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[GRAPHICS] What If Unit Thread: Matsuda123, Kine100, and Mattem's Latest Additions

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Unit Graphics' started by Matsuda123, Sep 19, 2019.

  1. Matsuda123

    Matsuda123 Prince

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    That's right. After much talk, there have been some results. Matsuda123 (Models), Kine100 (Textures), and Matttem (Animation) have teamed up to create great new units for the Civilization IV community! :)

    The premise is as such: What would units (and possibly architecture) look like if cultures across the globe discovered technologies on their own, with minimal amounts of outside influence?

    Do you dread arriving in the Industrial Era because you know that your culture will soon look the same as every other civilization on the map? Well fear no more. The solution is beginning to arrive. :)

    At present, one unit is complete, with another to be animated, and another to be textured and animated. For future reference, statuses will be as such: 0 for concept stage, 1 for being modeled, 2 for being textured, 3 for being animated, and 4 for complete.

    I'm looking for anyone who can texture .obj files, and anyone who can rig and animated units. The more members added to the crew, the faster the work can be finished.

    I am definitely interested in hearing ideas for new units! Basic sketches are also helpful.

    I'm also looking for anyone who can texture citysets. I have several completed models, all of which need textures. If anyone is able to do this, I would be very grateful, and the community will have new city graphics to fill the gaps.

    The culture groups I have divided the game into are as follows:

    Europe:

    Euro - French, Germans, English, Celts, Holy Romans, Americans, Dutch.

    Greco - Greeks, Byzantines, Carthaginians, Romans, Spanish, Portuguese.

    Nordic - Russians, Vikings.

    Middle East:

    Middle - Sumerians, Babylonians, Egyptians, Persians.

    Arabic - Arabs, Ottomans.

    Africa:

    Africa - Ethiopians, Malinese, Zulu.

    India:

    Indian - India.

    East Asia:

    Sino - Chinese, Koreans.

    Mongol - Mongolians.

    Japan - Japanese.

    Southeast Asia:

    Khmer: Khmer.

    Americas:

    Native: Native Americans.

    Meso: Aztecs, Incas, Mayans.


    New subdivisions may follow, but these are the primary groups for now.


    Without further ado, the units. :)

    Japan

    Ironclad: https://forums.civfanatics.com/resources/japanese-ironclad.27790/

    Meso

    Bombard: https://forums.civfanatics.com/resources/meso-american-bombard.27793/
     
    Last edited: Sep 21, 2019
  2. Matsuda123

    Matsuda123 Prince

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    Upcoming unit: Meso Bombard. Stage: 3. A Civilization IV conversion of the Aztec Mortar unit from Civilization III. :)

    EDIT: Stage 4. Also, here is an alternate texture for the bombard.
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Sep 21, 2019
  3. Zeta Nexus

    Zeta Nexus Deity

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    So let brainstorming begin...

    Egyptians:
    I always thought that Stargate perfectly visualized how they would look like in the middle ages:
    Spoiler :


    Spoiler :

    Just replace those power-stuffs with pikes and we see medieval Egyptian Heavy Pikeman :)
     
  4. Matsuda123

    Matsuda123 Prince

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    Yes, I think that would be a good starting point for Egyptian styled medieval units. :) I was thinking that the Egyptian aircraft from the Stargate film would serve some inspiration for their fighters...
     
  5. Sword_Of_Geddon

    Sword_Of_Geddon Mysterious Jungle Warrior

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    Bakuel did make an Anubis masked knight as well as a Horus-masked swordsman. So the precedent is there. I agree about the fighters. Got to think of how the early ones(Biplanes then WW2 Fighters) the transition(Early Jet Fighters) and finally later fighters(modern jet fighters etc) would look like.

    Modern could definitely look like Stargate Deathgliders. The shape would make them ideal for stealth fighter material as well.

    As for culture groups, Inca would definitely be a seperate catagory: Andean(Which would also included other civs like the Nazca and Chimu if you include them), very very different than mesoamerica, as different as western europe and the middle east. Also there were many cultures in north america and Sid Meier's did native peoples a great disservice with his stereotypical "Native American Empire". Theres the woodlands peoples, like the Iroquois(From Civ3 and Civ5), the Mound Builders culture, the south west(Pueblo), the plains tribes like the Lakota/Sioux, and of coarse the source of the totem pole, the Pacific Northwest.

    Theres also the Taino, Carib in the Caribbean, and the Tupi and Guarani and others in the Amazon.

    Also don't forget Polynesia, a catagory on its on.

    But pick a group, work on that, one at a time. Don't tackle all at once.
     
  6. Matsuda123

    Matsuda123 Prince

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    Right, right. I will probably focus on models for the vanilla run of units first, though, I do plan on including hand cannons/early firearms, bombards, and WWI type fighters and bombers for transitions. But the primary focus will be on the base game units.

    I agree that these groups can definitely become their own groups if I am able to continue on long enough. Inca would separate, and I would divide the Native American tribes of the United States into about five different regions. But to begin, I'd like to just focus on perhaps one group, and develop for them. So far, the Haida are looking to be very promising for unit development. I'm going to begin work on their Galley, and have several ideas for their future line of ships. I was thinking though, an Iroquois ironclad would look cool. Something like a longhouse ironclad... Haida have many good inspirational sources for muskets, hand cannons...

    Polynesia would be fantastic to develop for. I can see their battleships now. A massive steel double bowed ship...

    But yes, one at a time. I'll probably stick to developing for the Japan group for now. Can't wait to put out the airship.
     
  7. Matsuda123

    Matsuda123 Prince

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    Upcoming unit: Haida Galley. Stage: 2.
     

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  8. Zeta Nexus

    Zeta Nexus Deity

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    No. Don't go too far. Tough it would look cool, the fact is that for aircraft's look what matters is aerodynamics not culture. But you can still play with the colours.
    Same goes for other modern units.
     
  9. Matsuda123

    Matsuda123 Prince

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    But that's literally the whole point of this. To give designs to Industrial and Modern units that take cultural background into consideration. For example... The Chinese, when first being prompted towards aircraft, would likely use things they already knew of as design sources. War-kites, particular birds, materials common to their region, design patterns... A Chinese Junk looks drastically different than that of a European Caravel. Yet, their function is the same, to sail. Thus, surely a Chinese biplane would look different than that of a European one, if they developed on their own. Naturally you still have to make it functional, but nevertheless, there is no way it would look identical to the ones created in real life. Similar, but not the same. Like how their cars would look different too, derived from the Chinese carriages. Their architecture would definitely look different. With no Western powers pressuring other nations to change their original designs, there would instead be innovations on those pre-westernized designs.

    Basically, I got really bored looking at everything becoming samey in Civ IV come the Industrial and Modern Eras. If the game is really about rewriting history, then I wanna see it happen in the designs for cities and units too. :)
     
  10. PPQ_Purple

    PPQ_Purple Techpriest Engineer

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    Before I say what I am to say allow me to just preface this with the following:
    This is your mod. It is your work. And fundamentally you have the final say. All that we say are suggestions that you are free to ignore if that is your wish. As long as you consider them before doing so that's all we can reasonably ask.

    Now, to the topic at hand the issue with such designs is that those things won't fly, period. Aircraft and tanks look the way they do because they need to in order to work. Which is why they all look boringly alike. And that is important because fundamentally a lot of people, my self included would find our self turned off if we ran into a bunch of models that just physically can't function. It would very much be immersion breaking. And that's not fine.

    Now, that's not to say your fundamental thesis is wrong. An indigenous Chinese biplane might well look quite different to an European one. See how differently the various European aircraft were from one another. But ultimately it's still going to look like a biplane. It'll have an engine somewhere on it, a pair of wings or multiple and a hull in the middle for the pilot. Because that's what is needed to power it, give it lift so it can fly and hold a guy to fly it.

    But again, ultimately it's your call.
     
    Last edited: Sep 21, 2019
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  11. Zeta Nexus

    Zeta Nexus Deity

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    ...to continue PPQ:

    I can imagine a Chinese biplane's body and wings painted to tesemble a Chinese dragon; an Egyptian early tank and ironclad with pyramid turrets and aircraft with the same/similar texture as the goa'uld glider but the shape is the same.

    The Glider looks awesome in SG, in a fantasy-ish mod or as a spacecraft though.

    Now buildings on theother hand may offera bit more freedom of design :)
     
  12. Matsuda123

    Matsuda123 Prince

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    Oh I definitely understand the concerns here, I get that for sure. I probably should have explained better. I intend on making them look as if they can actually function in real life too, but still be culturally derived. I was never into over the top looks or anything like that. For example, when I design artillery or cannons, I will make them have the basic stuff first. Rifled barrels, shields (for artillery), and wheels that function. However, the carriage for the cannon, the inner wheel designs, and the shields can surely be altered to reflect the cultural backdrop of the civ in question. There are some units I probably won't alter, like the Stealth Bomber or Stealth Destroyer. But things like Biplanes, Great War Bombers, Battleships, Destroyers... They could definitely be altered to look like they are from a particular culture, it's just that the cultural markings get less pronounced as the function becomes more important. Uniforms will still definitely change though.

    This design thought process can be seen in the Japanese Ironclad. It's basically just a Mekura Bune clad in iron, with a steam engine.

    I would also eventually like to make cultural wonders too. Imagine: A Chinese Sistine Chapel. What does it look like? How about an African Hagia Sophia? Or a Japanese Colossus? I will keep the basic form of the wonder, so it doesn't confuse players too much. But I definitely want the architecture to be inspired by the time period it was made in, as well as the culture who builds it first. That way, the architecture won't stand out like a sore thumb from different civilizations who build it. A Chinese Sistine Chapel may very well have Ming dynasty architecture.
     
  13. Sword_Of_Geddon

    Sword_Of_Geddon Mysterious Jungle Warrior

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    I agree about the wonders. I've already done that in my mod(new version I'm still working on) with the Pyramids.

    But I can understand why some might think the Deathglider look is too fantasy, I submit this for consideration:



    These are from South America. They look like WW2 era fighters.



    From Egypt. Notice the hawk look, while maintaining a fighter craft shape.
     
  14. Matsuda123

    Matsuda123 Prince

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    Yes, the designs on the wings, and perhaps a bit of the shape could go into an Incan type of aircraft I think. :)

    But as I say, don't worry. I won't make anything look too fanciful. Just ensure that it looks like it is derived from what came before from other cultures.

    I found some Korean kite-glider like thing today. I'm sure I can take some inspiration from this and incorporate it into the Sino Biplane.
     

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  15. Sword_Of_Geddon

    Sword_Of_Geddon Mysterious Jungle Warrior

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    Asian designed bi-planes probably would have the same foldy-type wings as the look of asian junks and such, . When they switch to the all-metal, WW2 type aircraft, that ball is in your court.
     
  16. Matsuda123

    Matsuda123 Prince

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    Yeah, I agree, something like that. :) Yes, for WW2 Fighters and Bombers, it'll be more difficult, but I'll figure something out... I was thinking of using the shape of a Japanese vertical paper lantern for the airship base, and of course, make it horizontal.
     
  17. PPQ_Purple

    PPQ_Purple Techpriest Engineer

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    To be fair you don't really need to cover both fields. I doubt anyone is going to complain too much if the unit for one civ is slightly more 40's whilst another looks slightly more like the late 20's. Especially since in the real world certain nations *cough*Italy and Japan*cough* went into WW2 with tanks fit for the 30's at best.
     
  18. Matsuda123

    Matsuda123 Prince

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    For my mod though, it makes sense to cover them. I plan on adding some Civ V additions to my Civ IV mod. For example, Great War Bombers, Biplanes, Landships, Bombards, and Hand Cannoneers. A more smooth transition to the next generation of stuff. Besides, these earlier units will probably give me more of a chance to have more elaborate designs.

    I'm also filling in the gaps on actual historical units too. The Japanese are finally going to receive a proper Yamato Spearman. :) As well as their Fire Cannon and Stone Crossbowmen from the Civ III Sengoku Jidai scenario. Hopefully an Ishibiya unit as well, which will serve as a Japanese Hand Cannoneer unit.
     
  19. Sword_Of_Geddon

    Sword_Of_Geddon Mysterious Jungle Warrior

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    Love the new units. Its great that the dream has now become reality.

    I will definitely use them. I'm curious where your creativity will take you next?
     
  20. Matsuda123

    Matsuda123 Prince

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    I'm glad to hear that. :) Now if only we could get those cities textured.

    Well, I will likely continue designing Meso muskets, handcannons, same for the Haida. Then I will begin work on those airships. A lot of interesting ways to play around with those. :)

    Also, does anyone know how to add features to terrains in game? I want to add a volcano, and low hanging clouds to my mod. The clouds are from PIE's ancient Europe. Both are just for aesthetic appearances, and don't affect players.
     
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2019

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