Wang Kon is a weasel

[Cvntpumeler]

He doesn't, in any version. And he is one of the hardest to capitulate even with the "hard way"

Yeah i've never seen Mansa be vassalized either... his UU protects him from an early invasion and he's almost always the first AI to feudalism and every other important tech, making him a difficult target for the opportunistic AI.

 

[Arlborn]

That is weird! I could have swore I saw him more than once!

Hum, maybe I did confuse something, as I didn't play CIV for like 6+ months before BTS came. But really, I could have swore!

EDIT: Is there any XML file about it? I really want to check!

 

[oedali]

Is there any XML file about it? I really want to check!

Yes, Mansa is one of the few AI that will vassalize even when he's cautious towards you. This is new in BTS as a lot of this code was changed in xml to allow more leaders to vassalize when pleased instead of friendly. And some, including Mansa, even vassalize when they're cautious now. Check this for more details, I recently posted it. (first attachment)

 

[Arlborn]

Yes, Mansa is one of the few AI that will vassalize even when he's cautious towards you. This is new in BTS as a lot of this code was changed in xml to allow more leaders to vassalize when pleased instead of friendly. And some, including Mansa, even vassalize when they're cautious now. Check this for more details, I recently posted it. (first attachment)

Wow, nice guides )

See people, see?!?! I told you that Mansa was a "passive" kind of guy!

 

[oedali]

Thanks!

Attitude is only a part of what goes into the decision whether an AI will vassalize though. I'm guessing that the AI has to feel threatened by other civs' military power because he's weak, and also the leader to vassalize to has to have a big enough power ratio over theirs. Only if these hold then the attitude check will be done. In Mansa's case the lower attitude requirement makes it easier for him to pick a leader to protect him because he doesn't necessarily have to like them too much. This goes with his personality too as he cares only about money and his own survival.

 

[uat2d]

Did he keep saying "We have enough on our hands right now" whenever you tried to ask him to declare war on someone else? That would mean he was preparing for war with you the whole time.

What's really annoying about it is when at war; in a normal game, you can always get some kind of help; but with "Aggressive AI" on, they never declare war, because they're always preparing one!!!

 

[Cvntpumeler]

Wow, nice guides )

See people, see?!?! I told you that Mansa was a "passive" kind of guy!

Oh, we know he's passive... He's just always in the lead so he doesn't vassalize. What difficulty do you play on? I bet he sucks on a lower difficulty but gets better as difficulty increases...

 

[axident]

Wang Konstipated refused to capitulate to me in a recent Immortal game until I took out over half of his empire. He just kept on fighting even after I took Seoul and all but one of his big cities. In contrast, the Incans gave up after I took something like 2 cities out of 10.

 

[Arlborn]

Oh, we know he's passive... He's just always in the lead so he doesn't vassalize. What difficulty do you play on? I bet he sucks on a lower difficulty but gets better as difficulty increases...

Prince! I don't see why he would do bad, in comparation with me, if other AIs do good...?

 

[Lance of Llanwy]

What's really annoying about it is when at war; in a normal game, you can always get some kind of help; but with "Aggressive AI" on, they never declare war, because they're always preparing one!!!

Not entirely true...Joao(I really, really hate him now) DOW'd on me, but I bribed Mao and the sizable Chinese army to whip him for me.

Pacal seems to be a bit of a creampuff himself. Just today, he was willing to capitulate after I had taken TWO cities...neither of which were his capital. Granted, they were big cities, but I was kinda surprised. Most of his land was on islands, but his capital and a few other cities were on a peninsula on my half of a continent(Tectonics did two things: blocked me off behind mountains...and made over 50% of the available land desert. I'm not randomizing climate ever again.) Of course, it being only my second Monarch game, I kinda didn't have the punch I needed to finish the job, which was very frustrating.

Oh...and it has nothing to do with the topic, but I want to communicate just how BAD my second city was on that map...

Spoiler :

It literally had FIVE non-desert, non-peak tiles in its fat cross. It had desert stone, desert copper(the only copper aside from some all the way on the far western end of the continent. The mountain blocked-part was to the east. Pacal was quite far to my north, on a luscious tropical peninsula), an oasis, a lake, and a plains tile south of the lake. I founded it in part for the copper, and in part for the stone. The city spent the game fluctuating between four and five pop, but its stone did allow me to snag the Great Wall and the 'Mids. Still. WORST. CITY. EVER.

 

[Legal_My_Deagle]

He also backstabbed me this game

 

[uat2d]

Joao(I really, really hate him now)

hey, Joao was a fine man! (What annoyed me was the fact that in Civ 3, D. Henrique (i think it was him the portuguese leader) attacked me a lot, although Joao never attacked me)

In real life, he killed one noble with a knife on is palace (R_Rolo1, correct me if i'm wrong); so he was aggressive, but that was because they (nobles) were conspiring to kill him and assume the power.

So the famous sentence: "I'm the lord of the lords, not the serf of the servants."

 

[Cvntpumeler]

Prince! I don't see why he would do bad, in comparation with me, if other AIs do good...?

I'll speculate that it's because on higher difficulties he gets a bunch of free Skrimishers and that ensures that nobody can attack him early. I also play on Marathon so maybe in contrast to your games he has more time to exploit his tech lead. I play Prince when I play MP with my girlfriend and Mansa is definately better on Immortal than he is on Prince in relation to the other AIs.

 

[onedreamer]

Wow, nice guides )

See people, see?!?! I told you that Mansa was a "passive" kind of guy!

what did we see ? your point is that he easily vassalizes, but I don't see that, and he's in 80% of my games, so I ought to know him pretty well. Maybe you played RFC ? In that case it's a different story.

 

[Arlborn]

what did we see ? your point is that he easily vassalizes, but I don't see that, and he's in 80% of my games, so I ought to know him pretty well. Maybe you played RFC ? In that case it's a different story.

No, I never saw his as vassal in RFC.

And, as I said, it was Warlords. I didn't meet him yet in BTS! Or once, but I quited early, very early.

 

[dante alighieri]

I should retitle this thread Wang Kon is an opportunistic little weasel. Currently as Rome I overexpanded too quickly and my economy was going down the toilet. Still, there were a few choice city spots left to my north and south. I had to claim them soon, since Stalin would take the southern ones and the north was up for grabs between Sitting Bull and Gilgamesh. Wang was to the east and doing pretty well. Stalin had the unfortunate luck to start off in the frozen icky part of the continent, but he had a few cities in viable areas. I took those, as Stalin was weak. For some reason I kind of knew that Gilgamesh would declare war on me before I attacked Stalin, and I was right. But he sent ONE vulture who just stood there for 2 turns before suiciding himself on my northernmost city. I quickly made peace with Stalin and started moving troops to fight off Gilgy. The AP kicked in though (I had built it) so I managed to make peace with Gilgamesh. Now all I had to do was get my economy back up and build more praetorians to erase the russians.

Here comes Wang kon. He had a stack of chariots and spearmen that he had been parading around the border. I'm thinking he's going to attack, since I lightly defended those cities near him. Most of my army had been moved north to defend against Gilgamesh so if he did try to take the cities near his borders he'd probably succeed. But the little weasel moves his stack through my territory and attacks stalin!

At this point Wang had a larger army than i did, and Stalin had some crappy cities anyway. You'd think he'd try to whittle me down a bit, since stalin was pretty much a nonentity in the war department. But I guess he decided the easiest target would be the one I softened up for him.

Well, I didn't want to let Stalin expand anymore or for Wang kon to get a foothold to my south so I redeclared war on Stalin and attacked his one city besides his capitol that had grassland surrounding it. (St. Petersburg was in a decent area, but Wang took it.) Funny thing is a few turns later Stalin took it back.
I guess I shouldn't be too hard on Wang kon though. His war against Stalin caused the russkie to draw his swordsmen out of the city I wanted making my own conquest easier.