for the same strategy but Team A lost DP with KK. Having two DP's can be tricky since they both will have a negative for having a DP with a rival.
Not always. Currently, we do not get a negative penalty with either Kublai or Cyrus for our respective DPs. The AI doesn't mind it when they're also close. That could change, of course.
I have looked at the 1820 save, and I have determined if Team A loses, why we have lost. This is a good lesson for both teams, as it illustrates the perils of not keeping a close eye on diplomacy, and nice enough, the entire team is to blame, so there is no finger-pointing.
And as so many things in life, it all comes down to a bottle of wine.
There are two components in Civ4, Strategy and Luck. Team A has already had some bad luck. I know this, because I played the save forward at one point to determine whether we'd be successful with the PA. And we were. In 1802. In the current game, however, it's 1820 and Kublai doesn't have Communism yet! Thus it was poor luck on our part that Kublai chose a different research path, otherwise we'd already be in a PA with him.
However, that's not the main problem. The main problem is illustrated with our diplomatic relations as of 1820:
+5 Favorite Civics
+6 Religion
+2 Open Borders
+2 Defensive Pact
+1 Peaceful Relations
-1 Border Tension
Once Kublai goes Free Religion, we lose the +6 and drop from +15 to +9 and cancels the DP. Now you might say that was bad luck again, but I say no--it was poor planning. Look at the list. What is missing?
Exactly. Where's our 'Trades have been fair and forthright' bonus? All we need is +1 and the DP isn't cancelled. But it's not there.
We're a small civ, with few cities and even fewer resources. The one extra resource we do have is Wine, which we've been trading to JC for a long time now. But Kublai could use it. And we could've been trading it to Kublai instead (this is what I mean by the whole team is to blame; any of us--including myself--could've made the trade switch).
Do you know the old poem that starts
For want of a nail, the shoe was lost...? Sadly appropriate in this situation. All we had to do was give Kublai some wine ...