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WE WANT OUR MONEY BACK, or else....

Discussion in 'Civ3 - Multiplayer & PBEM' started by Maximus72, Nov 8, 2002.

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  1. Maximus72

    Maximus72 Chieftain

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    we will seek legal action against the publisher of this game. It is a non-working product and I am sure some law firms would love to get their hands on a case like this. Please sign ur screen name here to see how many people would be interested in taking the publisher to court if they dont get their money back. I like the Pizza Hut logo. It goes something like this... "It is right or it is free".
     
  2. Maximus72

    Maximus72 Chieftain

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    By the way, for those of u who don't know, it is called CLASS ACTION, where we would all get out money back and the law firm could make 10 or 20% of total sales of all copies being sold... this could be a huge amount of money.
     
  3. Maxskillz

    Maxskillz Chieftain

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    Hey,

    I sort of agree with what you're saying that the condition this game was released in almost borders on being flat-out insulting to the customers. Especially the multiplayer implementation; it's simply horrendous and unprofessional.

    But before I'd consider joining any such class action lawsuit which I believe is almost justified... I am going to wait for them to release the patch they promised is in the works at a recent chat that will address the lag issues.

    Since firaxis has patched up the game pretty well in the past I am willing to give them the benefit of the doubt and wait for this upcoming patch... but after that if it is still unplayable :/ hmm I just don't even want to imagine that.

    max
     
  4. Plexus

    Plexus Architeuthidae puericomedentis

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    This is totally unreasonable, you guys just do not understand the software industry. I agree that this game is sub-par (very). Just give Firaxis some time to redeem themselves and I'm sure they'll live up to their reputation.
     
  5. Maximus72

    Maximus72 Chieftain

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    Ok. I agree. We should give them the chance to fix up the game within reasonable amount of time. Not only hotseat and email and Lan, but it should work well with modem. If it does not, then I think we would be entitled to our money back. I dont care if software industry gets has gotten away with screwing kids before. Someone, somewhere at some point of time has to change the rules of the game. Software companies should not be able to screw people like this. Clearly, this product has aggrevated a lot of people like me. We are not gonna sit here like a duck and let them screw us, the consumers. Firaxis, Infograms, or any other company, software business or any other business , will go down if they screw consumers. Their patch better fix this mess up.
     
  6. Four Four Seven

    Four Four Seven Spearman

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    Class action suit? Maximus, if you're not satisfied, I'm sure you could write a letter to Firaxis demanding your $$$ back, and I bet they'd probably comply. Have you tried that first?

    I'm just glad I didn't rush out and buy PTW like I first planned to do. It's a shame they couldn't figure this out, even with an extra year... :)

    Everyone here has learned one lesson - don't buy a game (ANY game) until you get a chance to read some reviews...
     
  7. stalin006

    stalin006 Deity

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    one question........other than civ 3 and the horrid PTW, waht otehr games do they have out there? quality games?
     
  8. W.i.n.t.e.r

    W.i.n.t.e.r Frozen!

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  9. Good69Charlotte

    Good69Charlotte Chieftain

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    Really the most i can say to this is stop crying. The hot seat and pbem is pretty good, with the addition of 8 new civs pretty much justifies me paying $30, but maybe thats just me. Just wait for the multiplayer to get a little time to develop. I'd also like to ask another question, you didnt think the multiplayer wasnt going to be buggy in the begining did you? It's almost common sense, seeing how buggy the regular Civ 3 was when it was released...
     
  10. warpstorm

    warpstorm Yumbo? Yumbo!

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    Class action wouldn't work if you installed it. You then become subject to the EULA (you did read it before you hit 'I Accept' didn't you). This is a binding contract between you and Infogrames.

    Interesting tidbit, there is a 90 day grace period for them to make it right or you can return it to them.

    There is a later section that explicitly says that you agree not to sue them.

     
  11. Cartouche Bee

    Cartouche Bee Appropriations Consultant

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    Oh, so that's why they had a patch from the first day, it voids your warranty. :lol:

    I love interpetations, of loop holed legal clauses.

    No one would need to do a class action suit unless they did not honor the warranty, une masse.
     
  12. Dantius

    Dantius Chieftain

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    Well, it seems warpstorm is an intelligent Civilization fan out there that reads the legal paperwork you agree to upon installing.

    Maximus, your case is bunk until 90 days are up. You just made yourself look really stupid, as well, with your "I'M GOING TO SUE" proclaimation without any research to back it up, something I would expect from a second grader being teased in school.

    If you want to sue over $30, than fine. But obviously, your not smart enough or probably even mature enough to be your own lawyer, and hiring one would only lose you more money than you could ever hope of gaining from this. Why not just accept that Infogrames is working hard to get us patched and stop whining about the game? Hey, you agreed to the terms, you "legal master".
     
  13. Maximus72

    Maximus72 Chieftain

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    I recently read about a man who lost over 100,000 (all his life savings) in a casino over a period of couple of years. The casino gave him credit to play and apparently he got addicted to gambling and lost all his money. I am sure when he got the credit, he signed the paperwork that if he loses money, he cannot sue them. However, he ended up taking them to court, and his argument was that they knew he was getting addicted to the gambling and had lost control, but did nothing to stop him. Even though the casino made him sign all those legal documents to cover their butts, they ended up settling the case.
    DANTIUS, maybe you think you are really smart paying 30 bucks for a game that doesn't do what it is supposed to do. And if you did not buy the game then what are you doing in the PTW forums anyway? Are you here to defend the publisher? And you claim I am stupid; at least I am smart enough to know I can do better things with 30 bucks than throw it away, maybe I can give it to charity. I am not a lawyer, but I think there is a strong evidence here to show that the publisher of this game knowingly pushed out a game that was not functional at the time of release. They should have known that most people who buy PTW are going to play via internet and not lan based. A good lawyer can prove this, no matter how much crap they make you sign when you install the game.
    I am willing to wait my 90 days to see if they make this game work, cuz I have played Civ 1, Civ2, and Civ 3 games for many hours and I loved those games.
    My advice to you, Danitus, is to read the reviews on PTW on the internet or simply go to the multiplayer lobby and see how everyone is pissed. You sure sound like you are cheerful that nobody can touch the publisher becuz they made us accept a legal document. You wouldn't happen to work for the publisher would you?
    And Dantius, you are so smart, you should know that you dont need to pay a lawyer in a class action lawsuit. They will make their money off the company. I guess you have never been involved in one, but I have. So I can tell you that you dont pay the lawyer anything upfront. They make a percentage. And by the way, Dantius, I hope you dont assume you know people the way you think you know me in real life. Maybe I can afford a lawyer and maybe I am mature. You can never be too sure.
     
  14. jpowers

    jpowers Emperor

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    I suppose if people who are stupid enough to buy cigarettes can sue tobacco companies and people who are stupid enough to buy fast food can sue McDonald's, then people who are stupid enough to buy the first release of an Internet-based multi-player game from a company that has no expertise in that area might as well sue. Unfortunately, I don't think a court or jury is going to have very much sympathy for computer geeks trying to get their $30 back.
     
  15. Shecky

    Shecky Chieftain

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    You mean compared to the nicotine addicts who got awarded millions, or even billions of dollars, by a jury, because they spent $5 buying a product that they knew was bad for them. Compared to them, us computer geeks who spent $30 for good, clean, working fun might as well be Mother Theresa.

    What is the name of the game? "Play the World - MULTIPLAYER" when you release a game that can't even do what the title says it should do, that sucks IMO. They might as well have put Ms Pacman in the box.

    This is just another example of a company putting the bottom line ahead of their customers. Shame on you infrogames, you should be tied and burned at the stake, you will never get another $ from me again!
     
  16. RobOz

    RobOz Whatchoo lookin at?

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    First of all, I want to say that the idea of suing them for $30 is ridiculous. The patch or patches will fix the problem(s).

    Second of all, it does say in t he EULA that you agree not to sue them, but in actuality that can't stop you from suing someone. There is no document that exists that prevents someone from suing you. The section about not suing them gives them leverage in the court, but doesn't prevent them from having to be in court to use that leverage.
     
  17. warpstorm

    warpstorm Yumbo? Yumbo!

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    They do say that they will give you your money back if it is not free from substantial errors or defects that will materially interfere with the operation of the Software as described in the Documentation within 90 days. Just follow the instructions to get your money back.
     
  18. PCHighway

    PCHighway Pacific Coast Highway

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    Warpstorm Speaks the truth, but for some reason I think Maximus72 wants more than his 30$.

    An maybe you never were in a Class Action Lawsuit, maybe you never played Civ1 or Civ2, maybe you are a PC gaming pirate, maybe your bluffing, and maybe you think you can cash off of what others think, with a strong backing of fellow NAMELESS Civ players. Well, I got news for you, Infogrames isn’t Pizza Hut;

    The Limitations of Liability
    INFOGRAMES INTERACTIVE AND ITS LICENSORS SHALL NOT BE LIABLE FOR SPECIAL, INCIDENTAL, CONSEQUENTIAL, EXEMPLARY OR OTHER INDIRECT DAMAGES, EVEN IF INFOGRAMES INTERACTIVE OR ITS LICENSORS ARE ADVISED OF OR AWARE OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES. IN NO EVENT SHALL INFOGRAMES INTERACTIVE'S AND ITS LICENSORS' AGGREGATE LIABILITY EXCEED THE PURCHASE PRICE OF THIS PACKAGE.


    And thats just a part of it, look in the back of you PtW manual, Sure, big companies get sued, but few loose, Did you here the guy who sued McDonald’s, and blamed them for him getting fat? He had to give reparations to McDonald’s, you don’t hear about the cases were they loose, and I assure you there are more of them, than the ones you mentioned.

    By the looks of it, you would most likely have to pay Firaxis for making them waste their time. Im not saying you don’t have a chance, and feel free to gamble money, Shecky brought up an interesting point, you could try saying they did Bait and Switch, but you would still loose. also, you practically admit that what your saying is false

    Well as for them Knowingly publish it, I already showed it didn’t matter. Also, the people about McDonald’s, they didn’t make her sign a agreement upon installing the game, or in that case, before ordering Coffee.

    Anyway, warpstorms right, And speaking of whom, Congrats for getting your terrain Into PtW:goodjob:! I did send a sort of mod in, though I guess they never put it in, I may have sent it to late though.
     
  19. Cartouche Bee

    Cartouche Bee Appropriations Consultant

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    Don't under estimate the cost of refunds by INFOGRAMES, given to those that make a legit claims within 90 days of their purchase. They have to refund the retail price, yet they only receive the wholesale price to begin with (less ditribution costs). This could under mine the entire profits of the release.
     
  20. Squirrel

    Squirrel Warlord

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    It is just so nice living in Europe. By the time the game arrives here, it will probably be patched. :)
     
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