What If God Was Real And Manifested Proving It?

He does manifest in my drink
No, if its claiming to be responsible for everything its got some explaining to do.
The initial set-up was a botched job and its been AWOL for the last 2000 years.
You're calculating from 1 AD? I’ve been putting the clock since the start of the Big Bang.
 
So why is it appearing in the clouds issuing demands in a booming voice? Rather destroys the importance of faith when its being all manifest right there.

That was just an example. God does something to prove they're who they claim that meets your criteria of proof.
 
That was just an example. God does something to prove they're who they claim that meets your criteria of proof.

In that case we go back to my not feeling they've done a decent job.
Also anything that wants to be worshipped probably doesn't deserve to be worshipped.
 
Ots more what woukd you do if the commands were more 1500-2500 years ago.
So I'm skipping a couple of pages here, but what you're asking seems to be:
  • Write a fictional alternate history, based on this change to the historical record. Which nobody's got the time to do justice to, really. If anyone has a go, I'd read the heck out of it.
  • Guess at how humans now would act, based on this allegedly happening then. To which my answer would be: the same as now. There would be zero change, because like with our current state of affairs, there would be no hard evidence of anything beyond the human behaviour recorded at the time.
 
You can certainly claim such events as hoaxes, but demonstrating the sources of the hoax might be difficult.
Extremely difficult, I would think. I certainly wouldn't be able to do it. But that's why we have scientists and investigative journalists. If nothing else, the number of people you'd need to pull off such a trick as bringing the Titanic forward through time would make it almost inevitable that the truth would come out, eventually. I think all we'd have to do is wait for the professionals to do their work.

To say "Oh it can't be god, because I can think of another explanation." fails on the merits.
It does. Good thing I didn't say that. ;)

The idea is that any god who in some fashion proclaimed itself to all the world to be god, would then demonstrate its power. Raising the Titanic or unifying world languages into one tongue would be ways to demonstrate power that might well impress a lot of skeptics.
A demonstration of power isn't evidence of divinity. You have to be predisposed to accept the existence of God as an explanation for natural or manufactured phenomena to think that XYZ is evidence of the existence of God. It's always circular reasoning. Even the title of this thread presupposes the existence of God as its premise. But, like @schlaufuchs, I think I have to admit that I don't really understand what this thread is about, or what question was being asked by the OP. I can only interrogate the premise. :dunno:
 
Yeah if I felt something absolutely I would believe it.

But how do you know whether you can doubt your experience is the question?

Lot of things I once "knew for sure" I know think are asburd

Closest time I ever came to belief in God was watching people mill around @ a festival while on acid and I realized "something is making them move, probably the same force that makes the tides move in and out and the rain fall" but the idea of some angry old testament diety proscribing us to cut foreskins off and value some tribes above others seems a lil silly.
 
Yeah if I felt something absolutely I would believe it.

But how do you know whether you can doubt your experience is the question?

Lot of things I once "knew for sure" I know think are asburd

Closest time I ever came to belief in God was watching people mill around @ a festival while on acid and I realized "something is making them move, probably the same force that makes the tides move in and out and the rain fall" but the idea of some angry old testament diety proscribing us to cut foreskins off and value some tribes above others seems a lil silly.

Might do a 2.0 clarifying the scenario in OP.
 
A demonstration of power isn't evidence of divinity.
Right. To a caveman showing them a flashlight might give them the idea we're gods when in fact we have it not more figured out than they do on a fundamental level (we may have ipads and live an extra decade of two but we're still subject to all the same limitations they are (aging, illness and death, being limited to our own subjective experience, etc)
 
Right. To a caveman showing them a flashlight might give them the idea we're gods when in fact we have it not more figured out than they do on a fundamental level (we may have ipads and live an extra decade of two but we're still subject to all the same limitations they are (aging, illness and death, being limited to our own subjective experience, etc)

Well as I said that power is consistent with the various holy books and can't be explained via science. Essentially real magic.
 
Well as I said that power is consistent with the various holy books and can't be explained via science. Essentially real magic.
I don't believe in magic and if I experienced "magic" I would try to find a naturalistic explanation

On topic supposedly the "jhannic" states of Buddhism having brain signatures that can measured via MRI. I'm doing a retreat and going to try and see for myself (altho for most reaching these states takes a lot longer than a week and a half)

But these have nothing to do w God. They are ever higher levels of release of the "hinderances".

Buddhism much more appealing due to it having levels of attainment like a video game rather than just a list of improbable stuff you're supposed to believe

Buddhism also has heaven and hell realms and all that but it's not necessary to believe in all that
 
I don't believe in magic and if I experienced "magic" I would try to find a naturalistic explanation

On topic supposedly the "jhannic" states of Buddhism having brain signatures that can measured via MRI. I'm doing a retreat and going to try and see for myself (altho for most reaching these states takes a lot longer than a week and a half)

But these have nothing to do w God. They are ever higher levels of release of the "hinderances".

Buddhism much more appealing due to it having levels of attainment like a video game rather than just a list of improbable stuff you're supposed to believe

Buddhism also has heaven and hell realms and all that but it's not necessary to believe in all that

Well in this case God can directly cause miracles or destruction.
 
Well in this case God can directly cause miracles or destruction.

Clarkes 3rd Law applies here.
The ability of someone or something to do something I can't explain doesn't make them god, they may just have better technology.
 
Well as I said that power is consistent with the various holy books
For me, being consistent with any of the holy books would actually be evidence that it's some kind of trick.

and can't be explained via science.
I don't believe there is anything that can't be explained by science, only things that haven't been explained by science. Simultaneously, I'm accepting of the fact that some things haven't been explained yet, and I don't ascribe supernatural or divine causes to things that people haven't figured out yet. Lots of phenomena previously thought to be supernatural or divine have been shown to be natural, predictable, understandable, and even harnessable. Nobody today believes that a person struck by lightning has somehow offended Zeus. You mentioned The Angel of Death. We just had one, it was named COVID-19. I think Angels of Death have mostly been disease outbreaks. It's easy to see how pre-Enlightenment people would view a years-long drought, a mega-tsunami, or a massive earthquake as being the work of an Angel of Death, too, and we've seen every one of those things in recent years. The history of things that had once been ascribed to a divine being having since been explained by science is so long that, at this point, the idea of divine beings just seems implausible. If we've had it wrong 7,000 times in a row, why would we think, "okay, this time it's really god(s) at work"? Just how gullible do we need to be?

Essentially real magic.
Science & technology is real magic.

Clarkes 3rd Law applies here.
The ability of someone or something to do something I can't explain doesn't make them god, they may just have better technology.
D'oh. Ninja'd.
 
My phone made those numbers a link and when I clicked it offered to call that number
It's good that Zard hadn't said "867-5309 years ago."

I do believe in God, the Christian God. So the difficulty for me in the scenario you sketch wouldn't be the existence of God, but the fact that he was backtracking in terms of his message and his method of communication.
 
If god performed the actions necessary to cause me to believe in god then yes I would believe in god…?? what on earth is this thread?

if you showed a given rectangle to have 4 equal sides would it be a square? 🤔

If God came down and told centrists they are the white moderate and to repent and change, would centrists:

A) meekly change their opinions at the behest of the Supreme One, or
B) lecture God about how God's ideas are impractical and won't win over voters in crucial swing states
 
I tend to look at much of the world through the lens of anthropology and archaeology. What evidence has been found to prove that the Tower of Babel story in the Old Testament really happened?

None I'm aware of. I'm pretty sure that if it had been proven, there would have been a mention in the news somewhere.

Nope. So before you can convince me that it can be undone, you're going to have to convince me that it happened in the first place.

I doubt that will ever happen.
We though what Troy doesn't exist. 3 year ago we didn't know, what Africans also have parts of Neanderthals
We still don't know origin (as I know) of Indo-European group... Actually, we even don't know all animals living deep in oceans.
If we don't know - it doesn't mean that it doesn't exist
 
It's good that Zard hadn't said "867-5309 years ago."

I do believe in God, the Christian God. So the difficulty for me in the scenario you sketch wouldn't be the existence of God, but the fact that he was backtracking in terms of his message and his method of communication.

Well in my scenario the Christians may not be right or a good chunk of them may be heretics that whole judge nit lest be judged thing.
 
For me, being consistent with any of the holy books would actually be evidence that it's some kind of trick.


I don't believe there is anything that can't be explained by science, only things that haven't been explained by science. Simultaneously, I'm accepting of the fact that some things haven't been explained yet, and I don't ascribe supernatural or divine causes to things that people haven't figured out yet. Lots of phenomena previously thought to be supernatural or divine have been shown to be natural, predictable, understandable, and even harnessable. Nobody today believes that a person struck by lightning has somehow offended Zeus. You mentioned The Angel of Death. We just had one, it was named COVID-19. I think Angels of Death have mostly been disease outbreaks. It's easy to see how pre-Enlightenment people would view a years-long drought, a mega-tsunami, or a massive earthquake as being the work of an Angel of Death, too, and we've seen every one of those things in recent years. The history of things that had once been ascribed to a divine being having since been explained by science is so long that, at this point, the idea of divine beings just seems implausible. If we've had it wrong 7,000 times in a row, why would we think, "okay, this time it's really god(s) at work"? Just how gullible do we need to be?


Science & technology is real magic.


D'oh. Ninja'd.

This would be more along the lines of a nation loses their first birds over night with no sign of disease after being warned directly or via proxy.

Or Thanos snap.
 
Back
Top Bottom