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When do you decide what victory to go for?

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Strategy & Tips' started by salty mud, Jun 14, 2015.

  1. salty mud

    salty mud Ey-up

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    I tend to lock myself into a certain playstyle before I even start the game. I generally plan things like "I'll play aggressive as Hannibal or Genghis" or "I'll rapidly expand as Justinian/Joao to make the most of the Imperialistic trait." I never seem to go for other victories such as Cultural or Diplomatic. Nearly always Domination or Scientific victories.

    I would like to try and win a cultural game but this seems to be need to be planned from the start because an immense amount of culture is needed. It would be too late to say "I'll try for culture" half way into the game.
     
  2. oranje willem

    oranje willem Prince

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    It depends on the map. In general, if it's possible without any intercontinental warfare I tend to go for domination/conquest victory, because it's the easiest way to guarantee a win. If this is not the case I usually go for space race. Even then I will often make sure to have enough land through warfare to be sure to win.

    I sometimes win by diplomacy, but not planned. I don't really go for cultural at all, because I find it kinda boring. You just have to end turn all game.
     
  3. Pangaea

    Pangaea Rock N Roller

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    I've tried Cultural a few times, but always regret it because it terribly boring. As oranje said, it ends up with "Hit end turn X times", and that's not very fun. Conquest or domination is more fun, especially on a Pangaea-like map, as it's easy and straight forward. I find Space a lot of fun too actually, because it's very demanding if you want a good date, but it can also be terribly time consuming and somewhat boring.

    Generally I don't start games with a victory condition in mind, unless playing for the Hall of Fame, but I will try to take into account unique units or buildings and otherwise traits when making early decisions. For instance, if you are Egypt, it makes sense to try to utilise the War Chariot, because it's a fantastic unit. If that goes well, the game can easily go on to a Conquest or Domination pursuit, but I don't necessarily start out the game with that as the goal. It is a lot easier to go for those victory conditions than the others, however, because at some point you can basically just whip units until you run out of stuff to kill.
     
  4. elitetroops

    elitetroops Deity

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    Culture doesn't have to be boring, not if you're aiming for a good date. It's mostly about optimizing GP management and city builds, so I guess it depends how much you enjoy that...

    You don't have to plan with culture from the start. The early game doesn't differ much from other games. Early on it's still about expansion, developing your economy and teching. You only need to start planning for culture when it's time to build the marble wonders. Usually around the same time you are ready to start spamming temples for the cathedrals. As long as you at least get the Sistine chapel, you're good to go. Preferably also get Parthenon and MoM.
     
  5. Pangaea

    Pangaea Rock N Roller

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    I don't utterly hate micro management and planning, but the few times I've played for culture I was almost bored to tears, so I don't plan to do that too frequently ;)
     
  6. elitetroops

    elitetroops Deity

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    Yeah, I can see why some people would find it boring. As culture games often don't include much warfare, there tends to be very little elements of surprise. If you handle diplomacy well, the game can be very predictable.
     
  7. civfanchambers

    civfanchambers Prince

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    It won't get you the fastest culture victory, but playing as Qin of the Chinese will allow you to spice up a culture game with a little warfare. Qin's industrious trait lets you build the wonders you need. The Chinese UB helps producing culture. And the Chinese UU makes for some good warfare. The cho-ku-nu is my favorite unit. As I said, going for a war about 1/3 of the way thru the game will slow down your victory, but does help to alleviate some of the culture game boredom. Plus I find the Chinese UU holds onto alot of its power even after it is technically obsolete. On offense the cho-ku-nu rips thru enemy stacks, so if you are forced into a defensive war, while going for culture you can be covered.
     
  8. Seraiel

    Seraiel Deity

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    The only odd thing I find in culture games, is, when AI doesn't spread it's religion to onesself. Generally I find Cultural Victories very relaxing, very much is demanded to get a really good date on those though, like having Marble, Stone and Copper too, having 3 great city spots, winning the Parthenon and especially the Sixtine Chapel and various other things.

    I like Space Races the most, as in those, one can experience the whole game, not just the small part until Elephants or Cuirrassiers. Good Domination or Conquest games sometimes are very demanding too, but there's also so much RNG in them.
     
  9. elitetroops

    elitetroops Deity

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    I wonder how much you could aid culture by playing more aggressively. Seeing how in the current G-Major you guys have Sushi and 50 cities in the BCs, I think that could be quite a solid base for a strong culture game as well... The added culture from sushi, combined with sushi powered artist spamming, should more than make up for the delayed temples and cathedrals. Sushi costs shouldn't be a problem as you don't need to tech anything more after that.
     
  10. aitkensam

    aitkensam Warlord

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    Maybe sushi and a ton of cities could speed up culture on epic/marathon but I feel like it would be tough be get it to work on normal speed.

    For VCs. When I was mostly playing S&T games, I almost always went for conq/dom so that was decided before the start. Nowadays I am enjoying HOF, so also decide VC before the start, but the type is more varied. :)

    I guess the only reason I would choose a VC later than 4000BC would be if I was in a really hard game and couldn't find a way to get conq/dom.
     
  11. Seraiel

    Seraiel Deity

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    I also thought about a Cultural Victory with Sushi once. I doubt it'll be faster than a traditional one, which from my experience could already happen at 1100 AD. Sushi is a long way from Liberalism, and one would need to have really very many resources so that it even has the chance to make up for the delay on producing :culture: .

    I btw. missed the topic of the thread. I'm also a HoFer, so I choose my Victory Conditions when creating the map ;) .
     
  12. Kallikrates

    Kallikrates Prince

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    Probably one of the first 10 games or so I played on Vanilla noble or prince (and I really sucked then because I didn't know yet what was important in the game and could not shake off Civ II habits) I chose Caesar because I wanted to make use of Praetorians. Of course I was isolated! (until some coastal border pops). I think I gave up that game... Since then I try not to decide to early what I will do. Space is the most demanding, culture is often kind of boring (I never got into a culture game early enough to manage a medieval win), domination is often decided rather early on (or can also get kind of boring with intercontinental invasions).
     
  13. Lennier

    Lennier Emperor

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    I usually default to going for domination. If I can get a diplo victory along the way, I'll grab it before the tedium of doing the final war or two to get to the domination limit.

    My first Monarch game I ended up going culture rather late. After going on a conquering spree, my empire was spread out in little pockets all over the map and was a little shy of the dom limit, but all the independent civilizations left (including mine) were in a Hindu love-fest, so I figured declaring on anyone would get me dog-piled and my empire wasn't defensible against that. I also came up just shy in the diplo-win votes (both AP and UN). (Looking back on it, I should have gifted a small city to one of the civs that was close to voting for me, but, oh well.) So it boiled down to culture or space. I figured culture would end quicker and did that. I amused myself by spreading Sushi and Mining around my civ.
     
  14. Mizar

    Mizar IM

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    This, + I normally add houserules for specific games, like when and how I'm allowed to declare war.
     
  15. elmurcis

    elmurcis Emperor

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    I usually don't go for specific win (not because I couldn't but... it make more pressure). Its just - if I see option for war, I go for it... if I manage to keep some tech lead, I still will try to attack someone (same time going to UN diplo or Space).
    But I play with some small challenge sometimes.. for example - build Pyramids and run US forever (buy+whip actually has good combo when you "can't use Rep)
     
  16. civvver

    civvver Deity

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    I always go for domination or conquest. Space is like a backup plan if I accidentally tech too far while letting AI catch up, like if I beeline tanks and they already have rocketry and anti tanks WHOOPS cus those wars suck so I'll just continue on to space.

    Also, I'm about to lose an immortal game cus I went on the war path too late and ghandi and cyrus are going to launch spaceships in my face. I'm cutting through everyone on my continent like butter but I think I'm going to be a couple percentage points short of domination. I could've easily won space but it's too late now.

    I *might* be able to pull out a diplo victory if I conquer my entire continent but we have roughly half the pop and the other continent is a huge religious block who is never going my way.

    I never go for culture, it's a very specific game plan which I just don't like to use.
     
  17. 6K Man

    6K Man Bureaucrat

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    I start every game with the intention to win by Domination. And usually by the early modern period, I get sick of moving 100s of units around, and decide to beeline space or diplomation instead to get the game over with (and on to the next one).
     
  18. FlyingSwan

    FlyingSwan King

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    If going culture Ive usually decided by the time the 1st workers out.Bieng able to settle on stone is a great advantage for the early wonders-stone henge/pyramids.Having marble in the near vincinity is also a must if you want a good victory date.Civ traits/UBs also influence the decision.IND or PHI the best,CRE quite good too.

    Its perfectly possible to go for a late CV with sids sushi,I got one by mistake while going for a Time victory once.As long as you own the sistine chapel the AIs will struggle to get a CV giving you plenty of time to do so-at EMP level the AIs wont be launching a SS till 1900-1950AD.
     
  19. Kallikrates

    Kallikrates Prince

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    Culture without PHI and marble kind of sucks. I did some without those traits (when I played some of the "lonely" maps) but one needs a little luck, hopefully one or two great engineers (sistina and taj). The worst thing with isolation is that one does not get three religions soon enough. One can with some luck found Conf and Tao (as these techs are essential anyway) but I do not go out of my way to get Islam as well. Either make do with to religions or "import" one post astro.
     

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