When is the earliest you take a RA?

[markovnikov]

And that's exactly why Piety is preferable in domination games. AI will turn on you anyway and you won't have many RA partners. You don't lose too much. Late conquest still justifies Rationalism, though. BTW, as Askia you can always plop courthouses, if you don't mind the cheesiness.

This is what I'm finding. After taking declaring against a couple of Civs, the rest of the world is now hostile, so not much chance of RAs once the current round expires. Although in a fit of madness, I did agree to be friends with Russia who was next on my hit list- don't know what I was thinking. Live and learn.

Off topic, but why is rush buying Courthouses cheese? Seems perfectly reasonable to me.

 

[Barth]

They're bugged and provide more happiness than they're supposed to.

 

[vexing]

My suspicion is that any given AI civ's SP path is pretty much pre-determined and programmed to leverage its Special Ability

a player should never be beaten to the porcelain tower if they're going for it. it's deep enough in the tech tree that it can be near guaranteed, and late enough that an engineer can be produced via liberty or hagia sophia.

ai actions are determined by flavors which are coded in the xml. the rationalism opener for example has flavor spaceship: 15 and flavor science: 5.
catherine is defined as having a base flavor spaceship: 9 and science: 8, so she has the strongest likelihood of picking rationalism. the game might assign 175 weight to the choice (9*15+8*5), whereas genghis with his spaceship: 5 and science: 4 rankings might put only 95 weight into choosing rationalism.

what really matters though is the comparison to other policy choices, like the commerce opener with its 20 flavor gold. catherine's flavor gold: 5 gives the commerce opener only 100 weight, and she is therefore much more likely to choose rationalism.

the flavors are modified by a degree each game, and there's probably some additional randomness in the choices, but yeah they do tend to follow patterns.

anyway, that's how i understand ai actions though it's a bit off topic.
the point remains. you shouldn't worry about the AIs gains, yours are always going to be better. plus if you don't sign that RA with an ai, they might just use the gold to sign an RA with a different ai.

 

[The Pilgrim]

When I say I struggled with happiness, it wasn't that big a deal because I had expanded enough that my happiness didn't matter--I was still teching more quickly than the AIs, and obviously my army was hugely powerful. I didn't do rationalism so much for the RA bonus as for the beaker bonus with trading posts (HUGE when you have a big puppet empire) and the 2 free techs from Scientific Revolution.

Rationalism also gives +1 happiness per University and Public School, so unless you have Monasteries that's the same amount of happiness as Organized Religion, though public schools and universities come later than temples and monuments.

Sure, if you manage to deal with unhappiness, why not. On higher level you usually cannot do that. So other moves are necessary. In addition to coming late (especially schools, very close to Order unlocking) universities and public schools are expensive. There is no much point to build them in low-pop trade post spamming cities. When monuments and temples fit easily. And puppets love them as well.
Strategy you describe worked for me on continents map. Less hostility after early rushes and enough RA partners to consider Rationalism to be worthwhile. On pangaea unless I conquered/built Notre Dame + have some crazy mix of luxuries or/and grabbed FoY within my borders, I'd go Piety. There is no other way. You'll compensate missing the TP bonus by higher population.

 

[Poopin Thelift]

universities and public schools are expensive. There is no much point to build them in low-pop trade post spamming cities. When monuments and temples fit easily. And puppets love them as well.

This. In my experience Piety fits well with a warmongering Askia (mud temples!).

 

[qemist]

this is a completely unwarranted fear, especially considering the AI isn't likely to have any of the three things a player will: a strong median tech, rationalism and porcelain tower.

because deity players always reload/reroll until thet get the PT, right?

 

[vexing]

if you prioritize education and getting a GE, you won't be beat.

 

[CultureManiac]

RA's become increasingly more essential as you advance above King level. I would suggest careful management of your tech tree if you're going to sign a lot of RA's because although you're advancing your tech via RA's so are your AI partners.

I used to worry about this as well, then I realized that not accepting an RA from the AI doesn't stop them from getting one, it just means they will get an RA with another civ. It's better that you get one tech and an AI gets one tech, than two AIs get a tech each and you get none.

 

[The Pilgrim]

I used to worry about this as well, then I realized that not accepting an RA from the AI doesn't stop them from getting one, it just means they will get an RA with another civ. It's better that you get one tech and an AI gets one tech, than two AIs get a tech each and you get none.

I used to be afraid to trade with AI in any way. I though AI gains too much power. Took me a long time to realize that whatever advantage it gets, it 'knows' very little about how to use it to its benefit. Especially in Civ5.

 

[binhthuy71]

I used to worry about this as well, then I realized that not accepting an RA from the AI doesn't stop them from getting one, it just means they will get an RA with another civ. It's better that you get one tech and an AI gets one tech, than two AIs get a tech each and you get none.

True that. I think that I have some leftover paranoia from CiIII and CiIV where if one AI had a tech they all had it by the next turn.

 

[Lexicus]

I used to be afraid to trade with AI in any way. I though AI gains too much power. Took me a long time to realize that whatever advantage it gets, it 'knows' very little about how to use it to its benefit. Especially in Civ5.

Agreed entirely. Anything that benefits you and the AI equally on paper is a net gain for you. And since RAs should be benefiting you on paper more than the AI if you have PT and/or Rationalism...well, you do the math.

This. In my experience Piety fits well with a warmongering Askia (mud temples!).

Huh. And here I didn't even thing about the synergy between Piety and Mud Temples...shame on me.

Sure, if you manage to deal with unhappiness, why not. On higher level you usually cannot do that. So other moves are necessary. In addition to coming late (especially schools, very close to Order unlocking) universities and public schools are expensive. There is no much point to build them in low-pop trade post spamming cities. When monuments and temples fit easily. And puppets love them as well.

This is true; I didn't take into account puppets. I suppose the one thing that's worth pointing out is that my "wide" empires are never properly executed--each city always has way too much population because I'm too lazy to micromanage properly. So the science benefits are alright, if not as good as they could be in cities of a tall empire.