We shouldn't expect all the "major" European civs to get modern era representation, and that's okay.

[Luxerne]

After the reveal last week that Spain is an exploration era civ, there's been people on social media talking about how it should've been Castile or some other "predecessor" which can then lead to a modern era Spain, as people seem to take particular concern that the base game route for Spain might be to become Mexico or France in the modern era.

The thing is, we really shouldn't have ever expected that all the "major" European civilizations would have unambiguous representation in the modern era from the moment we first saw the (discussed and memed to death) Egypt > Songhai Abbasids > Buganda pathway. No, not even after all the DLCs and expansions are out. If there's seemingly no West African representation outside of Songhai, and potentially no southern/central African representation outside of Buganda—leaving entire regions of the world with civ vacuums for most of the game—I don't really see how people could realistically expect that the European "majors" would all get unequivocal, clear representation throughout the game—especially the base game. The attitude does come off as painfully Eurocentric when you juxtapose the confirmed and hinted European civs with other regions of the world, with the exceptions of India and China.

Realistically, we're still probably getting four or five European civs in the modern era—already about a third of the total civs, assuming there's somewhere between 12 and 15 civs. We know France and Britain/England are in, and we've seen Germany and Russia also hinted at via likely associated wonders. I wouldn't be surprised one bit if they throw in a fifth option like Italy or Austria-Hungary as well.

Ultimately, though, there's the game's design philosophy to consider. The whole point of making civs exclusive to one age is to depict those civs at their respective historical peaks. And, with Spain (and likely DLC/expansion civs such as Portugal or Poland), that peak just happened to fall in the game's exploration era, not the modern era. The Spanish are right where they belong.

 

[Mr Jon of Cheam]

I'm with you. Although, for the sake of flexibility, I still think they they should consider using Castile as the name for Exploration Age Spain.

One of my sincere hopes with this Age system is that it gives them a chance to include some interesting and lesser known civs from throughout world history, with equal representation across regions.

I'm also pleased that they appear to be using quite a broad definition of Modern, so we get Mughal and likely Ottomans in this Age, and it's not just packed full of present day nations.

 

[Kev1916]

For "historical peaks" then Britain should not be in the modern age.
The British empire the biggest and worst colonial super power in human history , there dark skill and might was unparalleled it totally makes them a shoe in for exploration "age".

They should switch into England or Scotland as a more modern nation

 

[Siptah]

The devs said that one of the benefits of the Ages system is that you have the major civs of an era and have them go head to head against each other. Thus, I think it is important to have the "major" European civs. I think we'll see these 4 which were great powers for most of the modern era in the base game: Britain, France, Germany/Prussia, Russia. For the rest, it depends a bit on the historical focus age-wise. Both Austria and Sweden have been great powers between 1600s and 1900s at some points. United Italy hasn't been of quite that importance, and non-united Italy was for centuries the playground of the major powers. Yet, as many seem to want it as a continuing of Rome, I think we might see it rather earlier than later. I hope that by the end of September, we'll have 5 or 6 out of these 7. But that's it for modern Europe imho for the first packages. I can see them adding some other civs later on: Commonwealth, modern Greece (same reasoning as Rome -> Italy), Belgium, Switzerland, etc. but I'd rather have more variety at first. 18 civs in modern era until September seem realistic, and it would be a shame if 10 of these would be European or Western post-colonial states/empires (America, Brazil, Australia), but I can see how it is easy to arrive there.

Imho it's great that some that had peaks earlier on appear in the 2nd Age, such as Spain, Netherlands, and Portugal. I would also place a hypothetical Bohemia and Burgundy there.

 

[Evolena]

The thing is, we really shouldn't have ever expected that all the "major" European civilizations would have unambiguous representation in the modern era

That. I understand that a lot of players want to be able to play as their own country, but can each current country really be considered as distinctive modern-era civilizations?

 

[Siptah]

each current country

As it seems, in these forums, there is the opinion that civ 7 stays away from current countries. We haven't seen any yet. The only one so far that you could take as a current country would be the undefined "America." Neither the French Empire, Britain/British Empire, the Mughals, Buganda, Qing, Meiji Japan, Siam nor America are current countries. I guess Mexico and Russia will be the ones that are actually named in the same way as current countries are referred to in daily parlance. They could still go for Russian Empire to avoid this though. The Mexican Empire should be avoided - I'm not sure whether any of the Mexican Republics make sense.

 

[Prester John 2]

I concur with the OP. I also guess that Spain likely won't get modern representation, but its colonial possessions will most likely: Mexico or Venezuela or Gran Colombia. I also guess that it will rather go Goths (AA) - Holy Roman Empire (EA) - Prussia (MA) instead of Germany. I hope for Hungary in the EA and Austria-Hungary in the ME.
As far as modern age representation of Europa goes I expect: Britain, France, Russia, Prussia, Austria-Hungary, Sweden, maybe the Netherlands at some point and that's pretty much it. And Ottomans, if you count them as European which they were.

 

[GIO888]

After a few run-thru's we'll all know the best "path" to our "modern" Civ of choice, won't we.

Might even be fun getting there!

 

[Krikkit1]

I would expect all the “major” modern European civs to be in at launch…
However, Spain is not a “major” modern European civ.
Basically the 3 that are permanently on the Security council (and the strongest 1 they beat to get there) are the only 4 I would call major modern ones.

 

[Evolena]

As it seems, in these forums, there is the opinion that civ 7 stays away from current countries

That's my opinion too and I'm perfectly fine with it, but I see a lot of people here and there who expect or hope for their current country, hence my comment.

 

[TheSpaceCowboy]

As it seems, in these forums, there is the opinion that civ 7 stays away from current countries. We haven't seen any yet. The only one so far that you could take as a current country would be the undefined "America." Neither the French Empire, Britain/British Empire, the Mughals, Buganda, Qing, Meiji Japan, Siam nor America are current countries. I guess Mexico and Russia will be the ones that are actually named in the same way as current countries are referred to in daily parlance. They could still go for Russian Empire to avoid this though. The Mexican Empire should be avoided - I'm not sure whether any of the Mexican Republics make sense.

What do you mean that America isn’t a current country? Do you have hard evidence that it’ll be an Exploration Age civ? I know that there’s been some speculation as to that due to Franklin coming before the date folks are ascribing to the Age cutoff, but I don’t think that such dates are hard and fast rules, nor do I think Leaders perfectly align with their associated civ with respect to the timeframe portrayed.

 

[Evolena]

America vs USA I would guess they meant.

 

[Siptah]

What do you mean that America isn’t a current country? Do you have hard evidence that it’ll be an Exploration Age civ? I know that there’s been some speculation as to that due to Franklin coming before the date folks are ascribing to the Age cutoff, but I don’t think that such dates are hard and fast rules, nor do I think Leaders perfectly align with their associated civ with respect to the timeframe portrayed.

America isn't a current country, as it's only a common abbreviation for the United States of America*, and not the name of a country. The civ called "America" is confirmed by screenshots for the Modern Age.

*And that also mostly inside the US itself. Otherwise (at least in my experience in Europe including the UK) America usually refers to the (half-)continent of North America, not just the US. But FXS being based in the US, they wouldn't take that view.

 

[Kev1916]

I would expect all the “major” modern European civs to be in at launch…
However, Spain is not a “major” modern European civ.
Basically the 3 that are permanently on the Security council (and the strongest 1 they beat to get there) are the only 4 I would call major modern ones.

So is the new Civ now a war game ? Spain is the largest country in southern europe and the 2nd largest in western Europe .

It's the 4th most visit country in the world to say they are not a major modern country based soley on there military spending is a tad disingenuous

 

[Krikkit1]

So is the new Civ now a war game ? Spain is the largest country in southern europe and the 2nd largest in western Europe .

It's the 4th most visit country in the world to say they are not a major modern country based soley on there military spending is a tad disingenuous

Currently Largest in Southern Europe, only second largest in Western Europe.

No Modern European country currently has enough land area for that to count as significant except for Russia.

The other 3 I mentioned had empires in the 1900s of over 10 million km2, and Germany has the largest economy in all of Europe, and the largest pop outside of Russia.

Spain is a far better representation of Exploration age Europe.

Modern Spain would probably get in once we have 25-30 civs in the modern Age (not unlikely as that would allow many people to play as their home country)

A Much better solution would be to allow players to keep their civs name.
So
Play Exploration Age Spain
Modern Age choose
Spain with French uniques (or change name to France)
OR
Spain with Mexican uniques (or change name to Mexico)

 

[Prester John 2]

So is the new Civ now a war game ? Spain is the largest country in southern europe and the 2nd largest in western Europe .

It's the 4th most visit country in the world to say they are not a major modern country based soley on there military spending is a tad disingenuous

Well it didn't play a big part in modern history from 1700 onwards compared to its neighbours like France, Britain or even the Netherlands. Most of the art (Velasquez, El Greco, Escorial) and thought (B. de Las Casa, Ignatius de Loyola, Cervantes) Spain is known for stems from the exploration age.

 

[Ordnael]

I expect all the major european civs to get modern era representation as that is sensible and akin to real life. It makes sense that Rome evolves to Italy, but it doesn't make sense that the Iberian peninsula evolves to Buganda!
If, not, I would appreciate if EU union civs would evolve to to a facsimile of European Union regions like exploration age Portugal and Spain/Castille would evolve into Iberian EU.

​

 

[Kyriakos]

I don't like this feature at all.
I mean, I am fine with Greece->Byzantine Empire (which is what, over 4/5 of the game's timeline?), but don't see the point in having a modern era with set civs; why are you playing the game then?

 

[E.C.H]

Half-Spaniard here for what that's worth, I find the people clamoring about Spain being an Exploration civ ridiculous. No one disputes the Golden Age of the Spanish polity was during it's colonial heyday in the age of Discovery, and to be frank, while modern day Spain may be doing broadly alright, the nation's 'Modern' history is pretty damn bad, a second Sick Man of Europe even, with huge stagnation and a terrible 20th century defined by war and dictatorship. Maybe you could fit in a Charles III Bourbon Spain, but it would overlap pretty heavily with Exploration Spain and besides, was kinda an anomalous upwards blip on a long downwards trend. I say let Spain be defined by it's peak of global power, not confusingly split with an awkwardly assembled positive interpretation of it's less good centuries.

 

[TheSpaceCowboy]

America isn't a current country, as it's only a common abbreviation for the United States of America*, and not the name of a country. The civ called "America" is confirmed by screenshots for the Modern Age.

*And that also mostly inside the US itself. Otherwise (at least in my experience in Europe including the UK) America usually refers to the (half-)continent of North America, not just the US. But FXS being based in the US, they wouldn't take that view.

That’s pointlessly pedantic. It’s equivalent to saying that Britain isn’t a country, since its official name is the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. We call our country America, and don’t much appreciate when foreigners apply the appellation of “Americans” to denizens of Canada, Mexico, or elsewhere