What difficulty do you suggest for me to play?

[Czacki]

I'd like someone to recommend me the "best" difficulty given the following conditions:

1. Challenging, but fair. The AI doesn't get 9847986734 cities and 300% science rate of the player, or something. I don't want it to be "challenging via annoyance" or "challenging via number tweaking". I dislike the AI being ahead of me even with the best tactics and flawless gameplay of mine, requiring tricks like bulbing/trading to beat.
2. Winnable at every scenario possible. I heard for instance Diety isn't sometimes possible for even best players to win, because a bad placement and/or bad combination of neighbors is impossible to overcome with advantage the AI has.
3. Beatable by solid empire management. What I mean here is that cheap tactics that take advantage of AI stupidity/flawed design are NOT required to comfortably play the game and win.

I'm going to use a RoM: A new dawn mod, since I heard many positive opinions about it, so you may adjust your advice taking the mod changes into consideration Alternatively, if you haven't played the mod, just tell me what would you suggest for unmodded BTS.

 

[Farm Boy]

I don't know that this can be answered squarely. For example, bulbing/trading is not a "cheap trick," those are both core mechanics. That even works if you have tech brokering off(say if you are a diplomatic curmudgeon and do not like that aspect of the game).

Given your above qualification, I do not know I am in any position to ascertain what you qualify as a legitimate tactic for victory. Maybe look up some role play challenges?

 

[Czacki]

I'm not looking for specific challenges rather for a difficulty setting where AI doesn't "cheat" too hard. Like getting triple of your science rate, three cities at start or something.

 

[Ghpstage]

Monarch can be outexpanded and outteched without too much hassle if your good at managing your economy. AIs start with Archery preventing non Quencha Warrior rushes however.

None of the difficulties get treble your science rate, nor do any start with 3 cities so I suppose Deity would be acceptable
I have never played RoM by the way, always crashed when I tried......

 

[Haig]

Ok this one doesn't really address your questionn Czacki,
but RoM - A new dawn is a cool mod, but in my honest opinion sometimes there even too much stuff added, stuff that the AI doesn't actually handle all that well.

I love a very popular modpack called RevolutionDCM(this stuff is actually inside RoM too) that adds loads of great stuff to the game, but not too much.

There's no 200 new units and techs, but there are revolutions and civil wars, barbarians who can start their own nations, ranged combat and bombardment, umm.. and more cool stuff too.

(Just wanting to give you info about that modpack too)

 

[Czacki]

Thanks. I'll still try the RoM:AND mod, because I'm a sucker for content. Even though I am aware that AI may not be able to use the new features well.

Oh well, perhaps I will go Diety then to even the odds :grin:


I heard however that AI gets many unfair bonuses at high levels. no maintenance costs, super fast production and stuff. Things I don't want to see. Poor AI shouldn't be "improved" by unfair bonuses imho. I'd rather go through the pain of playing an easy game than have AI doing miraculous stuff with a crappy economy, buildup and such.

 

[Haig]

I play Noble, it's a level A.I. doesn't get any help and for me it gives plenty of challenge, sometimes I go for Prince but it hasn't gone well for me..

If I try something totally new and try to learn I have no problem choosing Chieftain level as it's more forgiving for the human player.

My playstyle is also kind of enjoying the ride and getting the full immersion of creating a history with it's events and triumphs(something Civ V doesn't give to me sadly) so I'm not really a "high score" type of player who tries to get to Immortal asap.

I'd recommend Noble for you, and if it starts feeling too easy try Prince.

 

[Lemon Merchant]

Oh well, perhaps I will go Diety then to even the odds :grin:

You didn't mention your level of experience with Civ, but a first time game with RoM:AND, on Deity?

Welcome to the slaughterhouse.

 

[Jarlaxe Baenre]

Try Better AI if you don't want them getting lots of 'cheats'. I haven't played it, but I've heard it's good.

 

[Czacki]

Lemon Merchant, I'm not starting the mod on diety ) but if the AI sucks at using new features, perhaps rising the difficulty to a point where AI cheats may be a solution not to make the game too easy.

Jarlaxe Baenre, can it work together with RoM:AND?

 

[Jarlaxe Baenre]

No. It has a custom dll. You could merge them, but it would be a lot of work. But check rom's readme - it might have it built in.

 

[The7Sins]

I'd like someone to recommend me the "best" difficulty given the following conditions:

1. Challenging, but fair. The AI doesn't get 9847986734 cities and 300% science rate of the player, or something. I don't want it to be "challenging via annoyance" or "challenging via number tweaking". I dislike the AI being ahead of me even with the best tactics and flawless gameplay of mine, requiring tricks like bulbing/trading to beat.
2. Winnable at every scenario possible. I heard for instance Diety isn't sometimes possible for even best players to win, because a bad placement and/or bad combination of neighbors is impossible to overcome with advantage the AI has.
3. Beatable by solid empire management. What I mean here is that cheap tactics that take advantage of AI stupidity/flawed design are NOT required to comfortably play the game and win.

I'm going to use a RoM: A new dawn mod, since I heard many positive opinions about it, so you may adjust your advice taking the mod changes into consideration Alternatively, if you haven't played the mod, just tell me what would you suggest for unmodded BTS.

Sounds to me your needs fit Noble difficulty.

 

[Iranon]

Unfortunately, I don't know the mod. That said:

1. You can keep up with the AI on Immortal with entirely fair/natural play and surpass them reasonably quickly unless they got a much better start. Deity really needs to be played close to the mechanics much of the time, and even that may not be enough.

2. I find almost every Immortal game at least winnable in hindsight and win about 90% (never got far above 50% on Deity, but better players claim the vast majority is winnable).
'Every scenario possible, without prior knowledge' is a tall order if there are barbarian uprisings and the possibility of being stranded on an arctic isle while the AIs on the biggest continent are having a cuddling orgy.

3. Again, Immortal. You may have to make some concessions though - e.g. often you can out-expand or out-tech them by a comfortable margin but not both.

 

[Haig]

Iranon, what do you mean about barbarian uprising? Is that something that's in RoM?
Can it happen in normal Civ IV BTS game?

 

[Iranon]

Not from a mod, so yes it can.

It's a random event that can easily end the game, spawning several barbarians that head towards the unfortunate victim. It's disliked by many because it can be impractical to prepare against - the archer variant can happen so early that doing so would cripple your economy.

 

[Czacki]

Thanks for answers. I'm going to test RoM:AND as soon as I finish Fallout New Vegas. I hope it will be a blast Will start from good ol' noble, perhaps. (in regular BTS noble was wayyy to easy for me though)

 

[PreLynMax]

Um... Warlord.
That's the difficulty I started on.

 

[Roots]

I heard however that AI gets many unfair bonuses at high levels. no maintenance costs, super fast production and stuff. Things I don't want to see. Poor AI shouldn't be "improved" by unfair bonuses imho. I'd rather go through the pain of playing an easy game than have AI doing miraculous stuff with a crappy economy, buildup and such.

But they can't even out the AI any other way. AI can only be so advanced with current technology and knowledge.

Otherwise, have fun playing super easy games if you don't want them to have advantages.

 

[duckstab]

I would shoot for Noble or maybe Prince, depending on how good you think you are. I usually play on Noble myself because, like you, I'm more interested in playing out an enjoyable and somewhat realistic alternate history than in beating a computer game. We're probably what would be considered "narrative" players in Soren Johnson's typology.

 

[Lemon Merchant]

Lemon Merchant, I'm not starting the mod on diety ) but if the AI sucks at using new features, perhaps rising the difficulty to a point where AI cheats may be a solution not to make the game too easy.

Believe me, RoM isn't very easy, even at Noble. On a large-ish map, the revolution component will make you pull out your hair all by itself.

Jarlaxe Baenre, can it work together with RoM:AND?

What Jarlaxe said. I know that Afforess has put a lot of SDK work into AND, and I think there are some bits of Better AI incorporated, if not all of it. See the AND thread for details.