Ronald
Emperor
I always build the forbidden palast with the first great leader? What do you do?
What do you use your first great leader for?
- Thread starter Ronald
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kring
Asst Cook & Bottle Washer
I usually build an Army. The only Army I would build using a Leader. Then send it into battle, probably win, then you can build the Heroic Epic and increase your chances of getting GL to 1/12 for non mil. civs. If I was in a race for a specific Wonder, I may use him to hurry it.
You can use the FP switch to build Wonders with, but you can't do that once it is built.
My decision will be based on the specific instances of that game, but usually I build the Army to get the better chance of getting more GL's.
You can use the FP switch to build Wonders with, but you can't do that once it is built.
My decision will be based on the specific instances of that game, but usually I build the Army to get the better chance of getting more GL's.
Shabbaman
rebuffing the rebels
Most of the time I want the Heroic Epic asap, so I build an army.
Bash heads.
Bash heads.
Trabpukcip
Agent of Doom
building an army is nearly always the best choice...
That is my ideal approach as well but it usually ends up with the FP, Sun Tzu, Leo sequence because of the rapid expansion I am doing around that time.
greenie
Warlord
Always an army for the first GL. The ability to make more armies and increase odds of GL is priceless in some games.
JuicyCivNewbie
Greatest civ player ever!
Forbidden palace is the best choice; you're effectively doubling your production right there. Using it to make an army is way too risky, because first you have to build a wonder for it to have any effect, and secondly there is still a fair chance you won't get another GL for a long time, and you will be wasting a lot of production in your empire.
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For me, it also depends on the circumstances under which I get the leader.
If I am at the start of a military campagin, and I have lots of elite units, I figure that I am reasonably likely to get another one in the next few turns. If I get one whilst defending and I don't figure I'll get another GL until my next offensive campaign, I may use it differently.
But generally, the first is for an army or the FP.
If I am at the start of a military campagin, and I have lots of elite units, I figure that I am reasonably likely to get another one in the next few turns. If I get one whilst defending and I don't figure I'll get another GL until my next offensive campaign, I may use it differently.
But generally, the first is for an army or the FP.
Zachriel
Kaiser
As ainwood says, it depends. However, I tend to use the first Leader for an army, and its the only one I'll use this way. The second Leader is usually for the Forbidden Palace, then wonders from then on. Later on, all my armies will come from the Military Academy and I usually have several.
Chingis Khan
Scourge Of The World
Was lucky enough to get a nice early GL. Had a choice to complete Pyramids or build FP. Chose to build FP on the outskirts of my rapidly expanding empire in a new and undefended city. Barb horseman came up and pillaged production inbetween turns. Smashed mouse, threw computer out window, cursed Firaxis, started new game. I love Civ 3!!!
Zachriel
Kaiser
Great! With your new computer you won't have to worry so much about lag.
(It's all Sid's fault.
)
Shaitan
der Besucher
It's almost always used to build an army. That said, there are instances where I don't. In my first Tournament game my first GL came I was building the FP. I was able to switch that city to build a wonder and used the GL to build the FP in a much better spot (but one that would have been 200 turns to build the FP by itself). The second GL came at the perfect time to get the Sistine Chapel and cause every AI civ to lose massive production as there were no other wonders available. I couldn't resist that. The third GL made my first army.
I'm in the majority - typically I'll use it for an army and then never use another for making armies. However, as I move up levels I rarely get any wonders the first few games, so I'm tempted - if a good one is available to build, to use the first leader to rush it. And maybe even the second.
chiefpaco
Emperor
I would say generally, the army. That's so I can build the Heroic Epic and Military Academy. Ensuring a good Forbidden Palace is high on my list, especially if there is no way I can build it quickly. However, the FP can be built without the leader with no competition, so I usually lean to the army.
It is often a tough choice. Early in the game & on higher levels, where building wonders is difficult, an instant Pyramids is very attractive. However, I find early swordsmen armies quite effective. Plus, getting the Heroic Epic this early should have a positive impact over the game.
If the first comes in the middle ages (which I would say is common in my games), it is again a tough choice. Many choice wonders are tempting: Sun Tsu's, Sistene, and sometimes JS Bach's. They are also doubly tough to build because of the wonder cascade that usually occurs during this time. I also often have a great FP site in mind at this point that could be rushed too.
If I were religious, I'd seriously consider Sistene at this point. Planning on much war, Sun Tsu's. Having a spread out empire, the Palace or FP. I often go army anyway, but sometimes my empire just screams for one of these & I cave.
Any later and with a FP in place, I'd probably go army. That's just so I can build modern armies to crack the enemies' top defensive units. Wonders are relatively easier to pre-build & there is little cascading, if any. The one exception is the UN, which I rush at all costs to ensure control of voting.
It is often a tough choice. Early in the game & on higher levels, where building wonders is difficult, an instant Pyramids is very attractive. However, I find early swordsmen armies quite effective. Plus, getting the Heroic Epic this early should have a positive impact over the game.
If the first comes in the middle ages (which I would say is common in my games), it is again a tough choice. Many choice wonders are tempting: Sun Tsu's, Sistene, and sometimes JS Bach's. They are also doubly tough to build because of the wonder cascade that usually occurs during this time. I also often have a great FP site in mind at this point that could be rushed too.
If I were religious, I'd seriously consider Sistene at this point. Planning on much war, Sun Tsu's. Having a spread out empire, the Palace or FP. I often go army anyway, but sometimes my empire just screams for one of these & I cave.
Any later and with a FP in place, I'd probably go army. That's just so I can build modern armies to crack the enemies' top defensive units. Wonders are relatively easier to pre-build & there is little cascading, if any. The one exception is the UN, which I rush at all costs to ensure control of voting.
Maple
Canadian Patriot
:aargh3: lol
I usually build armies first, as once you have one, you can build Heroic Epic.
Crunchy
Chieftain
Zachriel suggests not using GL's for armies but in my current game I'm at the end of the Industrial era so there aren't any wonders to build. If your in the middle of a war and don't have any wonders to build then build an army instead, it's not worth waiting as you can only have one GL. If you do decide to wait then don't use your elite soldiers and waste those chances, use the other ranks to try and get more to elite. In my current game I've now got 7 tank armies, only 2 of which were produced with the MA. Crunchy got tank, Crunchy rule world! 
One of the Firaxis programmers mentioned that each elite unit can only produce one leader, has anyone tried to track which units produce a leader? Seeing as they don't have names I can't see how you would do this.
One of the Firaxis programmers mentioned that each elite unit can only produce one leader, has anyone tried to track which units produce a leader? Seeing as they don't have names I can't see how you would do this.
Zachriel
Kaiser
Originally posted by Crunchy
Zachriel suggests not using GL's for armies but in my current game I'm at the end of the Industrial era so there aren't any wonders to build. If your in the middle of a war and don't have any wonders to build then build an army instead, it's not worth waiting as you can only have one GL. If you do decide to wait then don't use your elite soldiers and waste those chances, use the other ranks to try and get more to elite. In my current game I've now got 7 tank armies, only 2 of which were produced with the MA. Crunchy got tank, Crunchy rule world!
You are absolutely right to point that out. I am a big believer in playing the situation, and there are few hard and fast rules that work in a game as complex as Civ3. One good rule of thumb, though, is to use your leaders immediately, especially during wartime. As you said, you can only have one at a time, so
Bon Appétit! (crunch, crunch
)Me, I tend to go Army first so I get access to the Heroic Epic and more importantly the military acadamy which I think is sweet, and seeing as the AI either doesn't build it or doesn't care, multiple armies in a war helps quite a bit.
Sodak
Paha Sapa Papa
Hmm... all this talk about armies! I've yet to build one in about 20 partial games. (I rarely play far into the modern age)
What sort of real return do you army builders see? Once you have your Heroic Epic, do you get many more GLs? I've never used a leader to build an army because I've never gotten more than two in a whole game. Most games none. I'm only somewhat trigger-happy - early on I'll start wars to secure various resources, then only cautiously choosing the next victims of my expansion. I've had entire herds of elite cavalry running about killing AI units, but have rarely seen leaders...
Would all this change if I start with an army instead of a key wonder?
What sort of real return do you army builders see? Once you have your Heroic Epic, do you get many more GLs? I've never used a leader to build an army because I've never gotten more than two in a whole game. Most games none. I'm only somewhat trigger-happy - early on I'll start wars to secure various resources, then only cautiously choosing the next victims of my expansion. I've had entire herds of elite cavalry running about killing AI units, but have rarely seen leaders...
Would all this change if I start with an army instead of a key wonder?
Zachriel
Kaiser
If you take your first Leader and create an army, then that army wins a combat, then you will now be eligible to build the Heroic Epic, and later the Military Academy. With the Heroic Epic, your chances of a Leader are significantly improved (but only if you actually fight battles, specifically win combats with Elite units). Also, an ancient age army can be very powerful, knocking out almost any ancient age defender. In later ages, you can set a shield-rich city to producing first the Military Academy, then armies.
