"We traded recently" diplomatic modifier - scalable?

[oddtail]

I have a question regarding the diplomatic system, specifically the bonus to relations for having traded recently. Would anyone happen to know if this is a fixed bonus, or is its value dependent on what/how was traded? Specifically, I wonder if giving the AI a better deal makes them like me more? Or is it irrelevant, as long as they accept the deal?

To give an example - say that I have spare Spices and Wine. I talk to Gandhi, and he has Gold to spare. I give him Spices for Gold, and he agrees. This will make him like me more.

What would happen if I voluntarily gave him more than he asks for? What if I gave him Spices AND Wine for Gold? What if I gave him Spices for free without him prompting me to do so? And if the modifiers may vary, what are the points where it's beneficial diplomatically to give slightly more, i.e. thresholds above which the modifiers are significant?

I'm asking because a) AI usually acknowledges an offer that they consider "generous", and b) I'm considering playing as Netherlands specifically for the good relations that selling my luxury resources would provide. And I obviously don't want to give a lot away if an equal trade would give the same exact benefit.

 

[SalemSage]

Don't quote me on this, but I THINK there are different modifier strengths depending on how good the trade is in the AI's favour. I'm pretty sure I've seen "We have traded recently" in both light green and dark green. Light green is a strong positive diplomatic modifier, and dark green is a weak positive diplomatic modifier.

Someone else will need to come along and confirm this for me though.

 

[Peacemongerer]

I'm pretty sure it is. The modifier has shown-up in both bright green and dark green on my screen before and I'm pretty sure light green meens more powerful than dark green.

 

[Heinage]

I concur with the above 2 statements.

I have used trades for this exact purpose in all my games. If I want a fair trade for lux, I'll sell a lux for 7 gpt. If I want to promote better relations through a trade, I'll sell a lux for 5 gpt.
I've found that if they are friendly or neutral with you, these trades will work and give differing outcomes for diplo modifiers, namely good (or dark green) for the 7 gpt and better (light green) for the 5 gpt.
Sometimes if they're guarded and you're desperate to improve relations, you can even sell for 4 gpt.

Having said all this, I do wish that there was a more realistic/bartering trade system in civ. I don't like knowing exactly how much I can sell resources, open Borders, embassies for. Etc

 

[RealHuhn]

Gifting stuff is probably the easiest way to get more DOFs with the AI.

In late game, you want to get those Research Agreements with as many civs as possible.

 

[dexters]

I have a question regarding the diplomatic system, specifically the bonus to relations for having traded recently. Would anyone happen to know if this is a fixed bonus, or is its value dependent on what/how was traded? Specifically, I wonder if giving the AI a better deal makes them like me more? Or is it irrelevant, as long as they accept the deal?

Correct, This modifier is a bit of a misnomer. It actually refers to when the AI doesn't pay full price for what they want and should say 'you gave us a good deal'

1) ie: paying less for luxuries /resources
2) getting something free
3) when you demand less from them than they are willing to give up at the peace table usually after they capitulate to you and you decide to take fewer cities etc.

Easy way to test the 'we've traded recently' modifier is to check AI's opinion modifiers towards you. Ensure the 'we've traded recently modifer' isn't there. give the AI something for free. Go back to talk to them again and it should show up.

'We've traded recently' was added fairly recently - in the patch that came out in the fall of 2011 , in the XML it is called Opinion_Weight_Trade_Max and caps at -30 (negative a is good modifier)
and probably decays over time. (decay mechanics isn't well understood just looking at the XML)

Other modifiers to put this into context

• Liberated City -40
• Common Foes -50
• Assist -30 (unsure what this is, I assume this is when they ask for freebies)
• Liberated Capital -80
• Resurrected -200 (new - added in the most recent patch and for GnK)

Note that some of these stack together. If you capture a city and bring back a civ from the dead, they should be very happy with you now -240 (-200 + -40)

 

[headcase]

Resurrected -200 (new - added in the most recent patch and for GnK)

Sweet.