What is your least favorite BNW civilization

Least Favorite New Civ

  • Assyria

    Votes: 20 5.2%
  • Brazil

    Votes: 43 11.1%
  • Morocco

    Votes: 24 6.2%
  • Indonesia

    Votes: 34 8.8%
  • Poland

    Votes: 38 9.8%
  • Portugal

    Votes: 19 4.9%
  • The Shoshone

    Votes: 39 10.1%
  • The Zulus

    Votes: 99 25.5%
  • Venice

    Votes: 72 18.6%

  • Total voters
    388
I voted Venice. I think I will have fun with them on Deity but I just don't see a point in having them. Another European civ, with restrictive and too gimmicky mechanics. Not a fan of it not having a city list other than Venice either. Not a fan of its color scheme and frankly the leader screen disappoints me

Easily the most meh civ to me in this expansion
 
...Venice. ...restrictive and too gimmicky mechanics. ...Not a fan of its color scheme and frankly the leader screen disappoints me

I completely agree with these points. I would have also voted Venice, but I find Brazil's inclusion lack-luster. I just have the feeling with the late game ua/uu, Pedro will be programmed to sit there and build culture while he watches me steam roll his empire early with my Impi.
 
First I don't hate any civ that's coming. I would probably choose some different ones, but I'm ok with the ones we get.
And all the new leader heads look amazing in my opinion.
Play style is something different though, so I base this least favorite on that alone.
I like to build settlers, make huge empire and go for a culture or science victory. I'm no warmonger so the Zulu wouldn't be my favorites to play but the idea of not being able to get settlers and only puppet cs is not my idea of a fun game. So Venice will be based on that my least favorite civ to play as. I'll try them out just like I did with every other civ so far and maybe they surprise me.
But anyway I don't think any civ that is coming in the game will take over the spot of the Huns as my least favorite civ (only thing I like about them is the leaderhead)
 
Zulu, as they keep coming back just for tradition sake, without giving chance to other sub saharian civs.

I understand your sentiment - I want African civs more than any other part of the world - but I feel like the problem isn't the Zulu being in (lots of casual players love warfare, so they help serve that market); the problem is Firaxis (commercial) decision to under-represent (at least geographically) sub-Saharan Africa.

Zulu in doesn't mean Kongo out. But Poland in, and Venice in, and Portugal in, and... well you get my point. Europe - I'm looking at you!
 
The Zulu, as they're just a generic warmongering Civ. They don't really have a lot of flavour to them. Assyria, they warmonger with flavour. The Aztec, they warmonger with flavour. The Zulu, well, they JUST warmonger.
 
The Zulu, as they're just a generic warmongering Civ. They don't really have a lot of flavour to them. Assyria, they warmonger with flavour. The Aztec, they warmonger with flavour. The Zulu, well, they JUST warmonger.

Hey... There's nothing wrong with JUST warmongering.
 
It's funny that I can actually understand everyone's objections in this thread!

For me it's Poland, and I'm sad it's Poland. I like new civs, I'm glad Poland gets represented, but the UA doesn't grab me. Assyria doesn't wow me either, but I think there are too many Euro civs, and Poland is the least interesting to play for my games tastes.

I don't think Poland is the weakest/worst (Indonesia maybe?), but all the rest of the civs grab me for one reason or another:

Assyria - colours, reasonably interesting UA, siege towers
Brazil - A rising power with lots of cultural influence (at least, when it comes to soccer, music, and Carnival)
Indonesia - UA, UA, UA! Also from an under-represented part of the world.
Morocco - I love desert play
Portugal - Not big on Euro civs, but I love the UA
Shoshone - Much love for indigenous nations of North America. Colours. Pathfinder.
Venice - Only because the UA was a cool risk for Firaxis to take, and fits Venice perfectly.
Zulu - The civ I love to hate. We have a score to settle going back 20 years. And newbs/casual players who love war like them. Also, colours.
 
I actually like Portugal as a European civ. I would totally be alright too if they replaced Assyria or Venice with Hungary.
 
Tough to say. Overall there isn't a Civ I abhor. Ok with all the additions. Elements of each I'm not fond of...

Assyria - Good enough.

Brazil - Inclusion feels forced. Hoping it will be a Sweden type Civ with subtle gameplay options. Guess it all depends on how tourism/culture play out.

Morocco - They're blending into the sands...

Indonesia - Expecting a Polynesia experience. Very excited to try out the UA/UU. Hoping it will somehow come together.

Poland - The one I will likely play first if I don't do a random roll. Like social policies, hopefully they'll be the new old France. Hoping the UU offers interesting options. Without having played them, wouldn't miss them if they were gone.

Portugal - Lost in the shuffle for me...

The Shoshone - Like scouting. Like the UA. Good with the Civ selection. Like it.

Venice - VERY interesting UA. Good novelty Civ. I like it. Could have the "Hun Syndrome".

The Zulus - The winner. Didn't roll Huns for months. Read threads about how great they were. Rolled them, went on rampage. Rolled them a 2nd time, got the ruin upgrade to battering ram. Went on rampage. Joined in the thread saying "wow, thats fun". 4 rolls, never finished a game with them. I expect Zulu will be the same. Will enjoy taking the test drive, but wouldn't buy it.
 
To be fair though, Venice do start with a massive coastal start bias; is any ocean to speak of at all, Venice will start next to it, and seeing as sea trade is twice as good as land trade, and that Venice gets double routes, it should dominate the economic civs. The only problem is that Venice can easily be absolutely destroyed if a trade boycott is voted in in the WC with it, but against AI at least, it should have enough money to bribe civs not to let it happen. Also I'm wondering what happens if Venice captures another civ's capital...
 
In general, i like all of the new civs, they are varied enough and with different play choices.

If i had to choose my least favourite...probably Poland, their UA doesn't seem to be interesting enough. But my final opinion will be when I play them all.
 
venice? i don't know why firaxis chose venice...
too many civs in europe.
ua is like trash, uu is what.. just big galleass?
 
Brazil. I didn't like its inclusion before, since a 'modern civ' seems to be wholly at odds with the entire theme of Civilization (America gets special dispensation only because of its huge influence on global development over the past century), coupled with a series of uniques that both seem a very unimaginative way to treat the new mechanics (how should we show off tourism? Oh, just double it) and seems not to represent anything vaguely Brazilian beyond the name. Brazil really feels as though they designed a generic tourism civ and stuck the name "Brazil" to it to try and grab interest from the Brazilian crowd.

Which brings me to my new reason for disliking it: what it represents for the series, based on the reasoning provided in the "how we decided on these civs" article: as a cynical cash-grab because Brazil's now a big video game market; sure, Firaxis is to blame rather than Brazil, but the fact that Brazil is such a poor fit for the game generally and for the mechanics it's been given makes this crass decision-making all the more obvious. The same justification was provided for Indonesia, and it's disappointing that they used the modern name and city list to cash in on that front as well, but mechanically and thematically Indonesia feels a better fit for the game (and is a civ I've long wanted in even if I'm not thrilled about the implementation).

People really like Portugal the way it was designed, which is quite a surprise for me. A mad queen, a generic UA name in Latin, an evidently uninspired UU, the list goes on. Portugal achieved great culture and impressive deeds, but I feel they are oddly represented.

In fairness, there's nothing very serene about the Venetian UA - lots of UA names are poor fits. Maria was a bad choice and, particularly now we know there are more trade civs in BNW, I'd rather have seen an exploration focus for Portugal (the Nau's +1 movement helps, but it's a poor cousin to England, Denmark or Polynesia if you're looking to it as a naval exploration civ). I'd agree their representation isn't great, but it's somewhat tied to Portugal's history (enough that I feel it works), and well "because Portugal".

The Zulu's they are so played out it's almost insulting the lack of creativity.

The Zulu get a free pass for me for one reason only: They've stopped the "Why aren't the Zulus in the game?" threadspam here...

I don't like the requirement of having other religions in your city to gain the added benefit from the UB.

To me, that's the most interesting element - it's one of the few ways Civ V offers a benefit from having multiple religions in a city (a la Civ IV, which was all about maximising number of religions in a city). It promotes an interesting playstyle and makes use of the trade route mechanic indirectly.

People are also looking at it wrong to think you have to have multiple religions or it's a drawback. It costs 20 production more than a temple, has lower maintenance (and doesn't require a shrine), provides a source of faith for which no other civ has a counterpart (and faith buildings are not that common), and provides 4 faith if you just have a candi and a single religion. Oh yes, and as an afterthought it produces Great People 25% faster, which may become very important with the new tourism-linked Great People. That is huge in its own right, whether or not you play to maximise its effect.

The UU also seems a bit weak.. I mean, how much desert is there on a standard civ map?

Isn't it a lot cheaper than Cavalry? Plus it gets a bonus in friendly territory, not just in desert. It seems a more flexible, cavalry version of Ethiopia's Mehel Seferi, somewhat bland but a rather strong unit. I haven't seen any UUs in the expansion, except possibly the Impi, which are likely to be better (relative to the unit they replace) than Berber Cavalry.
 
Which brings me to my new reason for disliking it: what it represents for the series, based on the reasoning provided in the "how we decided on these civs" article: as a cynical cash-grab because Brazil's now a big video game market;

*you* are the one being cynical. you're choosing to interpret what Firaxis (and the article) said in the most negative way because you're not happy with Firaxis's choices.

EDIT: sorry. the part i edited out was even more troll-y than what i kept.
 
It's not about what the player is able to do. Any player can win any victory with any civ without even knowing their unique ability.

It's about the civ having a compelling identity. Portugal excels at diplomatic victories. The Zulu dominates the...Well, the domination business. These are aspects of the Civ's identities. A Civ that doesn't have that has that much less to define them.

The Shoshone make a lot more sense given the reasoning provided in the civ design article, but it's telling that they need that context to give them that identity.

I'm leaning towards the idea that Civ 6 should include some "AI only" civs which are there to present certain dilemmas that represent external factors the major (player) civs have to take into account. The Huns would be one ideal candidate (if their AI substantially improves), as an external threat; the Shoshone or something like them another, presenting the dilemma the designers were after regarding whether you should land-grab from a peaceful but extensive faction.
 
*you* are the one being cynical. you're choosing to interpret what Firaxis (and the article) said in the most negative way because you're not happy with Firaxis's choices.

I'm going to disagree with your post. I (easily) voted for Zulu and kinda just told myself that the rest were good, except for a kinda boring Poland. PhilBowles' argument reminds me of my original thoughts on Brazil. The UA isn't very interesting. The pracinhas aren't very notable in history, and their in game effects seem to reflect that. No one wants their UU to be a short-lived GW Infantry. Brazil, as a civilization hasn't affected the world in the same magnitude as Venice, Portugal, Morocco, and Indonesia have. I'm glad that Latin America gets a representative, but I do think that Brazil's inclusion is fuelled by Firaxis wanting to pull in consumers from Brazil and Latin America.

My pick is still the Zulu. Their UA robs Germany. Their historical relevance is laughable, and I think we have enough warmongers. They add nothing onto the diplo, cultural, and trade mechanics added in BNW. It's embarrassing that some Civ fans feel that the game is incomplete without the Zulu.

EDIT: I'm also not crazy about Shoshone, but I'll cut the devs some slack as it's just the understudy for what could have been an awesome Pueblo civ.
 
To be honest, the only civ I'm super excited about is Morocco. The others either don't appeal to me game play wise or are just disappointing picks. I'll play through them once for the achievements and go back to my old favorites. Maybe I'll be surprised, in fact I really hope I am.
 
I'm going to disagree with your post. I (easily) voted for Zulu and kinda just told myself that the rest were good, except for a kinda boring Poland. PhilBowles' argument reminds me of my original thoughts on Brazil. The UA isn't very interesting. The pracinhas aren't very notable in history, and their in game effects seem to reflect that. No one wants their UU to be a short-lived GW Infantry. Brazil, as a civilization hasn't affected the world in the same magnitude as Venice, Portugal, Morocco, and Indonesia have. I'm glad that Latin America gets a representative, but I do think that Brazil's inclusion is fuelled by Firaxis wanting to pull in consumers from Brazil and Latin America.

the funny thing is that i voted for Brazil as my least favorite civ, too. but there's a difference between saying that you don't like something being in the game and making claims about Firaxis's intentions as a whole.

maybe i'm just getting fed up because there have been so many posts that have been like "i don't like some aspect of BNW, therefore the developers must be ignorant/prejudice/whatever."
 
Indonesia by a huge margin. I love cohesive civs, and Indonesia is both not cohesive and made up of individually poor elements. A religious building too weak and too late to win the religion race (or even come second, third, or fourth), an unreliable UU based on one of the worst unit types in the game, and a map-specific UA do not work well together, particularly when all three uniques require separate tech paths. Early happiness will help them get their empire up and running, which likely means they'll be far from the worst civ, but there's a major difference between being viable and being fun. Indonesia does not sound fun.

That said, they're only my least favorite before trying them. I hope to change my mind when I get to play them.
 
Venice since it makes you play in one way and no others. Their UU's are blandly named and have quite boring abilities. The design is also counterintuitive: You need to conquer City States to start and later other cities which will deprive you of trading partners for your double trade routes.

This isn't how it works. Trade routes can be domestic, and domestic trade routes give you options for production and - very powerfully - food trade. Nothing says Venice has to rely on international trade; in fact it has the only trade route UA that isn't explicitly linked to international trade.

Venice doesn't lose options by capturing cities, instead it trades the ability to farm gold for the ability to siphon food or hammers to the capital, and in very large numbers. With the free Merchant at Optics (not mentioned in the UA text, but reported repeatedly, including in interviews with the designers), they can very quickly grab an early CS and have a massive early boost to city growth in the capital.
 
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