War with Holy Rome, what to do?
- Thread starter Ontave
- Start date
Ontave,
As score leader (at least from the tribes that you've met) with a good chunk of turf, you're clearly in a pretty good position.
I'd say 'areas to address' would include;
Forge on!
[Edit Below]
Further to the above - I agree with Mr. Felony and Xanadux re. getting a Spy out to do some exploration. So - seige weapons, Buddhist Missionaries, at least one Spy, and as noted below - some buildings are all presenting themselves as advantageous!
I felt it might be of interest to run through some of the key cities and make a few observations in light of the earlier references to city specialisation.
Rome:
Clearly enduring significant war weariness this city is ripe for a whip. It's got a Forum and the National Epic, and despite the Gold Mine has three Food resources, presenting itself as an ideal
Farm.
Following a big whip - possibly to finish a partially built Forge?, look at Farming the Grasslands south east of the Lake, and running Specialists. Unhappiness can also be addressed by moving units there from Antium (Hereditary Rule).
Antium
A big production centre in waiting, but the city's stagnated and is running two Specialist Scientists. Food will be a problem for this city as chain irrigating to it is unfeasible, but at least consider Windmills on the Grassland Hills and a Cottage on the Grasslands just to grow the population and get some value from the currently unworked tiles. As a production centre, it needs a Forge.
Nova Roma
Even without Bureaucracy, your capital finds itself in a mixed role as being both your top Science Centre as well as your best Unit Pump - that is, it hasn't specialised one way or the other and is prospectively missing the benefit of a more defined focus. Some key buildings are missing here.
Pisae and Scipae
Two cities that have strong commercial leanings with Riverside Towns.
Pisae will pop your next being a Great Scientist, which I would consider for an Academy there - the value of settling vs. lightbulbing vs. academies will be debated ad nausium, but this city strikes me as a good spot for an Academy. After popping the Great Person, work the Plains Cottage and the Grasslands Mine to build commercial buildings. I'd forget the Barracks and go after the Forum.
Scipae also presents itself as a good commercial city, but needs to look at its food haul. Farms and Windmills, and lose the Specialist Scientist to support the Cottaged Plains.
Ravenna and Cumae
Here are some unit pumps to balance Pisae's and Scipae's commercial focus.
I'd have Ravenna focus on
and 
- albeit disappointing to have a Gold Mine in waiting - and dedicate it to a unit-pump city. Farm the Grasslands adjacent to the Lake, and the one to its south. Its size possibly warrants a Courthouse. Again, unhappy citizens can be whipped away, and again a Forge strikes me as a good option, with Barracks and Stables to follow.
Cumae with and is another good production spot - but its Specialists are robbing it of growth and aren't going to pop a anytime soon. Windmills may be the go on those two Riverside Grassland Hills.
Other thoughts;
Irrigate towards Florence in the west.
Maoi Statues in Mediolanium or Arretium would seem to be worthwhile with a lot of coastal tiles.
There are a couple of reasonable city sites within your core empire as you've founded cities quite far apart. I'd consider putting a city three tiles north of Cumae to work the Copper supported by (Farmable) Floodplains and Grassland. There's a Fish-Copper-Fur site south of Antium that could be worth considering too.
Hope this is of help.
(Xanadux - no Optics yet, no Open Borders with Babylon).
As score leader (at least from the tribes that you've met) with a good chunk of turf, you're clearly in a pretty good position.
I'd say 'areas to address' would include;
- Meet other tribes - after Chemistry look at pressing on to either Military Science or Steel, but trade / sue /steal / self-research Optics so you can meet other tribes and leverage trade opportunities. Your knowledge of other lands is 'concerning light' at best.
- You need siege weaponry to knock down defences - I notice that you've recently begun building Trebuchets, but rather than concentrating on Knights I'd be looking at more siege weapons.
- You have a SoD sitting in Mainz - I assume you're about to use it!
- Specialise your cities more - you have a lot of commerce-heavy cities producing units, cottaged cities running specialists, etc. You're in Slavery and some cities have rampant unhappiness but no Forge (+2) or Theatre.
- After Vienna - take Aachen ... Buddhism has 25% spread + The Mahabodhi and The Great Lighthouse. This is a massive short-term target.
- Spread Buddhism in your cities. Only 8 of 14 have it - if you're going to run a religion, make it count!
Forge on!
[Edit Below]
Further to the above - I agree with Mr. Felony and Xanadux re. getting a Spy out to do some exploration. So - seige weapons, Buddhist Missionaries, at least one Spy, and as noted below - some buildings are all presenting themselves as advantageous!
I felt it might be of interest to run through some of the key cities and make a few observations in light of the earlier references to city specialisation.
Rome:
Clearly enduring significant war weariness this city is ripe for a whip. It's got a Forum and the National Epic, and despite the Gold Mine has three Food resources, presenting itself as an ideal
Farm.Following a big whip - possibly to finish a partially built Forge?, look at Farming the Grasslands south east of the Lake, and running Specialists. Unhappiness can also be addressed by moving units there from Antium (Hereditary Rule).
Antium
A big production centre in waiting, but the city's stagnated and is running two Specialist Scientists. Food will be a problem for this city as chain irrigating to it is unfeasible, but at least consider Windmills on the Grassland Hills and a Cottage on the Grasslands just to grow the population and get some value from the currently unworked tiles. As a production centre, it needs a Forge.
Nova Roma
Even without Bureaucracy, your capital finds itself in a mixed role as being both your top Science Centre as well as your best Unit Pump - that is, it hasn't specialised one way or the other and is prospectively missing the benefit of a more defined focus. Some key buildings are missing here.
Pisae and Scipae
Two cities that have strong commercial leanings with Riverside Towns.
Pisae will pop your next
being a Great Scientist, which I would consider for an Academy there - the value of settling vs. lightbulbing vs. academies will be debated ad nausium, but this city strikes me as a good spot for an Academy. After popping the Great Person, work the Plains Cottage and the Grasslands Mine to build commercial buildings. I'd forget the Barracks and go after the Forum.Scipae also presents itself as a good commercial city, but needs to look at its food haul. Farms and Windmills, and lose the Specialist Scientist to support the Cottaged Plains.
Ravenna and Cumae
Here are some unit pumps to balance Pisae's and Scipae's commercial focus.
I'd have Ravenna focus on
and - albeit disappointing to have a Gold Mine in waiting - and dedicate it to a unit-pump city. Farm the Grasslands adjacent to the Lake, and the one to its south. Its size possibly warrants a Courthouse. Again, unhappy citizens can be whipped away, and again a Forge strikes me as a good option, with Barracks and Stables to follow.Cumae with
and is another good production spot - but its Specialists are robbing it of growth and aren't going to pop a anytime soon. Windmills may be the go on those two Riverside Grassland Hills.Other thoughts;
Irrigate towards Florence in the west.
Maoi Statues in Mediolanium or Arretium would seem to be worthwhile with a lot of coastal tiles.
There are a couple of reasonable city sites within your core empire as you've founded cities quite far apart. I'd consider putting a city three tiles north of Cumae to work the Copper supported by (Farmable) Floodplains and Grassland. There's a Fish-Copper-Fur site south of Antium that could be worth considering too.
Hope this is of help.
(Xanadux - no Optics yet, no Open Borders with Babylon).
A couple things that would help ...
You can build caravels, but haven't sailed across the seas for the circumnavigation bonus and to meet other AIs, nor have you scouted out at least the shoreline of your own continent.
You should have built a spy and scouted out your continent and the HRE by now. You can get a good idea of exactly how many troops HRE has, and how many you might need to take the capital.
My preferred invasion method in a situation like this is ... build 5 or 6 galleons, have a couple spies in HRE capital, declare war and drop troops next to capital. Next turn, drop defenses with spy and take city. He will have only 1 turn to bring reinforcements, and you will take his best city. If feasible, taking the capital first is greatly preferred.
You can build caravels, but haven't sailed across the seas for the circumnavigation bonus and to meet other AIs, nor have you scouted out at least the shoreline of your own continent.
You should have built a spy and scouted out your continent and the HRE by now. You can get a good idea of exactly how many troops HRE has, and how many you might need to take the capital.
My preferred invasion method in a situation like this is ... build 5 or 6 galleons, have a couple spies in HRE capital, declare war and drop troops next to capital. Next turn, drop defenses with spy and take city. He will have only 1 turn to bring reinforcements, and you will take his best city. If feasible, taking the capital first is greatly preferred.
Thanks alot Cam, those will help alot, but a question about the scientists - I need to run them, My research isn't very good right now since I have no money due to war, how can it be helped?
Edit - That stack is mostly Knights, and Vienna is full to the brim of War Elephants and Landsknecht.
Edit - That stack is mostly Knights, and Vienna is full to the brim of War Elephants and Landsknecht.
Ontave,
Yeah - I was concerned about that big bank balance he had and one turn for Engineering. I played your game for a couple of turns, and was able to take Vienna with Knights and Crossbows before he was able to defend it with a Landsknecht by moving the Knights on that turn. Settling for peace also got me a much needed World Map (it wasn't a great map, but a huge improvement on what Rome had).
To address your question though; Siege weaponry and notably Trebuchets should form part of your mixed SoDs if you find yourself in a similar situation. Having Gunpowder was an advantage too, as technologically backward tribes have no counter to the 'somewhat wimpy on face value' Musketmen.
On research, you should be fine if you specialise more, and focus four or five cities on commerce. You have a big 700+
bank balance that you can leverage.
Best of luck!
Yeah - I was concerned about that big bank balance he had and one turn for Engineering. I played your game for a couple of turns, and was able to take Vienna with Knights and Crossbows before he was able to defend it with a Landsknecht by moving the Knights on that turn. Settling for peace also got me a much needed World Map (it wasn't a great map, but a huge improvement on what Rome had).
To address your question though; Siege weaponry and notably Trebuchets should form part of your mixed SoDs if you find yourself in a similar situation. Having Gunpowder was an advantage too, as technologically backward tribes have no counter to the 'somewhat wimpy on face value' Musketmen.
On research, you should be fine if you specialise more, and focus four or five cities on commerce. You have a big 700+
bank balance that you can leverage.Best of luck!
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