What is government good for?

[sonorakitch]

For the federal government: Defense. The facilitation of inter-state/province/county commerce and development. Currency control. Nationalist unity. Foreign negotiation. Promotion of cultural imperialism.

For the state/provincial/county government: the assurance of basic services. Safety. Regulation of certain corporate arenas. The facilitation of enterprise.

~Chris

 

[Atropos]

The government is good for nothing.

I don't love government. You don't love government. Not even the most confirmed big government socialist loves government as anything other than a means to an end.

Unfortunately, every time I think I want to become an anarchist, I run into this problem:

1. You can't abolish the courts, or you end up with lynch law.

2. Given courts, there needs to be some universally agreed law for them to enforce, or you'll have juries letting off a rapist because he's their cousin. You then need a way to make that law in a manner which will be accepted as legitimate. Also, you need some way to enforce decisions, i.e. a police force. You need some way to maintain and keep control of that police force. Finally, what if the commune over the road decides they like the look of your crops, and has more and tougher people in it than yours does?

 

[Eran of Arcadia]

And besides courts, what about roads? They cost money to build and maintian, and provide a service, so clearly one should pay to drive on them. However, it gets inefficient to simply make every road a toll road, which is where taxes come in.

 

[Fifty]

Its purpose? To defend human freedom against COBRA, a ruthless terrorist organization determined to rule the world.

 

[Phlegmak]

And besides courts, what about roads? They cost money to build and maintian, and provide a service, so clearly one should pay to drive on them. However, it gets inefficient to simply make every road a toll road, which is where taxes come in.

Not only that, but without an organized government, a lawless area will just get invaded and conquered. It's naiveté at its height to think there should be no government.

Its purpose? To defend human freedom against COBRA, a ruthless terrorist organization determined to rule the world.

COBRA's aim is so bad, they couldn't conquer a preschool.

 

[nc-1701]

Government is there to provide the people with power/defense.
It should supply all of the folowing;
Military defense
Domestic defense (police/courts)
A working road system
A telecommunications netwok
Fund science through completely impartial means (something industry can't/won't do)
Protecting the integrity of a national currency
Regulating the economy to maintain steady growth while protecting the lower classes from exploitation
Disaster relief
Any thing that requires long term planning companys/people plan short term the government has to plan long term
...and now protecting the enviroment

VRCWAgent is correct the goal is to have a perfect balance between too hot/too cold.
There have been mathmatical studies that have ascertained that for complex structures to develop they must sit on a fine line between chaos where they will be ripped apart and order where they will stagnate. For example life could evolve on Earth because it's not to chaotic that we have all gas, nor is it stagnate everythings frozen instead we have liquid water so we sit on that perfect middle. A government has to also find exactly where it works best.

 

[Atropos]

]A telecommunications netwok

Try Belgacom, just once, and then argue with me that governments are good at providing telecommunications.

Fund science through completely impartial means (something industry can't/won't do)

We all know that private industry NEVER funds science. Especially not, say, Merck or Pfizer.

As for "completely impartial means..."

Come up with any government of a large Western country at random, and then tell me why it is likely to be completely impartial with anything.

Protecting the integrity of a national currency

If you mean fixing exchange rates, that was a huge success in the 1970s.

Regulating the economy to maintain steady growth while protecting the lower classes from exploitation

Governments are particularly good at providing steady growth, of course. Look at the USSR. Also, what's exploitation? Slavery? Child labour? Wages below x amount?

Any thing that requires long term planning companys/people plan short term the government has to plan long term

Companies, of course, never plan for the long term. That's why Microsoft is spending so much on the Xbox 360 - it wants its profits right now.

...and now protecting the enviroment

Governments are particularly good at that. Try drinking from the Volga.

VRCWAgent is correct the goal is to have a perfect balance between too hot/too cold.

Very true, but no two people will agree where the balance lies.

 

[puglover]

Governments exist to protect and mantain the country.

 

[nc-1701]

Try Belgacom, just once, and then argue with me that governments are good at providing telecommunications.

Note I never said it had to be nationalized. Just that the government should provide telecommunications by any means necessary. Heavily regulated/subsidized industry.

We all know that private industry NEVER funds science. Especially not, say, Merck or Pfizer.

As for "completely impartial means..."

Come up with any government of a large Western country at random, and then tell me why it is likely to be completely impartial with anything.

That's my basic point of course no one is truly impartial, but government funded university's etc are a hell of alot closer than a think tank funded by Exxon-Mobile...

If you mean fixing exchange rates, that was a huge success in the 1970s.

Giving start up loans to business's, changing the interest rate etc. To keep things like inflation from spiraling out of control.

Governments are particularly good at providing steady growth, of course. Look at the USSR. Also, what's exploitation? Slavery? Child labour? Wages below x amount?

Yes, everyone should be paid at least enough so that they can afford food+room & board+transportation

Companies, of course, never plan for the long term. That's why Microsoft is spending so much on the Xbox 360 - it wants its profits right now.

Exactly

Governments are particularly good at that. Try drinking from the Volga.

I'm not saying there good at it. I'm saying that they are better at it than is industry...

Very true, but no two people will agree where the balance lies.

That theme is just way to common... If only we good agree more often

 

[GoodEnoughForMe]

Governments exist to protect and insure individual rights, while infringing upon them as minimaly as possible. Other things, like public services, differ per region in significance.

 

[AL_DA_GREAT]

It is here to control us. I personally don't believe in it.

 

[History_Buff]

The government exists primarily to enforce laws that we have come to live with. That capitalist society we enjoy (with it's drawbacks, I'll get to there)is hardly a natural thing. The laws that were written in eighteenth century England have essentially created the economic world we have today. If this system were to break down, the resulting chaos would not be a pretty place. The government must exist in the form of courts and law enforcements to preserve (or change, if that is desired) the system.

Next, the government exists as an alternative to our market system should the market system fail. It does fail, and fails often, typically due to free-rider problems. The government also has a duty to ensure the market provides a sufficient number of the basic resources required for life (food, shelter, etc.).

Third, the government exists to defend us militarily from outsiders. I am for the most part satisfied with the way my country works. I would not want my country to be over run and destabilized by foreigners with their own ideas, whether they be Islamo-Fascists, neoconservatives, Stalinists, a Mongolian Horde, or Martians. Any change to the system should be affected democratically, not by force of arms.

An extension of this point deals with peacekeeping. There are many nations in the world that do not enjoy our level of stability. Should the people or government of the people desire our help, the government should at least consider taking military action.



(The tricky thing is to determine what is in the best interest of various parties, but that's a whole other discussion )

 

[Bill3000]

It is here to control us. I personally don't believe in it.

You planning on moving out of Sweden, then?

 

[AL_DA_GREAT]

You planning on moving out of Sweden, then?

I would like to. When I am 18. But there is no country with politics that I like.

 

[Atropos]

Note I never said it had to be nationalized. Just that the government should provide telecommunications by any means necessary. Heavily regulated/subsidized industry.

Oh, I see. I've had some bad experiences with national telecommunications companies (one of which dug up the streets around my parents' place and left them that way for months, causing the neighborhood to look like a cross between a duststorm in the Sahel and a First World War dugout).

Giving start up loans to business's, changing the interest rate etc. To keep things like inflation from spiraling out of control.

Regarding the start up loans, venture capitalists tend to do that quite well.

Yes, everyone should be paid at least enough so that they can afford food+room & board+transportation

I don't know that I agree, but that's too broad a topic for this thread, I think.

Exactly

Please look up the business history of the Xbox. Gates is getting soaked for billions.

That theme is just way to common... If only we good agree more often

Actually, I would say that we do agree on most things, judged by historical standards. We agree that government should be big enough to provide a police force (unknown prior to the nineteenth century) but not so big that it regulates the number of times a married couple should have sex (as was done in ancient Athens).

 

[Phlegmak]

I would like to. When I am 18. But there is no country with politics that I like.

Easter Island? Papua New Guinea? Pitcairn Island?

 

[aneeshm]

The government exists to do two things:

a) Provide a centre, something for people to rally around, something which brings order, to make society constantly move towards more and more non-coercive order and
b) To protect the rights of individuals.


These two are essentially the same, only on different scales.

 

[Bill3000]

I would like to. When I am 18. But there is no country with politics that I like.

Try Somalia! Can't get better for no government than anarchy!