Weak UAs

[Frosty_AUT]

What do you think are the weakest civs UA-wise right now, and what would you do about them?

Personally, I think France and Egypt are kinda disappointing. I mean, they are by no means new civs but the game has evolved while they remained unchanged.

Sure, France enjoys an early culture boost but I hate that it abruptly disappears with steam power. Doesn't really make sense to me. Not to mention, the whole +2 culture per city bonus is just unimaginative.

If I were to re-design France's UA, I would replace the culture bonus per city with the ability to unlock social policies one era sooner than normal. Piety from the start, Patronage in the classical age, rationalism in the medieval age and finally the rest upon entering renaissance. Also, founding/annexing cities as France would raise the culture cost for the next SP by less than normal.

As for Egypt, I like the wonder construction bonus and the burial tombs, but I feel that it isn't really enough. IMO Egypt should get 1 extra gold from floodplains (as it's said how the Nile was responsible for Egypt's wealth). This could give them a boost in the early game as war chariots, though not dependent on horses, are one of the less glorious examples of a UU.

 

[headcase]

Fine ideas.

Honestly I find some UAs should be simple, such as the simple +2 culture per city from France. Early SPs sounds like a great way to mix things up, but would rather see it in a new civ at leave France as is, or add another +1 culture per city if they need more oomph.

Egypt is kind of the same with their simple wonders bonus. but a little extra gold on flood plains would be fine with me as it doesn't highly change their overall strategy while giving them a little bonus when they're not building wonders.

 

[Gali]

Egypts Ua is pretty good at emperor and below, if they want to stengthen the civ they should look at war chariot. plus one movement rendered useless because you can't go into rough is laughable. they might not require horse and the fact that I don't know that and I love Egypt tells you how useful their UU is. Even if no horse required whats the point horse is almost everywhere. And chariot archer is just a dead end unit. Their UB is nice too, coming when happiness is still a problem. Weaker now that happiness late game is useless though.

 

[NicTeos]

Imho, the french UA is very powerful. With the early SP's you have enough advantage until their UA becomes obsolete.

 

[Aaron90495]

^ Agreed. I play multi against my friend a lot, and when he plays as France those early policies are really tough to overcome.

 

[Khadroth]

Imho, the french UA is very powerful. With the early SP's you have enough advantage until their UA becomes obsolete.

See I'm of the mind though that no UA should ever become obsolete. If it does, it's just poor design.

 

[Hambil]

Bodicca (sp?) - the one with +1/2 faith for undeveloped forest tiles. Waste of the text it took for the developers to type that in as a UA.

 

[Tokira]

Boudicca (sp?) - the one with +1/2 faith for undeveloped forest tiles. Waste of the text it took for the developers to type that in as a UA.

Given a good starting location, Boudicca gets a very good start for founding the first religion, which is a huge benefit in some circumstances. I'm not saying that it is powerful, just that it isn't completely useless.

For me the most useless UA might be the Dutch one. I never have enough happiness to even imagine selling the last pieces of my luxuries even if half of the happiness would remain. Another good candidates are America (I buy 0-3 tiles per game), Ethiopia (I'm usually the biggest civ), Germany (In 3/4 of my games I disable barbarians) and Spain (for some reason my games have very little amounts of natural wonders in them). My favourite UA award would go to Japan or to Austria.

 

[Dactyl]

I don't have a specific nominee for the worst UA, but I doubt that it's the Dutch. I like playing them the most, specifically because I can sell just about all the luxuries that I manage to develop without generating an undue amount in happiness. In the early game at King level, I far outstrip the AI civs in money.

 

[Dregor]

Given a good starting location, Boudicca gets a very good start for founding the first religion, which is a huge benefit in some circumstances. I'm not saying that it is powerful, just that it isn't completely useless.

For me the most useless UA might be the Dutch one. I never have enough happiness to even imagine selling the last pieces of my luxuries even if half of the happiness would remain. Another good candidates are America (I buy 0-3 tiles per game), Ethiopia (I'm usually the biggest civ), Germany (In 3/4 of my games I disable barbarians) and Spain (for some reason my games have very little amounts of natural wonders in them). My favourite UA award would go to Japan or to Austria.

In my current game I'm playing as Netherlands and I've used the UA to some success. I had the Commerce SP that gives 2 extra Happiness from luxuries, which seemed to remain in effect even after trading my last one away. I could be mistaken about that, but I believe I'm not.

 

[mabalogna]

Given a good starting location, Boudicca gets a very good start for founding the first religion, which is a huge benefit in some circumstances. I'm not saying that it is powerful, just that it isn't completely useless.

For me the most useless UA might be the Dutch one. I never have enough happiness to even imagine selling the last pieces of my luxuries even if half of the happiness would remain. Another good candidates are America (I buy 0-3 tiles per game), Ethiopia (I'm usually the biggest civ), Germany (In 3/4 of my games I disable barbarians) and Spain (for some reason my games have very little amounts of natural wonders in them). My favourite UA award would go to Japan or to Austria.

Dutch UA is not weak in the slightest - but apparently it takes some skill to use effectively since so many people seem to not understand how to use it right. Early gold is game breakingly good early on, so being able to sell off early luxuries without getting a huge happiness loss is very helpful. Also factor in the Commerce tree's +2 happiness per luxury and then a trade with a civ for a luxury you dont have for a luxuray you only have 1 of will aleast net you +4 happiness - essentially when any other civ trades away their last resource for another resource you break even and get 0 happiness - the dutch get +4 w/ commerce...very useful skill indeed.
And in my opinion, anyone who plays the dutch and don't go down the commerce tree are completely missing the point of this civ.

 

[Furycrab]

France still breezes into early Social policies, Egypt's problem is just marble and the AI crazy production bonus on Emperor and above. Playing as Egypt with AI personalities not randomized makes it so you don't play against the biggest AI wonder spammer though, so that alone will let you get a few extra wonders you would probably otherwise just ignore.

 

[Gilkanese]

Kinda weird no one has mentioned Sweden. I don't own G&K, but from reading it, they're UA sounds completely worthless. Why would you trade away a Great Person for a bit of influence? Honestly, their only redeeming feature is their unique units which are pretty good.

 

[GlobularFoody]

England, without a doubt, has the weakest UA. I've never played a single game where having +2 ship movement was anything to care about. I almost always fill out the commerce tree and the bonus to ships in that is good enough. The extra spy they added for G&K is the only thing useful about this UA, and that's not really that great.

Not sure why they have left England to rot at the bottom for so long, surely there was something else other than ships that aided the English in creating their Empire.

 

[Hyper Nova]

For me the most useless UA might be the Dutch one. I never have enough happiness to even imagine selling the last pieces of my luxuries .

People seem to forget you don't HAVE to sell Luxuries, most people do because the cash is useful. You can actually TRADE luxuries (novel idea i know ) this means if you are struggling for Happiness you can trade your last one away for one you don't have and gain a net of +2 happiness this makes the Dutch UA pretty versatile with trading options. And Selling early luxuries while you can, can keep you growing while have the extra cash to buy settlers, buildings or gain an Ally that you get more happiness from.

 

[Calouste]

See I'm of the mind though that no UA should ever become obsolete. If it does, it's just poor design.

Quite a few UAs become practically obsolete, or at least parts of them. Germany's when barbarians have been wiped out, Iroquois' when you discover railroad.

 

[Flaviusx]

Sweden is indeed meh.

The Swedish AI is surprisingly aggressive considering the UA. More Charles X than Gustavus, imo.

 

[Trik]

Having powerful early UA likes France and Celts is more often than not better than other UA's that last all game. That early advantage snowballs so much that near the mid game you don't even need it any more.

 

[Randall_Flagg]

I kind of Feel, I think it is Sulimens? I feel no pain for France's, in fact I think the 2 per should be downgraded to 1. I hate France in my games.

 

[steveg700]

I never thought France's was all that great, but many are of the opposite opinion. Personally, I don't think there's any reason to have it switch off after steam power--not from a perspective of game balance or verisimilitude.