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Water Purifier (Bug Thread)

Discussion in 'Civ4 Fallout: Tame The Waste (FTTW)' started by Lib.Spi't, Jan 22, 2015.

  1. Lib.Spi't

    Lib.Spi't Overlord of the Wasteland

    Joined:
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    3,708
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    Post Bug Reports Here:

    Known Issues:

    HUD Graphics for Era Change update only on reload.
    TXT_KEY_BUG_HINT_INTERFACE_1 ?!? add this... whatever this is...
    City Screen Bug: hovering the mouse over the hammer production (left of the production bar at the top of the screen) causes the game to crash. (maybe a one off glitch.)
    I was still paying city maintenance during "We Love The Prime Minister Day".
    Ghoul Farms say they're supposed to give +4 health; they don't. Also, the mod will let you buy them on terrain features other than Rad Waste, it just won't let you build them.
    The domestic advisor won't organize cities in order built.
    A Workshop costs 1480 hammers but a (V) Tool Shop is only 90. (Fixed Ready for patch)
    Process TXT key issues (investigate, probably a typo) (Fixed Ready for patch) It was GOLD Instead of WEALTH
    I can't seem to capture/destroy barbarian cities, even with post Conquest units.
    Cannot find EVENTRIGGER_PARTISANS (started to fix this, I still need to work out if parts of it, particularly the python element, need adjusting to work with FTTW)
    Some kind of bug involving the AI no longer wanting to research, it just no longer chooses techs every now and then..
    TXT_VASSALAGE_HELP
    Scavenger Camp make more gold than upgraded version. (cirrection, certain civics provide a gold bonus only to scav camps.)
    Promotions seem to be broken, missing many of the old choices on many units, further investigation required...
    Look into farm art issues.
    Possible issue with a religion (in the known case NCR) founding with the research of state capitals, rather than with the construction of a state capital.

    If you experience a bug or crash, please attach a saved game so I can try to collect and isolate the source of the error.
     
  2. Randomness

    Randomness ...

    Joined:
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    I downloaded the alpha and I noticed two things

    1. My units can't leave my city. I know they aren't supposed to be able to leave your borders, but they can't even move within my borders. This makes it somewhat difficult to improve my land...

    2. When I built my city it didn't become my capital. Is this intentional? It does make sense with the whole capital victory thing.

    EDIT:
    After playing around in the 2249 scenario, it seems that I can't change civics either.

    Despite my rather slow start, it's always exciting to see progress being made.
     
  3. Lib.Spi't

    Lib.Spi't Overlord of the Wasteland

    Joined:
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    the scenario doesn't work, or is horrifically unbalanced. (Not currently supported)

    Can you post a save game with your civics issue? We were having some problems with that but we thought they wre fixed.

    It should become your capital, it should have a 'capital grounds' inside... hmmm I will check that, I didn't notice it, but I may have been blindly assuming it.

    I checked the Unit Border code and it worked fine for me.. the units could not leave the border, but they could move inside.. I will double check to see if it was graphically working but not actually working in the latest build...

    Thanks for the feedback!

    EDIT:
    I checked the unit movement, and they could move fine in my borders...

    Founded both vault and non-vault factions, both founded capitals..

    I was also able to change civics...

    What did you do to my beautiful game RANDOM!!!!! :ar15:
     
  4. Randomness

    Randomness ...

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    I'm redownloading to see if it fixes the inabillity to move.

    EDIT:
    Fresh download, everything seems to be working so far.
     
  5. Lib.Spi't

    Lib.Spi't Overlord of the Wasteland

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  6. Lib.Spi't

    Lib.Spi't Overlord of the Wasteland

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    Turn Hang Bug.

    In 2 turns from this save, checking to see if it is repeatable now

    EDIT: seems to be repeatable.

    It does not seem to be realted to any decisions I make either. For example it happens whether I accept the NCRs world map or not.
     

    Attached Files:

  7. clanky4

    clanky4 Emperor

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    The Upgrade Tree appears to show the tech tree.

    Spoiler :
    I noticed I complain a lot.
     
  8. Lib.Spi't

    Lib.Spi't Overlord of the Wasteland

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    :goodjob:

    There is a drop down box in the top left corner that allows you to change between 'trees'. There are several trees to look at. Several Pedia screens have the same drop down box that's used for actions such as sorting.

    It really needs a more catch all title, like......... (Catch all Title) Trees.........Yeah..... that would work.

    With all the xml and art work you have done for the mod, you have earned the right to complain. Doesn't mean I will agree, you know because.. I am basically amazing at everything.... But I will let you complain about it, then calmly explain why you are wrong! :sniper:.......................[pissed]

    The key to complaining at me is giving reasons and evidence. The shorter the complaint, the more annoying it is to me. If I have to ask why, I won't be listening all that hard to the complaint.

    Information and details are what will help me make the game better, just saying "I don't like it" will lead me to just simply ignore it.

    Unless you can state a good reason for me to put my energy into changing it, or you put energy into suggesting a solid and 'largely complete' alternative, or start a good debate between multiple potential options, I won't bother putting my energy into listening :D.
     
  9. Lark

    Lark Warlord

    Joined:
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    131
    Partway through a game with the patch:
    On Custom Continents (large map, six continents), about half the maps had two civs starting in the same tile.

    Ghoul Farms say they're supposed to give +4 health; they don't. Also, the mod will let you buy them on terrain features other than Rad Waste, it just won't let you build them.

    Turn 247: The Barbarians show up. I went into World Builder and put stacks of the strongest unit I can build (Town Watch) next to the closest three. Results:
    -versus Militia on forest: 8 Town Watch units lost (the 9th killed it)
    -versus Securitron Mk I on forest: 9 lost
    -versus Securitron on forest hill: 10 lost
    So trying to keep my lands clear would be pointless. This essentially requires the following style of play:
    1.) Put big stacks in your cities and hope the Barbs kill themselves attacking.
    2.) Never build Workers, improvements or wealth - only buildings, defensive units and research - until you have better units than they do.
    3.) Hope like hell they don't tech up faster than you do, so that a point comes where you can make better units than theirs. Also, pray that they never get stack-attack units.
    I don't like to play that way, so I'm just going to WB them. I would have been willing to try if I hadn't already sacrificed to build improvements.

    Also, only I and the Families have built a second city. The Enclave and Tribes (and probably others - I haven't looked in the WB much) were building Settlers but switched out, possibly because the Barbs showed up. T267: NCR has two, too.

    Turn 267: Raiders and Slavers destroyed. Oops! - I'd forgotten to WB for everybody else, too. So I reload and it turns out that only the Families and NCR had units left, and they were within a few turns of destruction. I gave everybody one Metal Armored Fighter and one MA Soldier (non-cc), so I can go back to ignoring them.


    Without the patch, inflation passes 50% of expenses before you get halfway throught the Classical tech era. With it...


    Some minor bugs from my first, unpatched, run-through:

    I was still paying city maintenance during "We Love The Prime Minister Day".

    The domestic advisor won't organize cities in order built.

    Military units auto-fortify instead of reporting for orders when built.

    Nobody else built cities. Two possible reasons: 1.) starting too close to an enemy capital means there's no safe place to build, 2.) the barbs are too strong too early.
     
  10. Lib.Spi't

    Lib.Spi't Overlord of the Wasteland

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    Hey lark,
    thanks for the feedback.

    let's see if we can work through some of these.

    I only use Pangeae as a map script, eventually I want to make a proper custom map script. At one point i had disabled all other map scripts but I can't remember how I did it.

    The game is designed to play on a single continent like the US. You won't ever meet the other factions otherwise, and there are no boats.

    Try playing a huge Pangaea and you should get a better game experience (but the map script is still not functioning perfectly)
    I have witnessed on occasion it putting one or more civs too close together and 1 or more of them being unable to found their capital because of this. (This is all still WIP)
    I usually start a game, run the first turn, then quickly WB the map to see if everyone has clustered 'nicely' then restart if there are any major issues (like one having no place to start or the pangaea map being so crap that it made 2/3rds of the screen water...)

    Hmm the ghoul farms sounds like a bug in both instances...not sure what is wrong with it I will add it to the front post. By buy, do you mean that you can give the order and spend the money, but the workers just don't build it? This was an idea I added in quickly long ago, as a test method for making ghouls play well in radiation. The idea was that the health bonus would cancel out the negativs from fallout and rad wastes (flood plains) which both had (and should still have) health negatives.

    Barbs:
    I am still learning exactly how barbs work, and how to balance them effectively.

    I removed some of the toughest units from the roster specifically for the reasons you stated.

    In my prepatch game, the barbs stayed out of my territory, but started to invade just after I had the tech to be able to face off with them, everyone else had lagged behind and were doomed.

    I am still working on fiddling with everything to do with barbs to get them just right, so that the wasteland is a terrifying place, but not to the point that is consumes everyone.

    I think one solution might be making barb versions of various units, that appear later in the tech tree when you are more capable of dealing with them, as a lot of units that are unlocked early by tech, but are hard to get because of requirements, are auto spawned for the barbs who don't have the requirement issues.

    Expansion:
    I have noticed some of the same issues with expansion, I am struggling to work out exactly what the issue is. I have watched the ai play, and observed some strange behaviour where it builds a settler, sends it out, sees a monster, runs away, repeats several times, then either gets killed or disbanded..(I can't tell which)

    It seems to make odd unit build choices (picking weaker units to build when it has better ones it can build) this might be based on AI weights or something, I need to figure that out.

    The AI does expand, in my last test game my ai played empire got 4 or 5 cities, though others still only had one, though I am sure they could have done better if they had built the right units and expanded in a 'smarter' way. I need to look into how k-mod makes it's decisions and maybe toughen them up a bit to take advantage of the new gameplay mechanics.

    I think a big part of it is:
    1: barb are much nastier than standard civ, and the ai just doesn't know how it is supposed to deal with it, and just kind of gives up.
    2: The AI doesn't assign adequate protection to a settler stack (like it is hard coded to take only 1 or 2 defenders) so when it gets to it's borders and 'peeks out' it just can't handle what it sees and runs away. Then after repeating this process a few times it decides that there is nowhere new to build and deletes it's settlers before trying and failing again later.

    I am still trying to figure out inflation, it is definately out of control most of the time I just have to figure out all the places I can 'tweak it' and if we cannot tweak it right, look to change the mechanic and math of the system to get it right.

    In my pre-patch game I was getting about 1000 gold per turn easy by the renaissance era, I am not sure how it is playing out right now. It was definately much harder to stay out of the red when I watched my AI try and play.

    Let me know if that 'we love' issue is still occuring after the patch, I will se if I can get to a point where I experience it too, we may have broke something a long the way.

    I rarely ue the DA screen so I shall add this to the list and see if we can find out why.

    The auto fortify is a game option, you can switch it off in the option menu. (this was added a while back I should have made it 'off' by default)
     
  11. Lark

    Lark Warlord

    Joined:
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    Messages:
    131
    1.) Some game notes. I tried giving everybody a Great Prophet/Politician every 50 turns to see if that would let the civs keep up with building. It felt almost right for improvements - you could actually make one every so often - but by the end I was at 0% research and still falling behind. I played at Warlord difficulty, I spammed Gardens, I rerolled for a few more Scavenger Camp events ...I couldn't keep up. Of course, all that made for more research, too.
    (Also, * = 3 small bugs.)
    Spoiler :
    A5P1, Large Pangaea, Normal speed, Warlord difficulty, Brotherhood.
    Turn 1: I give everybody a Metal Armor Town Guard, a Metal Armored Fighter and a Great Profitician. Enclave, Tribes and Mutants are jammed together in the Northwest Paradise, but everybody else can expand easily. I give Enclave and Mutants a nearby Vault to make another city in.
    051: I give everybody (that includes myself) a Great Profligate.
    *073: A Workshop costs 1480 hammers but a (V) Tool Shop is only 90.
    101: IgeaGP. Bottle Caps! Coasting along in third place.
    120: Wealth! Mariposa is making Suicide Mutants, the rest usually buildings.
    131: Brahmin Woods. (Making sure I grab the site before Ironhead can.)
    *137: Both F1 & F10 say I'm paying maintenance during a "We Love...Day".
    141: I killed him AND ate him (presumably better than -happy & -food?).
    151: In 50 turns I've come: 3->1 in score, 3->2 in tech, 5->2 in top cities.
    Partly Warlord, partly ScavCamp events & tech trades to pay the +health option.
    153: IgeaGP. (Forgot it two turns ago but remembered when I got a GPP GP.)
    161: Refuge! _And_ a Great Popsicle for being first! Nyaah, Enclave!
    169: Scientific Study! I turn research down to 50%. NCR has two cities, too.
    191: For Tribes, "gather supplies from a ruined city" is teal in the event log.
    193: Freeport Bunker. NCR & I have 3 cities, everybody else 2 except Raiders (Settler sitting in capital) and Mutants. I give Mutants a Settler.
    '194: To get a Town Watch to my third city, I have to WB-teleport it. Instead of giving garrison units an inability to move outside of their territory, consider making them unable to either get defensive bonuses or attack there.
    199: I discover I need a Sheriff. *%^#* Ironhead, I helped you! And that Sheriffs need 2 moves, like Thieves. I'd better line up some Spies, too.
    201: IgeaGP. #1 in tech, #2 in size, #6 in safety. Ghouls have city #3, Mutants #2. Raiders' Settler disappeared so I give them one.
    209: Lark gets luckier: a Scavenger Camp from an event pops Pre-War Tech.
    215: Argh! Dry County pushes in Brahmin Woods's borders; it loses 3 good tiles. -Tiles that are closer to BW, so it should get them back eventually.
    216: Macomb Complex. BoS 4 cities, NWP trio 2, others 3 except Raiders 1.
    217: Marie, Curie, builds me, an Academy. I'm rhymin', Simon.
    228: Trade Caravans. Research 0% while I build roads. (236: Not Paths.)
    *236: Traditionally, <R> tells your worker to build the best <R> it can.
    238: Quincy Site. On the other side, BW has its Corn and Scav Camp back.
    What the heck's happened to Enclave? -They dropped from 2nd/3rd to 6th.
    251: IgeaGP. #2 in safety. Gave last-place Mutants & Raiders a Settler.

    Man, Warlord difficulty hasn't any invaders at _all_ if you turn Raging off.
    My score 1201, Bishop 586, ... ehh, I guess I'm done.

    *Plus one I forgot: the new wealth builds show TXT_KEY_...

    One last thing: 2/3 of the map to my east was empty, the 1/3 to my west had all the other civs. I had already won by map placement. If I had been one of the three civs jammed together on the peninsula, I would have lost. I like the idea of letting partner civs start close together, and even this way could work if they start in the center with room on all sides, but the current implementation often fails.


    2.) Will there be another patch soon? I don't want to play this set-up again. I was thinking about playing around with balance - I've found the files with the improvement and building costs - but I'd rather work from a more-sensible start.

    3.) I have a theory about why this mod's balance keeps going awry - besides a certain person changing things just to see what happens:) - and a sort of bull-session list of things that might be done / should not be done to hold it together, but it seems pointless if I can't derive some practical advice from it. So I expect I'll think some more, fiddle around a bit, and then give up on it. Should I post it somewhere when that happens?
     
  12. Lib.Spi't

    Lib.Spi't Overlord of the Wasteland

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  13. demon59

    demon59 Chieftain

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    Hi, all! First, I've never played any of the Fallout games, but I'm really enjoying this mod. I've started several games (finished none, still learning how to not be hopelessly outnumbered/outgunned when the barbs start swarming in around turn 200+) and in almost all I have had at least one city that would expand its borders to a fat cross or larger, then seem to simply lose its accumulated safety/culture and have its borders shrink (all the way down to a single square in the last game I played). Is this a bug, or a feature of gameplay that I simply haven't seen explained, yet? Thanks for all the effort going into this mod. Was always a fan of Fury Road, so I'm happy to see another "post-apocalypse" mod being worked on. :goodjob:
     
  14. Lib.Spi't

    Lib.Spi't Overlord of the Wasteland

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    Hmm.... That culture problem does sound like a bug, I certainly haven't intentionally made it so...

    was someone else pushing your borders back, or did it literally lose all of its culture?

    Were you a Vault civ (Enclave, Mutant, BoS) Vs a Non Vault Civ?

    What sort of turn time did this start happening at? what era? What game speed?

    I can't think of any reason why this would happen.. if you have some saves with it happening, they might be helpful too.
     
  15. demon59

    demon59 Chieftain

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    I was playing as the Enclave, there were other civs near, but not adjacent, so it wasn't culture take-over. The last game, one city went from a fat cross to square borders, held there for several turns, then dropped to the single city tile. Game settings were Pangaea, large and huge maps, normal speed, Noble difficulty. I had at least 3 cities, at fat cross size or above, each time it happened. Don't remember exact turn #, but 150 or over. Sorry, no save, but I'll post one next time it happens.

    A bit off topic, but you might check out the Final Frontier Plus sub-forum. They did a lot of adjusting to their barbarian spawning, so some of their discussion might save you a bit of trial and error.
     
  16. Lib.Spi't

    Lib.Spi't Overlord of the Wasteland

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    hmmm never experienced anything like this...

    You sure they didn't revolt or something... maybe!?!?
     
  17. demon59

    demon59 Chieftain

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    I don't think so. The city didn't flip to another civ or barb control, and IIRC it kept building, it just wasn't producing culture, and seemed to have lost all that it had before. It has popped up several times, so I should be able to get a saved game for you, soon. I'll reset my autosave to every turn, so I can send you the one right before it happens.
     
  18. Lib.Spi't

    Lib.Spi't Overlord of the Wasteland

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    Cheers, I really don't know what the problem could be, I haven't seen it myself, but I also haven't done much tsting, so your work is appreciated!
     
  19. eph

    eph Chieftain

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    I just encountered the "dynamic trait hover flag" bug in the 5.1 Alpha version in week 34 while playing Caesar after getting the traits (C11)Chieftain;(C21)Gang;(C31)Survivalism;(C41)Barter;(C51)Scavenging. The hover crash happens no matter if I hover in the turn I get the traits or in turns afterwards.

    Here's what the error report says:

    AppName: civ4beyondsword.exe AppVer: 3.1.9.0 ModName: msvcr71.dll
    ModVer: 7.10.3052.4 Offset: 0002cf20
     
  20. Lib.Spi't

    Lib.Spi't Overlord of the Wasteland

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    Right... that means nothing to me! :D

    I think this is related to the Cheiftain trait using something that is not currently working right (or it could be something to do with pillaging effects from traits as these don't display right on the flag or anywhere else.

    I will do some experimenting over the next couple of days, see if I can get the crash on my second computer version and see if any of the theories I have prove to be effective.

    Thanks for confirming it is still a problem.

    I am still clueless as to why my main build on my main computer does not crash.....It makes no sense!!

    One thing you could look at for me.

    Play as the Raiders and Slavers and then check the Flag bug and tell me if it crashes right away. they have the 'pillage' tag active as well in their trait...

    If the flag doesn't crash when using raiders, then try using this file I attached. Then see if it crashes when you reach the 5 trait gain moment again.

    It goes here:
    Mods\Fallout-TTW\Assets\Xml\Civilizations
    Cheers
     

    Attached Files:

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